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View Full Version : Tarvaris: System or natural ability?



COJOMAY
09-14-2008, 08:33 AM
http://www.dailynorseman.com/2008/9/13/613604/tarvaris-system-or-natural

An excellent blog originally found at Vikings War Cry.

The Dropper
09-14-2008, 10:05 AM
So, is Tarvaris really that bad, or does Chilly need to take a shot of Jag before each game and not over think play calling?

Maybe not Jagrmeister, but I would recommend a shot of Aquavit (http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Akvavit). It's a much more traditional drink for Vikings.

Mr Anderson
09-14-2008, 11:49 AM
Jackson has tremendous natural ability, few guys have the arm/leg combination he does.

And I don't think it's the system either.

Wide receivers need to get open, linemen need to pass protect better, then Jackson will complete more balls.

gregair13
09-14-2008, 11:53 AM
natural ability to suck

Freakout
09-14-2008, 11:54 AM
Right now he is starting to remind me of Kordell Stewart.
Praying he changes my mind.
Great athlete but he's no Matt Jones.

jessejames09
09-14-2008, 11:56 AM
I think it's the mental curve, because he certainly has the physical skills. I think he has a hard time leading his receiver, pinpointing his throws, he just doesn't always put the ball in the right place to lead the receiver into open space. It seems like he just wants to make a safe throw every time. I imagine that's something that you only learn by doing it so much, and don't expect him to know now. It the little stuff like that, that he needs improvement in.

I understand Tarvaris could be better with better protection and receivers, but this thread is about TJ.

bleedpurple
09-14-2008, 12:15 PM
his decision making appears to be much improved.. i think his accuracy needs to improve dramatically along with his rhythm it doesn't seem like he has any....

ultravikingfan
09-14-2008, 01:49 PM
The kid just needs a good win.
He does not need to light it up, just a good, game mananged win.

Like today (hopefully)

snowinapril
09-14-2008, 01:58 PM
"ultravikingfan" wrote:


The kid just needs a good win.
He does not need to light it up, just a good, game mananged win.

Like today (hopefully)



A TD pass would be nice.

Caine
09-14-2008, 04:28 PM
"Mr" wrote:


Jackson has tremendous natural ability, few guys have the arm/leg combination he does.

And I don't think it's the system either.

Wide receivers need to get open, linemen need to pass protect better, then Jackson will complete more balls.


Bull pucky!!


Jackson had all day today, and continually threw BEHIND his receivers.
Watch the replays of the 1st half...even the completions are causing thereceiver to turn their bodies away from their direction of travel in order to catch them.


In short, Jackson can't connect in stride worth a piddle.
I saw him do it a couple of times today, but mostly he was behind, or throwing floaters or come-backs.

Jackson hasn't shown me anything yet this season, and while it's very early in the season, I have a feeling he won't be starting next season.

Caine

StillPurple
09-14-2008, 07:34 PM
Glad you guys are coming around !

I have been known on this site as a "Tarvaris hater". I call myself a "realist" with respect to this guy. I actually like Tarvaris, but I think he is a good backup, not a starter.

The Vikings have a bad offensive coaching staff, starting with our Offensive coordinator, Bevell. I am now totally convinced, until this guy goes, we will not see the playoffs, except on TV.

Purple Floyd
09-14-2008, 07:39 PM
"Caine" wrote:


"Mr" wrote:


Jackson has tremendous natural ability, few guys have the arm/leg combination he does.

And I don't think it's the system either.

Wide receivers need to get open, linemen need to pass protect better, then Jackson will complete more balls.


Bull pucky!!


Jackson had all day today, and continually threw BEHIND his receivers.
Watch the replays of the 1st half...even the completions are causing thereceiver to turn their bodies away from their direction of travel in order to catch them.


In short, Jackson can't connect in stride worth a piddle.
I saw him do it a couple of times today, but mostly he was behind, or throwing floaters or come-backs.

Jackson hasn't shown me anything yet this season, and while it's very early in the season, I have a feeling he won't be starting next season.

Caine


Pretty much what I saw

StillPurple
09-14-2008, 08:27 PM
To be honest, I really doubt that this offense can win a game. I think our defense has played well, but I don't think that you can win in the NFL doing the following:

- reducing your playbook to 3 or 4 plays
- having a QB who (as you have mentioned) is not that accurate
- Using your star RB in a very boneheaded way (attacking a stacked box), rather than getting him in space, for example, through screen passes

If you concede these things, it is like you are giving the other team a gift, because it makes their job 10 times easier.

This is, in short, not an offense that can win at the NFL level.

Redmption
09-14-2008, 10:12 PM
I have been trying to stay away from reading any articles online about this game because I am already depressed enough as it is but...

Wow the defense played its heart out for 3 quarters.
But with such a bad offense the Colts had too many chances in the end. I think it is 70/30 System/QB. TJ is streaky and the offense is overthinking itself on passing plays.
Need to call more play action and screens, or more quick route passes like slants or outs, just for completions and keeping the D honnest.

I still have confidence in this team because of the potential if TJ can perform like he was in the preseason. Because 0-2 still means theres 14 more games left, and what does 6-0 under Tice mean if they still missed the playoffs?

Go Vikes

tb04512
09-15-2008, 10:28 AM
I just wanted to say that I don’t think that its so much Tarvaris as it is the coaches and the system,
we’ve had 4 qb’s play in this system and all of them haven’t been able to produce..

We started with Brad Johnson back in ‘06 coming off a 7-2 record (who is supposed to be known for accuracy) ending the Tice era..

Childress comes here with his system and Brad Johnson lays an egg for the season, with chester taylor running for 1200 yards
(so the well we have AP argument is taken away). Then Bollinger plays a couple games lays an egg and then the Jackson era begins, inconsistent play and mediocre numbers were expected with a young QB. but when he got hurt, Holcomb couldn’t win, Bollinger couldn’t win and we went 0-4 when Jackson didn’t play.

The grip on what the offense can do is wayyyy to tight, it seems whenever they let Jackson go out an just play he makes plays, example: last year denver, 2nd half Green Bay game, the last 50 seconds in the half he moves down to get a field goal.
When the lease is off he looks more comfortable, and we wont know what we have if he is not allowed to play, don’t hold him back let him play he will either succeed or fail, but at least we will know what we have.

Dropped passes are also killing this team, people will always remember the bad passes and not the good ones, Shiancoe dropped yet another TD, Berrian dropped a slant early In the game, then tripped on a beautiful deep pass, the no call on a critical third down pass to bobby wade.
It seems if the pass isn’t perfect the receivers cant go get it, but if it is a great pass they drop it.

x-ray jeff
09-15-2008, 10:49 AM
If the coaches have told him not to run, they have misjudged his natural ability. He has looked better on drives that included at least one scramble.

Marrdro
09-15-2008, 10:52 AM
"StillPurple" wrote:


To be honest, I really doubt that this offense can win a game. I think our defense has played well, but I don't think that you can win in the NFL doing the following:

- reducing your playbook to 3 or 4 plays
- having a QB who (as you have mentioned) is not that accurate
- Using your star RB in a very boneheaded way (attacking a stacked box), rather than getting him in space, for example, through screen passes

If you concede these things, it is like you are giving the other team a gift, because it makes their job 10 times easier.

This is, in short, not an offense that can win at the NFL level.

Hey, quick question.....

How many screens did you see them run yesterday?
I saw two that made me want to shit myself and at least 2 more that got blown up before TJ even passed the ball.

Purple Floyd
09-15-2008, 10:56 AM
"Marrdro" wrote:


"StillPurple" wrote:


To be honest, I really doubt that this offense can win a game. I think our defense has played well, but I don't think that you can win in the NFL doing the following:

- reducing your playbook to 3 or 4 plays
- having a QB who (as you have mentioned) is not that accurate
- Using your star RB in a very boneheaded way (attacking a stacked box), rather than getting him in space, for example, through screen passes

If you concede these things, it is like you are giving the other team a gift, because it makes their job 10 times easier.

This is, in short, not an offense that can win at the NFL level.

Hey, quick question.....

How many screens did you see them run yesterday?
I saw two that made me want to shit myself and at least 2 more that got blown up before TJ even passed the ball.


yeah, I was calling for more screens during the week, but when they actually did them on sunday they didn't work for crap. I am not sure if he was the TE for all of the screens but one of them that didn't work was because shank didn't block the defender and they the play got FUBAR.