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singersp
04-23-2008, 06:27 AM
Wilf rolls dice on trade, on Jackson (http://www.startribune.com/sports/vikings/18028514.html)

Jared Allen would be quite a catch for the Vikings, but a team's championship hopes will always live and die with the quarterback.

By Kevin Seifert, Vikings Insider
startribune.com

Last update: April 23, 2008 - 1:33 AM


So in reality, here is what the Vikings were thinking Tuesday night: Tarvaris Jackson will be good enough in 2008 that we feel comfortable making an enormous investment toward winning the Super Bowl right now.....

vikingivan
04-23-2008, 06:54 AM
"singersp" wrote:


Wilf rolls dice on trade, on Jackson (http://www.startribune.com/sports/vikings/18028514.html)

Jared Allen would be quite a catch for the Vikings, but a team's championship hopes will always live and die with the quarterback.

By Kevin Seifert, Vikings Insider
startribune.com

Last update: April 23, 2008 - 1:33 AM


So in reality, here is what the Vikings were thinking Tuesday night: Tarvaris Jackson will be good enough in 2008 that we feel comfortable making an enormous investment toward winning the Super Bowl right now.....


I sure hope that he is.
He has the best running back tandem in the NFL to compliment him.
He has his deep threat in Berrian now.
He is backed by one of the best defenses in the NFL.
It is all on TJack now.
Let's hope he can do it.

Purple Floyd
04-23-2008, 06:58 AM
If he isn't, we are at least in the best shape at backup we have been since the ownership change.


It is refreshing not going into the season with the likes of McMahon, O'Sullivan,Bollinger,Holcolm etc. as the guys competing for the 1 and 2 spots.

Marrdro
04-23-2008, 07:11 AM
Still find it funny that we see stuff like this.

Arguably the best moment in time for he Vikes in a while and we go beat a dead horse.

Of course he will be better.
The team won 8 games with him under center last year in a throw away year designed to get him reps/experience right along with the other youngsters.

He is up in Winter Park as we speak burning the midnight oil looking at game film with the coaches and and throwing/working with his recievers.

What the hell more do they want out of the kid.
Brother.
>:(

BleedinPandG
04-23-2008, 07:27 AM
"Marrdro" wrote:


Still find it funny that we see stuff like this.

Arguably the best moment in time for he Vikes in a while and we go beat a dead horse.

Of course he will be better.
The team won 8 games with him under center last year in a throw away year designed to get him reps/experience right along with the other youngsters.

He is up in Winter Park as we speak burning the midnight oil looking at game film with the coaches and and throwing/working with his recievers.

What the hell more do they want out of the kid.
Brother.
>:(


LOL, I couldn't agree with you more...

Remember, the people who are best able to judge TJack's ability (the Vikes coaches/FO) are the same people who just went out and signed 3 BIG name FA's.
The Vikes have broken open the piggy bank.
They wouldn't have done that if they believed this was a throw away year like last year (remember how inactive we were last year).
To me, that says the people that know TJack's abilities and progress best, are the same people who spent this money, indicating they believe we can win this year, and I believe we can win a LOT this year.
SB here we come!

vikingivan
04-23-2008, 07:32 AM
"BleedinPandG" wrote:


"Marrdro" wrote:


Still find it funny that we see stuff like this.

Arguably the best moment in time for he Vikes in a while and we go beat a dead horse.

Of course he will be better.
The team won 8 games with him under center last year in a throw away year designed to get him reps/experience right along with the other youngsters.

He is up in Winter Park as we speak burning the midnight oil looking at game film with the coaches and and throwing/working with his recievers.

What the hell more do they want out of the kid.
Brother.

>:(


LOL, I couldn't agree with you more...

Remember, the people who are best able to judge TJack's ability (the Vikes coaches/FO) are the same people who just went out and signed 3 BIG name FA's.
The Vikes have broken open the piggy bank.
They wouldn't have done that if they believed this was a throw away year like last year (remember how inactive we were last year).
To me, that says the people that know TJack's abilities and progress best, are the same people who spent this money, indicating they believe we can win this year, and I believe we can win a LOT this year.
SB here we come!


Inactive or inept?
For the money they spent on Shiancoe last season the Vikings could have gotten someone that could have actually helped the team.

achilton87
04-23-2008, 07:33 AM
Does anyone remember not long ago when the Bears fielded Rex Grossman as the quarterback and Berrian as reciever? They didnt win but they got to the super bowl.


Lets see how the season starts out...

I for one think we made a good trade (if he doesnt think that he can slow down now because he got the money).

Marrdro
04-23-2008, 07:35 AM
"vikingivan" wrote:


"BleedinPandG" wrote:


"Marrdro" wrote:


Still find it funny that we see stuff like this.

Arguably the best moment in time for he Vikes in a while and we go beat a dead horse.

Of course he will be better.
The team won 8 games with him under center last year in a throw away year designed to get him reps/experience right along with the other youngsters.

He is up in Winter Park as we speak burning the midnight oil looking at game film with the coaches and and throwing/working with his recievers.

What the hell more do they want out of the kid.
Brother.

>:(


LOL, I couldn't agree with you more...

Remember, the people who are best able to judge TJack's ability (the Vikes coaches/FO) are the same people who just went out and signed 3 BIG name FA's.
The Vikes have broken open the piggy bank.
They wouldn't have done that if they believed this was a throw away year like last year (remember how inactive we were last year).
To me, that says the people that know TJack's abilities and progress best, are the same people who spent this money, indicating they believe we can win this year, and I believe we can win a LOT this year.
SB here we come!


Inactive or inept?
For the money they spent on Shiancoe last season the Vikings could have gotten someone that could have actually helped the team.

And you don't think that maybe just maybe the OL issues last year along with the fact that he was in a new system might have skewed his output a bit?

I do.
Shanc with be fine this year.

singersp
04-23-2008, 08:15 AM
"Marrdro" wrote:


Still find it funny that we see stuff like this.

Arguably the best moment in time for he Vikes in a while and we go beat a dead horse.

Of course he will be better.
The team won 8 games with him under center last year in a throw away year designed to get him reps/experience right along with the other youngsters.

He is up in Winter Park as we speak burning the midnight oil looking at game film with the coaches and and throwing/working with his recievers.

What the hell more do they want out of the kid.
Brother.
>:(


LOL! You derived all that out of this?


Jackson has been hard at work all offseason, working on his decision-making and learning to avoid turnovers.

http://i16.photobucket.com/albums/b21/singersp82759/smilies/MV.png

NodakPaul
04-23-2008, 08:17 AM
"UffDaVikes" wrote:


If he isn't, we are at least in the best shape at backup we have been since the ownership change.


It is refreshing not going into the season with the likes of McMahon, O'Sullivan,Bollinger,Holcolm etc. as the guys competing for the 1 and 2 spots.


Absolutely!
+1

Marrdro
04-23-2008, 08:17 AM
"singersp" wrote:


"Marrdro" wrote:


Still find it funny that we see stuff like this.

Arguably the best moment in time for he Vikes in a while and we go beat a dead horse.

Of course he will be better.
The team won 8 games with him under center last year in a throw away year designed to get him reps/experience right along with the other youngsters.

He is up in Winter Park as we speak burning the midnight oil looking at game film with the coaches and and throwing/working with his recievers.

What the hell more do they want out of the kid.
Brother.

>:(


LOL! You derived all that out of this?


Jackson has been hard at work all offseason, working on his decision-making and learning to avoid turnovers.

http://i16.photobucket.com/albums/b21/singersp82759/smilies/MV.png

Of course. I need to find a place to host the MV smiley other than photobucket so I can insert it when appropriate.

;D

singersp
04-23-2008, 08:28 AM
"Marrdro" wrote:



Of course. I need to find a place to host the MV smiley other than photobucket so I can insert it when appropriate.

;D


Like I said before, just use the link I gave you & it will host it directly from the site from whence it came.
;)

DaunteHOF
04-23-2008, 11:42 AM
I see him having a similar year as Vince young did last year..playoffs...second round

C Mac D
04-23-2008, 11:49 AM
"DaunteHOF" wrote:


I see him having a similar year as Vince young did last year..playoffs...second round


Vince Young had a pretty crappy year last year. Hopefully T-Jack plays a little better than that. I can see us getting to the NFC Championship.

dcboardr41
04-23-2008, 11:51 AM
"C" wrote:


"DaunteHOF" wrote:


I see him having a similar year as Vince young did last year..playoffs...second round


Vince Young had a pretty crappy year last year. Hopefully T-Jack plays a little better than that. I can see us getting to the NFC Championship.


one of my closest friends is a titans fan, and he loves VY, and i go, he is tarvaris jackson with a bigger pay check and who is tall. They are equal in my book, i actually think TJack will have a better year than VY this year.

C Mac D
04-23-2008, 11:54 AM
"dcboardr41" wrote:


"C" wrote:


"DaunteHOF" wrote:


I see him having a similar year as Vince young did last year..playoffs...second round


Vince Young had a pretty crappy year last year. Hopefully T-Jack plays a little better than that. I can see us getting to the NFC Championship.


one of my closest friends is a titans fan, and he loves VY, and i go, he is tarvaris jackson with a bigger pay check and who is tall. They are equal in my book, i actually think TJack will have a better year than VY this year.


Yeah, definitely...

I think we're going to see a new Vikes team this year... I'm pumped.

I have plenty of confidence in T-Jackson... now I just hope he gets that gap in his teeth fixed.

dcboardr41
04-23-2008, 11:55 AM
"C" wrote:


"dcboardr41" wrote:


"C" wrote:


"DaunteHOF" wrote:


I see him having a similar year as Vince young did last year..playoffs...second round


Vince Young had a pretty crappy year last year. Hopefully T-Jack plays a little better than that. I can see us getting to the NFC Championship.


one of my closest friends is a titans fan, and he loves VY, and i go, he is tarvaris jackson with a bigger pay check and who is tall. They are equal in my book, i actually think TJack will have a better year than VY this year.


Yeah, definitely...

I think we're going to see a new Vikes team this year... I'm pumped.

I have plenty of confidence in T-Jackson... now I just hope he gets that gap in his teeth fixed.


lol
i dont know why, but everytime i see this pic it makes me laugh

http://i257.photobucket.com/albums/hh215/dcboardr41/20070823201509990001.jpg

midgensa
04-23-2008, 12:09 PM
I think that Jackson is ready for the challenge. I am not going to say that if we don't win the Super Bowl this year all is lost, but we definitely need to see some improvement out of T-Jack and the coaches seem to be confident that we will.
I am very much looking forward to the addition of Berrian and Jackson having one more year under his belt. With Berrian stretching the field and one of the best RB tandems in the league (Before jumping on me there, I think Jax may be slightly better) he should be able to have some open looks at players down field ... and he of course was drafted in large part due to his amazing arm strength.
All in all ... I think we have a lot to look forward to.

Schutz
04-23-2008, 12:12 PM
"midgensa" wrote:


I think that Jackson is ready for the challenge. I am not going to say that if we don't win the Super Bowl this year all is lost, but we definitely need to see some improvement out of T-Jack and the coaches seem to be confident that we will.
I am very much looking forward to the addition of Berrian and Jackson having one more year under his belt. With Berrian stretching the field and one of the best RB tandems in the league (Before jumping on me there, I think Jax may be slightly better) he should be able to have some open looks at players down field ... and he of course was drafted in large part due to his amazing arm strength.
All in all ... I think we have a lot to look forward to.


I'm going to be disappointed with anything less than the second round of the playoffs.
We have all the tools and players the FO wants to succeed, so I see no reason as a Viking fan why I shouldn't expect big things this year.
Making the playoffs and going one and done just isn't going to cut it.

marstc09
04-23-2008, 12:16 PM
I don't know about the Super Bowl but it is going to feel good wearing the NFC North Champs t-shirt and cap!

midgensa
04-23-2008, 12:19 PM
"Schutz" wrote:


"midgensa" wrote:


I think that Jackson is ready for the challenge. I am not going to say that if we don't win the Super Bowl this year all is lost, but we definitely need to see some improvement out of T-Jack and the coaches seem to be confident that we will.
I am very much looking forward to the addition of Berrian and Jackson having one more year under his belt. With Berrian stretching the field and one of the best RB tandems in the league (Before jumping on me there, I think Jax may be slightly better) he should be able to have some open looks at players down field ... and he of course was drafted in large part due to his amazing arm strength.
All in all ... I think we have a lot to look forward to.


I'm going to be disappointed with anything less than the second round of the playoffs.
We have all the tools and players the FO wants to succeed, so I see no reason as a Viking fan why I shouldn't expect big things this year.
Making the playoffs and going one and done just isn't going to cut it.


I did not say I didn't expect a solid playoff run. I just think everyone is automatically saying that if we don't get to the Conference Championship game or whatever that it will automatically be T-Jack's fault.
I just say ... we have the tools now. We have a damn good looking team on defense, we have a solid looking team on offense. Let's let it play out before we start blaming T-Jack for the loss we have not had yet.

SKOL
04-23-2008, 12:19 PM
This morning PA & Dubay were talking on KFAN how Jackson quietly put up a QB rating of mid 80's for the second half of last year.


The entire year he averaged 70.8 so that just shows how bad his first half of the season was.
For the first half of the season I had no confidence whatsoever in him, he couldn't throw a completion if his life depended on it, but the second half was a different story.
With another training camp under his belt he'll be just fine.

dcboardr41
04-23-2008, 12:22 PM
"SKOL" wrote:


This morning PA & Dubay were talking on KFAN how Jackson quietly put up a QB rating of mid 80's for the second half of last year.


The entire year he averaged 70.8 so that just shows how bad his first half of the season was.
For the first half of the season I had no confidence whatsoever in him, he couldn't throw a completion if his life depended on it, but the second half was a different story.
With another training camp under his belt he'll be just fine.



i forgot where i saw it, but it was a site that showed the last six weeks qb stats, and tjack was in the top 5 of completion percentage and qb rating. i have faith in him for next year. 2008 NFC North Champs

singersp
04-24-2008, 07:22 AM
Analysis: Minnesota Vikings' defense dominant now, but next season still comes down to quarterback (http://www.twincities.com/vikings/ci_9033357)

Vikings will go as far as Jackson takes them

By Don Seeholzer
dseeholzer@pioneerpress.com
twincities.com

Article Last Updated: 04/24/2008 12:49:06 AM CDT


Even without Jared Allen, the Vikings were a trendy pick as the team to beat in the NFC North this season.....

singersp
04-24-2008, 07:24 AM
TOM POWERS: With talent in place, Minnesota Vikings' fate rests with quarterback Tarvaris Jackson (http://www.twincities.com/vikings/ci_9033356)

With so much talent in place now, Vikings' fortunes rest with quarterback

Pioneer Press
twincities.com

Article Last Updated: 04/24/2008 12:45:25 AM CDT


Hear that sizzling sound? That's Tarvaris Jackson already on the hot seat.....

Prophet
04-24-2008, 07:27 AM
"singersp" wrote:


TOM POWERS: With talent in place, Minnesota Vikings' fate rests with quarterback Tarvaris Jackson (http://www.twincities.com/vikings/ci_9033356)

With so much talent in place now, Vikings' fortunes rest with quarterback

Pioneer Press
twincities.com

Article Last Updated: 04/24/2008 12:45:25 AM CDT


Hear that sizzling sound? That's Tarvaris Jackson already on the hot seat.....




Tom Powers is one of the most myopic sports journalist and one of the worse sports writers I have ever encountered.....and that's saying a lot.

Billy Boy
04-24-2008, 01:40 PM
"Prophet" wrote:


"singersp" wrote:


TOM POWERS: With talent in place, Minnesota Vikings' fate rests with quarterback Tarvaris Jackson (http://www.twincities.com/vikings/ci_9033356)

With so much talent in place now, Vikings' fortunes rest with quarterback

Pioneer Press
twincities.com

Article Last Updated: 04/24/2008 12:45:25 AM CDT


Hear that sizzling sound? That's Tarvaris Jackson already on the hot seat.....




Tom Powers is one of the most myopic sports journalist and one of the worse sports writers I have ever encountered.....and that's saying a lot.


What? How can you not enjoy is aesthetically fluid and linear writing style?

You should at least respect that he is considerate enough to neatly capitalize and insert his name directly into the title so we know who to thank for such great wisdom.

Kinda reminds me of one of the better Simpson episodes..


After reading through a list of ridiculous names Homer gave him, including "Rembrandt Q. Einstein", "Handsome B. Wonderful", and "Hercules Rockefeller", the judge allows him to change his name to "Max Power" (which Homer got off a hair dryer and was the only name he spelled correctly).

P.P.E.
04-24-2008, 01:52 PM
Everybody needs to relax on Jackson.
We have all be sucked into believing that if you dont succeed in the first year of your career that you are a failure.
His rookie season I remember people saying he hadn't even taken snaps with the first offense until his first start in week 16.
He's raw and everybody knew it when we drafted him.
He has shown improvements and by the second half of this upcoming season I think everybody will be happy we drafted him.

Prophet
04-24-2008, 01:54 PM
"P.P.E." wrote:


Everybody needs to relax on Jackson.
We have all be sucked into believing that if you dont succeed in the first year of your career that you are a failure.
His rookie season I remember people saying he hadn't even taken snaps with the first offense until his first start in week 16.
He's raw and everybody knew it when we drafted him.
He has shown improvements and by the second half of this upcoming season I think everybody will be happy we drafted him.



Only the dullest of bulbs expect a person tossed into the starting QB role from a small school to do well his first year.
Most QBs from D1 school's sit on the sidelines for a couple of years before they take the reigns.

HEY
04-24-2008, 02:00 PM
"singersp" wrote:


Analysis: Minnesota Vikings' defense dominant now, but next season still comes down to quarterback (http://www.twincities.com/vikings/ci_9033357)

Vikings will go as far as Jackson takes them

By Don Seeholzer
dseeholzer@pioneerpress.com
twincities.com

Article Last Updated: 04/24/2008 12:49:06 AM CDT


Even without Jared Allen, the Vikings were a trendy pick as the team to beat in the NFC North this season.....


Quote from the article above:

With a proven pass rusher joining two Pro Bowl defensive tackles in Pat and Kevin Williams, the Vikings can lay claim to having the best defensive line in the league — and maybe the best defense, period.

Wow, nice words! The scary thing is that it might be true

(scary for Green Bay of course)

Marrdro
04-24-2008, 02:02 PM
"Prophet" wrote:


"P.P.E." wrote:


Everybody needs to relax on Jackson.
We have all be sucked into believing that if you dont succeed in the first year of your career that you are a failure.
His rookie season I remember people saying he hadn't even taken snaps with the first offense until his first start in week 16.
He's raw and everybody knew it when we drafted him.
He has shown improvements and by the second half of this upcoming season I think everybody will be happy we drafted him.



Only the dullest of bulbs expect a person tossed into the starting QB role from a small school to do well his first year.
Most QBs from D1 school's sit on the sidelines for a couple of years before they take the reigns.

I can list you at least 5 Bulbs on this site who refuse to acknowledge that fact.


I won't though cause it would get me sent to hell real quick I bet.
;D

cajunvike
04-24-2008, 02:03 PM
"SKOL" wrote:


This morning PA & Dubay were talking on KFAN how Jackson quietly put up a QB rating of mid 80's for the second half of last year.


The entire year he averaged 70.8 so that just shows how bad his first half of the season was.
For the first half of the season I had no confidence whatsoever in him, he couldn't throw a completion if his life depended on it, but the second half was a different story.
With another training camp under his belt he'll be just fine.


Agreed, O Wise One!
;)

ThorSPL
04-24-2008, 02:15 PM
"cajunvike" wrote:


"SKOL" wrote:


This morning PA & Dubay were talking on KFAN how Jackson quietly put up a QB rating of mid 80's for the second half of last year.


The entire year he averaged 70.8 so that just shows how bad his first half of the season was.
For the first half of the season I had no confidence whatsoever in him, he couldn't throw a completion if his life depended on it, but the second half was a different story.
With another training camp under his belt he'll be just fine.


Agreed, O Wise One!
;)


PLUS he won't have to worry about having so much field to work with this year....

PAvikesfan
04-24-2008, 04:07 PM
"vikingivan" wrote:


"singersp" wrote:


Wilf rolls dice on trade, on Jackson (http://www.startribune.com/sports/vikings/18028514.html)

Jared Allen would be quite a catch for the Vikings, but a team's championship hopes will always live and die with the quarterback.

By Kevin Seifert, Vikings Insider
startribune.com

Last update: April 23, 2008 - 1:33 AM


So in reality, here is what the Vikings were thinking Tuesday night: Tarvaris Jackson will be good enough in 2008 that we feel comfortable making an enormous investment toward winning the Super Bowl right now.....


I sure hope that he is.
He has the best running back tandem in the NFL to compliment him.
He has his deep threat in Berrian now.
He is backed by one of the best defenses in the NFL.
It is all on TJack now.
Let's hope he can do it.


there is NO (correction) superbowl in our next season future.
you are talking as if tavaris now has the tools to win games now that we added berrian and a defensive player.
give me a break.
we will, however, be better...maybe playoff bound sespecially now that the nfc north is so fuzzy now.
SB though....hahahahahahahahahahaha.

Marrdro
04-24-2008, 04:09 PM
"PAvikesfan" wrote:


there is superbowl in our next season future.
you are talking as if tavaris now has the tools to win games now that we added berrian and a defensive player.
give me a break.
we will, however, be better...maybe playoff bound sespecially now that the nfc north is so fuzzy now.
SB though....hahahahahahahahahahaha.

Were have you been hiding of late?

Have you been gone or have I just been missing your posts?

PAvikesfan
04-24-2008, 04:13 PM
"Marrdro" wrote:


"PAvikesfan" wrote:


there is NO superbowl in our next season future.
you are talking as if tavaris now has the tools to win games now that we added berrian and a defensive player.
give me a break.
we will, however, be better...maybe playoff bound sespecially now that the nfc north is so fuzzy now.
SB though....hahahahahahahahahahaha.

Were have you been hiding of late?

Have you been gone or have I just been missing your posts?




very busy.
no time just like the bunny in alice in wonderland...
i post about once every three months but check for new news once a week.
ppo is good like that.

Marrdro
04-24-2008, 04:15 PM
"PAvikesfan" wrote:


"Marrdro" wrote:


"PAvikesfan" wrote:


there is NO superbowl in our next season future.
you are talking as if tavaris now has the tools to win games now that we added berrian and a defensive player.
give me a break.
we will, however, be better...maybe playoff bound sespecially now that the nfc north is so fuzzy now.
SB though....hahahahahahahahahahaha.

Were have you been hiding of late?

Have you been gone or have I just been missing your posts?




very busy.
no time just like the bunny in alice in wonderland...
i post about once every three months but check for new news once a week.
ppo is good like that.

I thought I hadn't seen you in a while.
Checked the ole spread sheet of course and saw that you hadn't been moved in a while.

You better get busy or I will bump you down a column or two.
(JK
;D)
Good to see you around and posting.

vike_mike
04-24-2008, 04:20 PM
Well I don't believe that is true PAvikesfan.
Noone and I mean noone thought ever in their life that the Giants would win the SB before the season started.
We smoked the Giants 42-10 and it should have been worse than that score.
You never know about what is going to happen.
Thank God for the salary cap.

Schutz
04-24-2008, 04:24 PM
"Marrdro" wrote:


"Prophet" wrote:


"P.P.E." wrote:


Everybody needs to relax on Jackson.
We have all be sucked into believing that if you dont succeed in the first year of your career that you are a failure.
His rookie season I remember people saying he hadn't even taken snaps with the first offense until his first start in week 16.
He's raw and everybody knew it when we drafted him.
He has shown improvements and by the second half of this upcoming season I think everybody will be happy we drafted him.



Only the dullest of bulbs expect a person tossed into the starting QB role from a small school to do well his first year.
Most QBs from D1 school's sit on the sidelines for a couple of years before they take the reigns.

I can list you at least 5 Bulbs on this site who refuse to acknowledge that fact.


I won't though cause it would get me sent to hell real quick I bet.
;D


I guess I'm one of those "dull bulb" although funny someone calls someone else a dull bulb, maybe they were looking for dull knife, or dim bulb?
Hmmmm, and I'm the dull bulb.

Marrdro
04-24-2008, 04:25 PM
"vike_mike" wrote:


Well I don't believe that is true PAvikesfan.
Noone and I mean noone thought ever in their life that the Giants would win the SB before the season started.
We smoked the Giants 42-10 and it should have been worse than that score.
You never know about what is going to happen.
Thank God for the salary cap.

Your not trying to say that my friend PA would be ducking us would you?

;D

StillPurple
04-24-2008, 06:03 PM
Right now I have two imaginary little purple gremlins on my shoulders, one on each side. One is saying the following:

- Of course Tarvaris can do it, he has a howitzer arm, and he is learning.
- Up to now, he has not had any receivers to throw to, but that will improve, because he now has Berrian and a more experienced Rice. It will only get better.
- He is mobile and can run for the first down when he needs to
- He understands that he is not Joe Montana, so he doesn't have a huge NFL QB ego, so it will work out
- All he has to do is handoff to Peterson, and then when the defense stacks the box, he hits Berrian deep
- Teams win the Show all the time without a great QB...

The other purple gremlin is yelling the following:
- Tarvaris had a 45 % completion percentage at I-AA college
- He does not have NFL mechanics
- He doesn't make good decisions
- He throws off his back foot too much
- He sometimes seems totally confused
- He gets injured
- Sure he will look good in one or two games (so did Cordell Stewart or Aliki Smith), but over an entire season, he will be very mediocre at best, and when it comes to "crunch time" (the playoffs, against teams that have maybe two weeks to scheme against him, he will be flustered and confused, like in the Redskins game last year...

dcboardr41
04-24-2008, 06:15 PM
"StillPurple" wrote:


Right now I have two imaginary little purple gremlins on my shoulders, one on each side. One is saying the following:

- Of course Tarvaris can do it, he has a howitzer arm, and he is learning.
- Up to now, he has not had any receivers to throw to, but that will improve, because he now has Berrian and a more experienced Rice. It will only get better.
- He is mobile and can run for the first down when he needs to
- He understands that he is not Joe Montana, so he doesn't have a huge NFL QB ego, so it will work out
- All he has to do is handoff to Peterson, and then when the defense stacks the box, he hits Berrian deep
- Teams win the Show all the time without a great QB...

The other purple gremlin is yelling the following:
- Tarvaris had a 45 % completion percentage at I-AA college
- He does not have NFL mechanics
- He doesn't make good decisions
- He throws off his back foot too much
- He sometimes seems totally confused
- He gets injured
- Sure he will look good in one or two games (so did Cordell Stewart or Aliki Smith), but over an entire season, he will be very mediocre at best, and when it comes to "crunch time" (the playoffs, against teams that have maybe two weeks to scheme against him, he will be flustered and confused, like in the Redskins game last year...





ummmm where the hell did you come up with that number


Division I-AA institution in his hometown of Montgomery. During Jackson's senior year, he amassed 2,655 yards, 25 touchdowns, and only 5 interceptions with a 61.1% completion rate. Jackson has been given several nicknames such as T-Jack. In three seasons at Alabama State, Jackson completed 537 of 985 attempts for 7,838 yards, with 67 touchdown passes and 27 interceptions.

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Tarvaris_Jackson

Proud2BPurple
04-24-2008, 06:17 PM
I'm gonna say the same as I have been everytime it gets mentioned with me and my mates. He will be a better player this season. He has invaluble experience from last season and has this off season to work on what was going wrong last time round.
Plus the improvement in his options, Berrian is the obvious name but another year on Sidney Rice will help no end. Im gonna get behind him and, for one, wont be surprised if he does the business next year!

Lets all have Faith!

P2BP

VikesFan4Life
04-24-2008, 06:24 PM
Too early to tell for me.
Too many things have to happen the right way first.

jmcdon00
04-24-2008, 06:34 PM
"StillPurple" wrote:


Right now I have two imaginary little purple gremlins on my shoulders, one on each side. One is saying the following:

- Of course Tarvaris can do it, he has a howitzer arm, and he is learning.
- Up to now, he has not had any receivers to throw to, but that will improve, because he now has Berrian and a more experienced Rice. It will only get better.
- He is mobile and can run for the first down when he needs to
- He understands that he is not Joe Montana, so he doesn't have a huge NFL QB ego, so it will work out
- All he has to do is handoff to Peterson, and then when the defense stacks the box, he hits Berrian deep
- Teams win the Show all the time without a great QB...

The other purple gremlin is yelling the following:
- Tarvaris had a 45 % completion percentage at I-AA college
- He does not have NFL mechanics
- He doesn't make good decisions
- He throws off his back foot too much
- He sometimes seems totally confused
- He gets injured
- Sure he will look good in one or two games (so did Cordell Stewart or Aliki Smith), but over an entire season, he will be very mediocre at best, and when it comes to "crunch time" (the playoffs, against teams that have maybe two weeks to scheme against him, he will be flustered and confused, like in the Redskins game last year...




The gremlins tell me to burn stuff.

StillPurple
04-24-2008, 06:45 PM
The gremlin came up with that number, 45 %, not me....
;D

But seriously, I am in a charitable mood today and I am focused more on the positive. I liked some of the stuff I saw from Tarvaris last year, in terms of mobility and his arm, which is very strong. One thing I did notice is his tendency to panic at the first sign of the pocket collapsing. He obviously will have to get better at that, because unless you are John Elway, being mobile and throwing well don't really go together. I think if Tarvaris can just relax a bit and not panic and run, he will be o.k. There were many games when I was shouting at the TV ("don't panic, relax !). But I think that will come with experience.

I love the way Tarvaris throws the deep ball. Very, very strong arm...

gregair13
04-24-2008, 06:53 PM
just believe. he will get better. and we will win

MetalMike-LoudVike
04-24-2008, 07:02 PM
Well a Good Defense,Good Run Game, and effective Pass Attack its hard to say
IF Jackson's Arm and his smarts are gona be enough to lead this Team. I Think He will Improve its just gonna Time.
kinda bumpy, I think he won't Break-Out Big But I am hoping he makes the good throws and limits his mistakes.

NordicNed
04-24-2008, 07:04 PM
The bottom line is, it's not up to TJ alone, if we win a Super Bowl or not.
It's a team and coaching thing.
I feel way to many people have judged TJ before it's time to be judging him anyways.
Most NFL QB's don't come around till their 3rd or 4th year of starting in the league.
Hell, TJ has really only started for one year.
I"m not counting the end of the 2006 season.
This will be a year though that TJ will either show improvment or no growth.

I believe he is going to show growth and show that he can be a better player. At the same time, lets hope our O Line and supporting players around TJ do their jobs also.
Line needs to block and protect him,
WR's need to catch those easy ones and put out that extra effort to bring in those off target but catchable balls.
I think by us dumping TW, that was a bigger help to TJ personaly, than signing Allen.






I think if the team as a whole does their jobs and do them well, and the coaches coach well, the sky is the limit with this team we are building......



I'm really feeling good about things right now, and I can only say I feel we are in for a good season and a playoff apperence, who far we go into the playoffs, only the coaches and players themselves can control that.

Purple Floyd
04-24-2008, 07:21 PM
The first question should be "Will he stay healthy for a full season?"


He has had quite a high percentage of games missed in his short career ( I am sure there is some stat buff who can look that up and post it) and one more season abbreviated by injuries is going to get him the title of Injury Prone.
Of course behind our O-line, QB injury has been a highly communicable disease.

midgensa
04-24-2008, 07:26 PM
"Marrdro" wrote:


Still find it funny that we see stuff like this.

Arguably the best moment in time for he Vikes in a while and we go beat a dead horse.

Of course he will be better.
The team won 8 games with him under center last year in a throw away year designed to get him reps/experience right along with the other youngsters.

He is up in Winter Park as we speak burning the midnight oil looking at game film with the coaches and and throwing/working with his recievers.

What the hell more do they want out of the kid.
Brother.
>:(


I know it is a few pages ago and all ... but I am with you on this one all the way!

gregair13
04-24-2008, 07:30 PM
give him time and he will be fine

NordicNed
04-24-2008, 08:02 PM
"midgensa" wrote:


"Marrdro" wrote:


Still find it funny that we see stuff like this.

Arguably the best moment in time for he Vikes in a while and we go beat a dead horse.

Of course he will be better.
The team won 8 games with him under center last year in a throw away year designed to get him reps/experience right along with the other youngsters.

He is up in Winter Park as we speak burning the midnight oil looking at game film with the coaches and and throwing/working with his recievers.

What the hell more do they want out of the kid.
Brother.

>:(


I know it is a few pages ago and all ... but I am with you on this one all the way!








I'll 3rd these posts, and jump on the wagon with you guys....I think TJ is going to be fine, and can be a very good NFL QB in the future....

Marrdro
04-25-2008, 06:21 AM
"NordicNed" wrote:


The bottom line is, it's not up to TJ alone, if we win a Super Bowl or not.
It's a team and coaching thing.

I feel way to many people have judged TJ before it's time to be judging him anyways.
Most NFL QB's don't come around till their 3rd or 4th year of starting in the league.
Hell, TJ has really only started for one year.
I"m not counting the end of the 2006 season.

This will be a year though that TJ will either show improvment or no growth.

I believe he is going to show growth and show that he can be a better player. At the same time, lets hope our O Line and supporting players around TJ do their jobs also.

Line needs to block and protect him,
WR's need to catch those easy ones and put out that extra effort to bring in those off target but catchable balls.
I think by us dumping TW, that was a bigger help to TJ personaly, than signing Allen.






I think if the team as a whole does their jobs and do them well, and the coaches coach well, the sky is the limit with this team we are building......




I'm really feeling good about things right now, and I can only say I feel we are in for a good season and a playoff apperence, who far we go into the playoffs, only the coaches and players themselves can control that.





Top shelf my friend.
Top shelf indeed.
;D

BleedinPandG
04-25-2008, 06:27 AM
I believe people are undervaluing the impact that Allen will have on the offense of the Vikings.
While sure, the Vikes D didn't give up a lot of points last year, they sure as heck had a hard time getting off the field.
The D caused very few 3 and outs and our O had a hard time getting into any sort of rhythm.
With a dominating run game on Offense combined with a D that can get off the field, we will have a team that can physically dominate the second half of games.
A D that gets off the field quickly and often is an Offenses best friend.
The more reps this O gets, the more worn down the D gets, the better everyone is going to do.

singersp
04-25-2008, 06:29 AM
"Marrdro" wrote:


"NordicNed" wrote:


The bottom line is, it's not up to TJ alone, if we win a Super Bowl or not.
It's a team and coaching thing.
I feel way to many people have judged TJ before it's time to be judging him anyways.
Most NFL QB's don't come around till their 3rd or 4th year of starting in the league.
Hell, TJ has really only started for one year.
I"m not counting the end of the 2006 season.
This will be a year though that TJ will either show improvment or no growth.

I believe he is going to show growth and show that he can be a better player. At the same time, lets hope our O Line and supporting players around TJ do their jobs also.
Line needs to block and protect him,
WR's need to catch those easy ones and put out that extra effort to bring in those off target but catchable balls.
I think by us dumping TW, that was a bigger help to TJ personaly, than signing Allen.






I think if the team as a whole does their jobs and do them well, and the coaches coach well, the sky is the limit with this team we are building......



I'm really feeling good about things right now, and I can only say I feel we are in for a good season and a playoff apperence, who far we go into the playoffs, only the coaches and players themselves can control that.





Top shelf my friend.
Top shelf indeed.
;D


Too many people want instant success from players whose positions don't generally warrant it. If they feel they do not live up to THEIR expectations the first year out of the chute, they label them busts. Particularly if it is a player that got chosen over someone they wanted to see drafted.

Marrdro
04-25-2008, 06:30 AM
"singersp" wrote:


"Marrdro" wrote:


"NordicNed" wrote:


The bottom line is, it's not up to TJ alone, if we win a Super Bowl or not.
It's a team and coaching thing.

I feel way to many people have judged TJ before it's time to be judging him anyways.
Most NFL QB's don't come around till their 3rd or 4th year of starting in the league.
Hell, TJ has really only started for one year.
I"m not counting the end of the 2006 season.

This will be a year though that TJ will either show improvment or no growth.

I believe he is going to show growth and show that he can be a better player. At the same time, lets hope our O Line and supporting players around TJ do their jobs also.

Line needs to block and protect him,
WR's need to catch those easy ones and put out that extra effort to bring in those off target but catchable balls.
I think by us dumping TW, that was a bigger help to TJ personaly, than signing Allen.






I think if the team as a whole does their jobs and do them well, and the coaches coach well, the sky is the limit with this team we are building......




I'm really feeling good about things right now, and I can only say I feel we are in for a good season and a playoff apperence, who far we go into the playoffs, only the coaches and players themselves can control that.





Top shelf my friend.
Top shelf indeed.

;D


Too many people want instant success from players whose positions don't generally warrant it. If they feel they do not live up to THEIR expectations the first year out of the chute, they label them busts. Particularly if it is a player that got chosen over someone they wanted to see drafted.


Hey isn't that the exact definition in the dictionary for the word YUTZ?
;D

(Ohhhh I'm on a roll today.
;D )

singersp
04-25-2008, 06:47 AM
"Marrdro" wrote:


"singersp" wrote:


"Marrdro" wrote:


"NordicNed" wrote:


The bottom line is, it's not up to TJ alone, if we win a Super Bowl or not.
It's a team and coaching thing.
I feel way to many people have judged TJ before it's time to be judging him anyways.
Most NFL QB's don't come around till their 3rd or 4th year of starting in the league.
Hell, TJ has really only started for one year.
I"m not counting the end of the 2006 season.
This will be a year though that TJ will either show improvment or no growth.

I believe he is going to show growth and show that he can be a better player. At the same time, lets hope our O Line and supporting players around TJ do their jobs also.
Line needs to block and protect him,
WR's need to catch those easy ones and put out that extra effort to bring in those off target but catchable balls.
I think by us dumping TW, that was a bigger help to TJ personaly, than signing Allen.






I think if the team as a whole does their jobs and do them well, and the coaches coach well, the sky is the limit with this team we are building......



I'm really feeling good about things right now, and I can only say I feel we are in for a good season and a playoff apperence, who far we go into the playoffs, only the coaches and players themselves can control that.





Top shelf my friend.
Top shelf indeed.
;D


Too many people want instant success from players whose positions don't generally warrant it. If they feel they do not live up to THEIR expectations the first year out of the chute, they label them busts. Particularly if it is a player that got chosen over someone they wanted to see drafted.


Hey isn't that the exact definition in the dictionary for the word YUTZ?
;D

(Ohhhh I'm on a roll today.
;D )


Not exactly.............

1. yutz


This is from the Yiddish, it means ditz, clutz, dumkoft, ninny, nincompoop, socially incompetant boob, twit, dumbass.

Example? I gotta provide a sample?? Sheesh!! Use it like any of those word up there!!! What yutz thought up this stupid requirement!?!?!


2. yutz

The thick goo of product that clogs the pump or dispensing cap of containers.

I had to dig the yutz out of my hair conditioner squirt cap before I could get more out.


3. yutz

krusty the clowns version of Putz, you yutz

" its a towel you yutz"

Marrdro
04-25-2008, 06:49 AM
"BleedinPandG" wrote:


I believe people are undervaluing the impact that Allen will have on the offense of the Vikings.
While sure, the Vikes D didn't give up a lot of points last year, they sure as heck had a hard time getting off the field.
The D caused very few 3 and outs and our O had a hard time getting into any sort of rhythm.
With a dominating run game on Offense combined with a D that can get off the field, we will have a team that can physically dominate the second half of games.
A D that gets off the field quickly and often is an Offenses best friend.
The more reps this O gets, the more worn down the D gets, the better everyone is going to do.

I am pretty sure I've given you props before as you have had movement on the ole spreadsheet, but that has to be your best post my friend.

(Marrdro moves BPG up two columns).
;D

Marrdro
04-25-2008, 06:51 AM
"singersp" wrote:


"Marrdro" wrote:


"singersp" wrote:


"Marrdro" wrote:


"NordicNed" wrote:


The bottom line is, it's not up to TJ alone, if we win a Super Bowl or not.
It's a team and coaching thing.

I feel way to many people have judged TJ before it's time to be judging him anyways.
Most NFL QB's don't come around till their 3rd or 4th year of starting in the league.
Hell, TJ has really only started for one year.
I"m not counting the end of the 2006 season.

This will be a year though that TJ will either show improvment or no growth.

I believe he is going to show growth and show that he can be a better player. At the same time, lets hope our O Line and supporting players around TJ do their jobs also.

Line needs to block and protect him,
WR's need to catch those easy ones and put out that extra effort to bring in those off target but catchable balls.
I think by us dumping TW, that was a bigger help to TJ personaly, than signing Allen.






I think if the team as a whole does their jobs and do them well, and the coaches coach well, the sky is the limit with this team we are building......




I'm really feeling good about things right now, and I can only say I feel we are in for a good season and a playoff apperence, who far we go into the playoffs, only the coaches and players themselves can control that.





Top shelf my friend.
Top shelf indeed.

;D


Too many people want instant success from players whose positions don't generally warrant it. If they feel they do not live up to THEIR expectations the first year out of the chute, they label them busts. Particularly if it is a player that got chosen over someone they wanted to see drafted.


Hey isn't that the exact definition in the dictionary for the word YUTZ?

;D

(Ohhhh I'm on a roll today.
;D )


Not exactly.............

1. yutz



This is from the Yiddish, it means ditz, clutz, dumkoft, ninny, nincompoop, socially incompetant boob, twit, dumbass.

Example? I gotta provide a sample?? Sheesh!! Use it like any of those word up there!!! What yutz thought up this stupid requirement!?!?!


2. yutz

The thick goo of product that clogs the pump or dispensing cap of containers.

I had to dig the yutz out of my hair conditioner squirt cap before I could get more out.


3. yutz

krusty the clowns version of Putz, you yutz

" its a towel you yutz"

All right, I see that when I ship you out your Dan Mozes jersey I also gotta send you out a Marrdro Dictionary.
;D

singersp
04-25-2008, 07:08 AM
"Marrdro" wrote:


"singersp" wrote:


"Marrdro" wrote:


"singersp" wrote:


"Marrdro" wrote:




The bottom line is, it's not up to TJ alone, if we win a Super Bowl or not.
It's a team and coaching thing.
I feel way to many people have judged TJ before it's time to be judging him anyways.
Most NFL QB's don't come around till their 3rd or 4th year of starting in the league.
Hell, TJ has really only started for one year.
I"m not counting the end of the 2006 season.
This will be a year though that TJ will either show improvment or no growth.

I believe he is going to show growth and show that he can be a better player. At the same time, lets hope our O Line and supporting players around TJ do their jobs also.
Line needs to block and protect him,
WR's need to catch those easy ones and put out that extra effort to bring in those off target but catchable balls.
I think by us dumping TW, that was a bigger help to TJ personaly, than signing Allen.






I think if the team as a whole does their jobs and do them well, and the coaches coach well, the sky is the limit with this team we are building......



I'm really feeling good about things right now, and I can only say I feel we are in for a good season and a playoff apperence, who far we go into the playoffs, only the coaches and players themselves can control that.





Top shelf my friend.
Top shelf indeed.
;D


Too many people want instant success from players whose positions don't generally warrant it. If they feel they do not live up to THEIR expectations the first year out of the chute, they label them busts. Particularly if it is a player that got chosen over someone they wanted to see drafted.


Hey isn't that the exact definition in the dictionary for the word YUTZ?
;D

(Ohhhh I'm on a roll today.
;D )


Not exactly.............

1. yutz


This is from the Yiddish, it means ditz, clutz, dumkoft, ninny, nincompoop, socially incompetant boob, twit, dumbass.

Example? I gotta provide a sample?? Sheesh!! Use it like any of those word up there!!! What yutz thought up this stupid requirement!?!?!


2. yutz

The thick goo of product that clogs the pump or dispensing cap of containers.

I had to dig the yutz out of my hair conditioner squirt cap before I could get more out.


3. yutz

krusty the clowns version of Putz, you yutz

" its a towel you yutz"

All right, I see that when I ship you out your Dan Mozes jersey I also gotta send you out a Marrdro Dictionary.
;D


If he pans out, I'd love to have that Mozes jersey. I just wouldn't buy one now.

Prophet
04-25-2008, 07:14 AM
"Schutz" wrote:


"Marrdro" wrote:


"Prophet" wrote:


"P.P.E." wrote:


Everybody needs to relax on Jackson.
We have all be sucked into believing that if you dont succeed in the first year of your career that you are a failure.
His rookie season I remember people saying he hadn't even taken snaps with the first offense until his first start in week 16.
He's raw and everybody knew it when we drafted him.
He has shown improvements and by the second half of this upcoming season I think everybody will be happy we drafted him.



Only the dullest of bulbs expect a person tossed into the starting QB role from a small school to do well his first year.
Most QBs from D1 school's sit on the sidelines for a couple of years before they take the reigns.

I can list you at least 5 Bulbs on this site who refuse to acknowledge that fact.


I won't though cause it would get me sent to hell real quick I bet.

;D


I guess I'm one of those "dull bulb" although funny someone calls someone else a dull bulb, maybe they were looking for dull knife, or dim bulb?
Hmmmm, and I'm the dull bulb.


Anytime someone uses a cliche it is, by definition, poor writing to begin with.
So, correcting a cliche within an obviously poorly written sentence does not deem yourself relatively more intelligent.
It merely is an attempt to derail the topic, which in simple terms is if you think you can rate a QB from a small school that is deemed a starter at the end of his first year in the NFL, then, you are, in fact, an idiot.


There has never been a QB tossed in as a starter from a small school without first riding the bench for a couple years.
This is a first.
Tarvaris has one full year under his belt and nobody knows whether he has it or he doesn't.
The coaching staff seems to believe he does for the time being.
I'll trust a professional coaching staff that has devoted their career to analyzing talent and that sees them on the field every day over the opinion of someone that eats a bag of nachos and drinks cheap beer while watching the game and scratching their ass during commercials.

Marrdro
04-25-2008, 07:30 AM
"Schutz" wrote:


"Marrdro" wrote:


"Prophet" wrote:


"P.P.E." wrote:


Everybody needs to relax on Jackson.
We have all be sucked into believing that if you dont succeed in the first year of your career that you are a failure.
His rookie season I remember people saying he hadn't even taken snaps with the first offense until his first start in week 16.
He's raw and everybody knew it when we drafted him.
He has shown improvements and by the second half of this upcoming season I think everybody will be happy we drafted him.



Only the dullest of bulbs expect a person tossed into the starting QB role from a small school to do well his first year.
Most QBs from D1 school's sit on the sidelines for a couple of years before they take the reigns.

I can list you at least 5 Bulbs on this site who refuse to acknowledge that fact.


I won't though cause it would get me sent to hell real quick I bet.

;D


I guess I'm one of those "dull bulb" although funny someone calls someone else a dull bulb, maybe they were looking for dull knife, or dim bulb?
Hmmmm, and I'm the dull bulb.

Who called who a dull bulb?

I said I could list a few but I never did.
Doesn't look like PPE or Proph did either.
Hmmmmmmmmm what am I missing here.
::)

StillPurple
04-25-2008, 03:58 PM
Prophet, let me just ask you a question. I think your analysis is decent, and I mostly agree with it. But I just am curious, and I don't mean this as some kind of ironic or rhetorical question: do you think that a Vikings asst. coach would come out and say he doesn't think Tarvaris can make it, if the head coach has basically said that Tarvaris is his guy ? I just personally am not sure about that, and I don't know if it works that way. For instance, if you are the QB coach, is it not your job to just coach whoever the head coach puts in at QB ?

I don't think that the offensive coordinator or QB coach would last long if he came out in the MNPLS Tribune and said, "well, I know Brad loves Tarvaris, but I don't think he is really a starting QB in this league". I doubt it...

For instance, what happens in camp if it appears to *everyone* that Gus Frerotte is a better QB than Tarvaris ? If the head coach says it is T-Jacks, they have to go with that, right ?

i_bleed_purple
04-25-2008, 04:04 PM
the coaches speak with their actions not their words.
If they had no faith in TJ, they would go out and try to get a new starting qb.
Since that hasn't happened, I'd say its sae to assume they like TJ for now

Schutz
04-25-2008, 04:04 PM
"Marrdro" wrote:


"Schutz" wrote:


"Marrdro" wrote:


"Prophet" wrote:


"P.P.E." wrote:


Everybody needs to relax on Jackson.
We have all be sucked into believing that if you dont succeed in the first year of your career that you are a failure.
His rookie season I remember people saying he hadn't even taken snaps with the first offense until his first start in week 16.
He's raw and everybody knew it when we drafted him.
He has shown improvements and by the second half of this upcoming season I think everybody will be happy we drafted him.



Only the dullest of bulbs expect a person tossed into the starting QB role from a small school to do well his first year. Most QBs from D1 school's sit on the sidelines for a couple of years before they take the reigns.

I can list you at least 5 Bulbs on this site who refuse to acknowledge that fact.


I won't though cause it would get me sent to hell real quick I bet.
;D


I guess I'm one of those "dull bulb" although funny someone calls someone else a dull bulb, maybe they were looking for dull knife, or dim bulb?
Hmmmm, and I'm the dull bulb.

Who called who a dull bulb?

I said I could list a few but I never did.
Doesn't look like PPE or Proph did either.
Hmmmmmmmmm what am I missing here.
::)


Right up there in bold, thus trying to say anybody who is critical of Jackson is a "dull bulb", although I don't remember the last time I've seen someone buy a bulb sharpener.

mountainviking
04-25-2008, 04:49 PM
We just need TJack to not F-up!
As long as he holds on to the ball, and doesn't throw any, up-for-grabs passes, we'll be fine.
In addition to TJack, I expect Rice, Cook, Allison, and AP to all play their positions better with a year of experience under their belts.
I have high hopes for Tapeh, he's got some pretty nice shoes to fill.
And, if the OL holds better, we'll see more from Shank too.


But the real deal is Berrian.
Replace TWill's 70 receptions in 3 year with BB's 70+ last year.
Big Improvement!!

minvikes01
04-25-2008, 04:51 PM
Jackson isn't even good enough to get us into the playoffs, in fact, he is so bad, he could singlehandedly prevent us from making them.
We need a QB who isn't an absolute moron a cut above most D II qbs.

ChezPizmo
04-25-2008, 04:54 PM
"vikingivan" wrote:


"singersp" wrote:


Wilf rolls dice on trade, on Jackson (http://www.startribune.com/sports/vikings/18028514.html)

Jared Allen would be quite a catch for the Vikings, but a team's championship hopes will always live and die with the quarterback.

By Kevin Seifert, Vikings Insider
startribune.com

Last update: April 23, 2008 - 1:33 AM


So in reality, here is what the Vikings were thinking Tuesday night: Tarvaris Jackson will be good enough in 2008 that we feel comfortable making an enormous investment toward winning the Super Bowl right now.....


I sure hope that he is.
He has the best running back tandem in the NFL to compliment him.
He has his deep threat in Berrian now.
He is backed by one of the best defenses in the NFL.
It is all on TJack now.
Let's hope he can do it.


Totally agree. I feel good about it though. I have that feeling of a breakout season. Not just for Jackson, but for the whole franchise.

ChezPizmo
04-25-2008, 04:56 PM
"minvikes01" wrote:


Jackson isn't even good enough to get us into the playoffs, in fact, he is so bad, he could singlehandedly prevent us from making them.
We need a QB who isn't an absolute silly guy a cut above most D II qbs.


So, like.... are you going to mention any reasons why? Maybe some specifics? Mechanics?

Or are you just spewing more non-sense Jackson hating?
Yeah, non-sense Jackson hating.

dcboardr41
04-25-2008, 05:02 PM
"minvikes01" wrote:


Jackson isn't even good enough to get us into the playoffs, in fact, he is so bad, he could singlehandedly prevent us from making them.
We need a QB who isn't an absolute silly guy a cut above most D II qbs.


1. Reasons for your hatred of Tarvaris Jackson
and
2. Who would u want to replace him? what are your plans to fix this "situation"

minvikes01
04-25-2008, 05:27 PM
"ChezPizmo" wrote:


"minvikes01" wrote:


Jackson isn't even good enough to get us into the playoffs, in fact, he is so bad, he could singlehandedly prevent us from making them.
We need a QB who isn't an absolute silly guy a cut above most D II qbs.


So, like.... are you going to mention any reasons why? Maybe some specifics? Mechanics?

Or are you just spewing more non-sense Jackson hating?
Yeah, non-sense Jackson hating.


Last year I was optimistic about him even with the mistakes, until he showed no improvements in mechanics and decision making.
His showed promise in a few games, but then later in the season began making very bad decisions such as his tendency to throw the ball while jumping up in the air and many other bad decisions.
The main concern for me is the very little progress he showed last season, and then he fell apart at the end of the year.

dcboardr41
04-25-2008, 05:30 PM
"minvikes01" wrote:


"ChezPizmo" wrote:


"minvikes01" wrote:


Jackson isn't even good enough to get us into the playoffs, in fact, he is so bad, he could singlehandedly prevent us from making them.
We need a QB who isn't an absolute silly guy a cut above most D II qbs.


So, like.... are you going to mention any reasons why? Maybe some specifics? Mechanics?

Or are you just spewing more non-sense Jackson hating?
Yeah, non-sense Jackson hating.


Last year I was optimistic about him even with the mistakes, until he showed no improvements in mechanics and decision making.
His showed promise in a few games, but then later in the season began making very bad decisions such as his tendency to throw the ball while jumping up in the air and many other bad decisions.
The main concern for me is the very little progress he showed last season, and then he fell apart at the end of the year.


it was his 1st year of starting in the NFL, every "rookie" qb has problems with starting the 1st year, give the guy a break. To quote that douchebag guy on britney sprears, "Let tarvaris jackson alone! Hes trying his hardest! He tried the jump pass! Let him alone!!!!!!

StillPurple
04-25-2008, 05:36 PM
... my scorecard dosn't have any areas on it reserved for "tried hard"...
::)

dcboardr41
04-25-2008, 05:37 PM
"StillPurple" wrote:


... my scorecard dosn't have any areas on it reserved for "tried hard"...
::)


so in your opinion, tjack basically didnt care last year and didnt try hard and just threw the ball without a care? Or am i mistaken by what u said?

Marrdro
04-25-2008, 05:54 PM
"StillPurple" wrote:


Prophet, let me just ask you a question. I think your analysis is decent, and I mostly agree with it. But I just am curious, and I don't mean this as some kind of ironic or rhetorical question: do you think that a Vikings asst. coach would come out and say he doesn't think Tarvaris can make it, if the head coach has basically said that Tarvaris is his guy ? I just personally am not sure about that, and I don't know if it works that way. For instance, if you are the QB coach, is it not your job to just coach whoever the head coach puts in at QB ?

I don't think that the offensive coordinator or QB coach would last long if he came out in the MNPLS Tribune and said, "well, I know Brad loves Tarvaris, but I don't think he is really a starting QB in this league". I doubt it...

For instance, what happens in camp if it appears to *everyone* that Gus Frerotte is a better QB than Tarvaris ? If the head coach says it is T-Jacks, they have to go with that, right ?

Can I give you a few comments on that question?


I don't think that the offensive coordinator or QB coach would last long if he came out in the MNPLS Tribune and said, "well, I know Brad loves Tarvaris, but I don't think he is really a starting QB in this league". I doubt it...


I wouldn't think they would last long if they did that either.
But I also wouldn't think they would last long if they felt the players that the Front Office provided to the coaching staff weren't up to par.

I for one believe they give him honest assesments because crappy play from the players they are coaching will piss him as well.

Additionally, I find it very hard to believe that someone would think that Coach Childress is so full of himself that he would discourage his coaching staff from telling him the truth about his players as much I as I find it hard to believe that someone would think that Coach Childress is so in love with TJ that his coaching staff was afraid to tell him the truth.

Hell the Chiller has been pretty up front about what he thinks about TJ.

Sure he doesn't come out and say the kid sucks as that would be about the dumbest thing in the world to do if your trying to build confidence in a kid you wouldn't hang him out in front of the press.

Wow, I appear to be rambling but I think you get my drift on this.
I think you are reaching for something that isn't there my friend.

StillPurple
04-25-2008, 06:12 PM
True. I also hope that Childress is like that.

minvikes01
04-25-2008, 08:57 PM
"dcboardr41" wrote:


"minvikes01" wrote:


"ChezPizmo" wrote:


"minvikes01" wrote:


Jackson isn't even good enough to get us into the playoffs, in fact, he is so bad, he could singlehandedly prevent us from making them.
We need a QB who isn't an absolute silly guy a cut above most D II qbs.


So, like.... are you going to mention any reasons why? Maybe some specifics? Mechanics?

Or are you just spewing more non-sense Jackson hating?
Yeah, non-sense Jackson hating.




Last year I was optimistic about him even with the mistakes, until he showed no improvements in mechanics and decision making.
His showed promise in a few games, but then later in the season began making very bad decisions such as his tendency to throw the ball while jumping up in the air and many other bad decisions.
The main concern for me is the very little progress he showed last season, and then he fell apart at the end of the year.


it was his 1st year of starting in the NFL, every "rookie" qb has problems with starting the 1st year, give the guy a break. To quote that douchebag guy on britney sprears, "Let tarvaris jackson alone! Hes trying his hardest! He tried the jump pass! Let him alone!!!!!!


Maybe he is trying his hardest, but that means nothing as far as talent and decision making, he made way to many throws that were off target, overthrown and underthrown, his accuracy is lacking, he may be trying his hardest, but he might not be cut out to be an NFL QB, or a starting one anyway.
I hope he proves me wrong, but as of now I am a skeptic.

Prophet
04-25-2008, 09:18 PM
"Schutz" wrote:


"Marrdro" wrote:


"Schutz" wrote:


"Marrdro" wrote:


"Prophet" wrote:




Everybody needs to relax on Jackson.
We have all be sucked into believing that if you dont succeed in the first year of your career that you are a failure.
His rookie season I remember people saying he hadn't even taken snaps with the first offense until his first start in week 16.
He's raw and everybody knew it when we drafted him.
He has shown improvements and by the second half of this upcoming season I think everybody will be happy we drafted him.



Only the dullest of bulbs expect a person tossed into the starting QB role from a small school to do well his first year. Most QBs from D1 school's sit on the sidelines for a couple of years before they take the reigns.

I can list you at least 5 Bulbs on this site who refuse to acknowledge that fact.


I won't though cause it would get me sent to hell real quick I bet.

;D


I guess I'm one of those "dull bulb" although funny someone calls someone else a dull bulb, maybe they were looking for dull knife, or dim bulb?
Hmmmm, and I'm the dull bulb.

Who called who a dull bulb?

I said I could list a few but I never did.
Doesn't look like PPE or Proph did either.
Hmmmmmmmmm what am I missing here.

::)


Right up there in bold, thus trying to say anybody who is critical of Jackson is a "dull bulb", although I don't remember the last time I've seen someone buy a bulb sharpener.


Last I checked one of the definitions of 'dull' is dim.
The cliche stands as is.

PackSux!
04-25-2008, 09:24 PM
If Trent Dilfer can win a superbowl then so can TJack.

Prophet
04-25-2008, 09:29 PM
"StillPurple" wrote:


Prophet, let me just ask you a question. I think your analysis is decent, and I mostly agree with it. But I just am curious, and I don't mean this as some kind of ironic or rhetorical question: do you think that a Vikings asst. coach would come out and say he doesn't think Tarvaris can make it, if the head coach has basically said that Tarvaris is his guy ? I just personally am not sure about that, and I don't know if it works that way. For instance, if you are the QB coach, is it not your job to just coach whoever the head coach puts in at QB ?

I don't think that the offensive coordinator or QB coach would last long if he came out in the MNPLS Tribune and said, "well, I know Brad loves Tarvaris, but I don't think he is really a starting QB in this league". I doubt it...

For instance, what happens in camp if it appears to *everyone* that Gus Frerotte is a better QB than Tarvaris ? If the head coach says it is T-Jacks, they have to go with that, right ?


Do you honestly think that the asst coaches don't talk to the head coaches at meetings they have all the time?
Seriously.
That is insane to think they don't.
They are professionals, they get paid to offer their opinions based on what they see.

Also, I agree that someone that is an asst. shouldn't go to the press and counter what the HC says they are doing.
That would be retarded and they should be canned for that.
Doesn't mean they agree with everything behind the scenes, if they did they wouldn't be doing their job.
They have discussions and decide what they should do to move forward.
The HC has the final word, because that is their job.
The press if loaded with idiots trying to make a deadline, they give them some tidbits and move on.
The asst coaches are not the voice of the vikings, they are the behind the scences minions that make the organization tick.

Finally, what happens if everyone thinks Frerrote is the man.....'everyone' thinks so?
If that was the case then he would start.
Do you honestly believe that a career backup that has peaked in his skill is the man at this time?
Do you think he wasn't hired as a backup and as a mentor to a young punk QB from a 1AA school that has one season under his belt and didn't have the luxury of learning on the bench?
I have no doubt that the best QB for the team will start on opening day.
The problem is that some people only thing in one dimension.
The coaching staff which has well over 100 years of professional coaching experience has many many variables to consider when deciding who will be the starter at the QB slot.
They are thinking in the present, short-term and long-term.
They think about it more than us losers that have no say about the matter and post on a website as if we have a damn clue as to what is going on.
We have no look at the day-to-day operations, nor do we see how the players interact on a personal level, in the locker room, on the practice field, on the sidelines, during the heat of the game, etc.
There is no doubt in my mind that I will trust the professionals that live, eat, sleep and breathe football every day with their livelihoods depending on it to make the decisions.

VikingsMB
04-25-2008, 10:11 PM
"Prophet" wrote:


"StillPurple" wrote:


Prophet, let me just ask you a question. I think your analysis is decent, and I mostly agree with it. But I just am curious, and I don't mean this as some kind of ironic or rhetorical question: do you think that a Vikings asst. coach would come out and say he doesn't think Tarvaris can make it, if the head coach has basically said that Tarvaris is his guy ? I just personally am not sure about that, and I don't know if it works that way. For instance, if you are the QB coach, is it not your job to just coach whoever the head coach puts in at QB ?

I don't think that the offensive coordinator or QB coach would last long if he came out in the MNPLS Tribune and said, "well, I know Brad loves Tarvaris, but I don't think he is really a starting QB in this league". I doubt it...

For instance, what happens in camp if it appears to *everyone* that Gus Frerotte is a better QB than Tarvaris ? If the head coach says it is T-Jacks, they have to go with that, right ?


Do you honestly think that the asst coaches don't talk to the head coaches at meetings they have all the time?
Seriously.
That is insane to think they don't.
They are professionals, they get paid to offer their opinions based on what they see.

Also, I agree that someone that is an asst. shouldn't go to the press and counter what the HC says they are doing.
That would be Challenged Hillbilly Lover'd and they should be canned for that.
Doesn't mean they agree with everything behind the scenes, if they did they wouldn't be doing their job.
They have discussions and decide what they should do to move forward.
The HC has the final word, because that is their job.
The press if loaded with idiots trying to make a deadline, they give them some tidbits and move on.
The asst coaches are not the voice of the vikings, they are the behind the scences minions that make the organization tick.

Finally, what happens if everyone thinks Frerrote is the man.....'everyone' thinks so?
If that was the case then he would start.
Do you honestly believe that a career backup that has peaked in his skill is the man at this time?
Do you think he wasn't hired as a backup and as a mentor to a young punk QB from a 1AA school that has one season under his belt and didn't have the luxury of learning on the bench?
I have no doubt that the best QB for the team will start on opening day.
The problem is that some people only thing in one dimension.
The coaching staff which has well over 100 years of professional coaching experience has many many variables to consider when deciding who will be the starter at the QB slot.
They are thinking in the present, short-term and long-term.
They think about it more than us losers that have no say about the matter and post on a website as if we have a gol 'darnit clue as to what is going on.
We have no look at the day-to-day operations, nor do we see how the players interact on a personal level, in the locker room, on the practice field, on the sidelines, during the heat of the game, etc.
There is no doubt in my mind that I will trust the professionals that live, eat, sleep and breathe football every day with their livelihoods depending on it to make the decisions.


Nice assessment.
And with some basic observations added:
1.
Ziggy has spent some big guaranteed cash over the past couple of years.
(I think Scout reported 170 million?)


He watched his Giants win.
Now he wants to win.
2.
Spielman had added every ingredient he felt was lacking to allow everyone to perform at or above ProBowl level
3.
Chilly has evolved as a coach and is not as Hard- *ssed as when he came in and laid down his law.
he has


established himself and now wants to prove himself
4.
Tavaris showed a lot of growth from beginning to end last year, and as long as his head is in the game, he


has shown a lot of capabilities of being a good QB...too early to tell about Great, but at least very good.


I hope the fans give him a little more love than the "We'd rather have Bollinger"
(0-2) followed by the "We'd


rather have Holcomb" (0-2) fans.
Sure Tjack had 2 crappy games to finish last year but the guy has a year of


growth, studying and improving.
5.
Frerotte makes guys better quarterbacks historically.
6.
This is not our only year to win it all.
Most our guys are here for 2 or 3 years.
last year was the first year


of the dynasty program.
This is year two.


One thing for sure...whether it's Tjack, Gus or BB, this is going to be an exciting year on both sides of the ball!

Purple Floyd
04-25-2008, 10:14 PM
While it is true that people spend their lives trying to figure out how talent and potential will transfer to the football field, nobody has a crystal ball that lets them see the future.
Apparently the staff has seen enough of TJ to tell them he has the potential to be a starting Qb in the NFL, but in the end he will have to prove it on the field.

If every staff that has devoted their life to football never made a bad decision then Ryan Leaf would have never been put into the starting role as a rookie,only to blow up and be a huge disappointment, tony mandarich would not have been a 2nd overall pick only to go on to a subpar career and somebody from the Vikings circa 1991 would have watched some past game film and deduced that Herschel walker performed better from an I formation that as a split back.

So while it has yet to be seen whether Jackson will or will not succeed, one thing is certain. The front office has far more experience and exposure to the situation than any fan and thus they have a greater chance at making the correct assessment. But it does not guarantee that they will make the correct assessment. As Vikings fans we can only hope that they make the right decision even if we fail to understand it.

VikingsMB
04-25-2008, 10:20 PM
"UffDaVikes" wrote:


While it is true that people spend their lives trying to figure out how talent and potential will transfer to the football field, nobody has a crystal ball that lets them see the future.
Apparently the staff has seen enough of TJ to tell them he has the potential to be a starting Qb in the NFL, but in the end he will have to prove it on the field.

If every staff that has devoted their life to football never made a bad decision then Ryan Leaf would have never been put into the starting role as a rookie,only to blow up and be a huge disappointment, tony mandarich would not have been a 2nd overall pick only to go on to a subpar career and somebody from the Vikings circa 1991 would have watched some past game film and deduced that Herschel walker performed better from an I formation that as a split back.

So while it has yet to be seen whether Jackson will or will not succeed, one thing is certain. The front office has far more experience and exposure to the situation than any fan and thus they have a greater chance at making the correct assessment. But it does not guarantee that they will make the correct assessment. As Vikings fans we can only hope that they make the right decision even if we fail to understand it.


Well written.

ragz
04-25-2008, 10:21 PM
listen, eli was just about as bad as anybody for much of last season and beat an 18-0 team with a running game and defense.
if the coaching is good enough and the other facets of your team execute well your qb does not have to win it for you.
eli made pretty much one play in that game and that's all it took.
delhomme, dilfer, grossman, hassleback, brady, warner, and handful of guys, who were they before things clicked for them and they ended up in super bowls?
i dont know what these fans,so-called experts, or media types expect outta a 2nd year qb from a small school.
but the fact is he can go one of two ways.
only get better with more experience or prove that he's as bad as people who dont watch viking games think he is.
the vikings have been aggressive in everything they've targetted and for some reason have left the qb position alone for the most part.
so for whatever reason they like what they have in jackson despite all the bad talk of him.


the question of if he's good enough to win the super bowl, how can you answer that?
for awhile people didn't think peyton manning was good enough to get to the super bowl.
elway failed 3 times before hitting his first.
marino got to one and lost.
it's a team game, and some teams are built around their qbs, which doesn't always work, or often doesn't work for that matter.
another whole training camp and season to cut his teeth, hopefully barring injury.
so who knows what kinda qb jackson will be by january?
brady wasn't created overnight,bradshaw, plunkett, doug wililams, so i still say fuck the people who are constantly replacing jackson.
i reserve the right to be adamant about that until i say fuck tavaris jackson.
that's the power i possess.

VikingsMB
04-25-2008, 10:35 PM
Trent Dilfer won the Superbowl.
He is not really synonymous
with great Superbowl QB's.
The defense could be good enough to improve into the top 5 D's.
We need our guy to adhere to the playbook.

a) Hand it to AP
b) Hand it to CT
c) Throw down the seam to Wade
d) Chuck it every now and then to Berrian
e) Flag it out to Rice

but mostly a) and b)

Schutz
04-26-2008, 02:13 AM
"VikingsMB" wrote:


Trent Dilfer won the Superbowl.
He is not really synonymous
with great Superbowl QB's.
The defense could be good enough to improve into the top 5 D's.
We need our guy to adhere to the playbook.

a) Hand it to AP
b) Hand it to CT
c) Throw down the seam to Wade
d) Chuck it every now and then to Berrian
e) Flag it out to Rice

but mostly a) and b)



We could win as a defensive team, it's just that our defense would have to be a competly shut down unit.
The Ravens super bowl defense was one of the all time best, we'd have to have the same kind of defense to win without a game controlling QB.
If Allen allows our pass defense to greatly improve I could see us winning 12 games even if T-Jack never passed the ball all season.

ragz
04-26-2008, 02:35 AM
"Schutz" wrote:


"VikingsMB" wrote:


Trent Dilfer won the Superbowl.
He is not really synonymous
with great Superbowl QB's.
The defense could be good enough to improve into the top 5 D's.
We need our guy to adhere to the playbook.

a) Hand it to AP
b) Hand it to CT
c) Throw down the seam to Wade
d) Chuck it every now and then to Berrian
e) Flag it out to Rice

but mostly a) and b)



We could win as a defensive team, it's just that our defense would have to be a competly shut down unit.
The Ravens super bowl defense was one of the all time best, we'd have to have the same kind of defense to win without a game controlling QB.
If Allen allows our pass defense to greatly improve I could see us winning 12 games even if T-Jack never passed the ball all season.

totally.
i mean grossman, delhomme, eli, were awesome game managers who made no mistakes and had baltimore shut down, dont give up a point defenses. that's why they went to the super bowl!


can you smell the sarcasm.

i know you guys like to label tavaris as the equivalent of having a special olympic athlete playing qb, but he has ability, more weapons , and hopefully a defense that gets off the field on 3rd downs this year.
if you remember correctly, it was our conservative hand the ball off and throw 10 times a game management that got us off to a 3-6 start.
so if we stand any chance of going somewhere we have to be balanced.
if we sit around and wait till its too late to keep teams honest we will constantly have to be winning games in the 4th quarter like we have the last 2 years, where we lose about half them.
everyone's real concern should be how the offensive line play is.
cuz if mckinnie is gone for a while and hicks blow, and cook is still erratic, and teams are stacking to stop the run, we aren't gonna stand a chance to throw the football even if we tom brady was our qb.

Schutz
04-26-2008, 02:38 AM
"ragz" wrote:


"Schutz" wrote:


"VikingsMB" wrote:


Trent Dilfer won the Superbowl.
He is not really synonymous
with great Superbowl QB's.
The defense could be good enough to improve into the top 5 D's.
We need our guy to adhere to the playbook.

a) Hand it to AP
b) Hand it to CT
c) Throw down the seam to Wade
d) Chuck it every now and then to Berrian
e) Flag it out to Rice

but mostly a) and b)



We could win as a defensive team, it's just that our defense would have to be a competly shut down unit.
The Ravens super bowl defense was one of the all time best, we'd have to have the same kind of defense to win without a game controlling QB.
If Allen allows our pass defense to greatly improve I could see us winning 12 games even if T-Jack never passed the ball all season.

totally.
i mean grossman, delhomme, eli, were awesome game managers who made no mistakes and had baltimore shut down, dont give up a point defenses. that's why they went to the super bowl!


can you smell the sarcasm.

i know you guys like to label tavaris as the equivalent of having a special olympic athlete playing qb, but he has ability, more weapons , and hopefully a defense that gets off the field on 3rd downs this year.
if you remember correctly, it was our conservative hand the ball off and throw 10 times a game management that got us off to a 3-6 start.
so if we stand any chance of going somewhere we have to be balanced.
if we sit around and wait till its too late to keep teams honest we will constantly have to be winning games in the 4th quarter like we have the last 2 years, where we lose about half them.
everyone's real concern should be how the offensive line play is.
cuz if mckinnie is gone for a while and hicks blow, and cook is still erratic, and teams are stacking to stop the run, we aren't gonna stand a chance to throw the football even if we tom brady was our qb.



Wow I was just commenting on how our defense could win a superbowl whether our passing game was a big part of our offense or not, you can try to turn that into a T-Jack argument all you want.
Tell you what we'll have an argument in this thread, if I'm not posting in 5 minutes start without me.

ragz
04-26-2008, 02:43 AM
"Schutz" wrote:


"ragz" wrote:


"Schutz" wrote:


"VikingsMB" wrote:


Trent Dilfer won the Superbowl.
He is not really synonymous
with great Superbowl QB's.
The defense could be good enough to improve into the top 5 D's.
We need our guy to adhere to the playbook.

a) Hand it to AP
b) Hand it to CT
c) Throw down the seam to Wade
d) Chuck it every now and then to Berrian
e) Flag it out to Rice

but mostly a) and b)



We could win as a defensive team, it's just that our defense would have to be a competly shut down unit.
The Ravens super bowl defense was one of the all time best, we'd have to have the same kind of defense to win without a game controlling QB.
If Allen allows our pass defense to greatly improve I could see us winning 12 games even if T-Jack never passed the ball all season.

totally.
i mean grossman, delhomme, eli, were awesome game managers who made no mistakes and had baltimore shut down, dont give up a point defenses. that's why they went to the super bowl!


can you smell the sarcasm.

i know you guys like to label tavaris as the equivalent of having a special olympic athlete playing qb, but he has ability, more weapons , and hopefully a defense that gets off the field on 3rd downs this year.
if you remember correctly, it was our conservative hand the ball off and throw 10 times a game management that got us off to a 3-6 start.
so if we stand any chance of going somewhere we have to be balanced.
if we sit around and wait till its too late to keep teams honest we will constantly have to be winning games in the 4th quarter like we have the last 2 years, where we lose about half them.
everyone's real concern should be how the offensive line play is.
cuz if mckinnie is gone for a while and hicks blow, and cook is still erratic, and teams are stacking to stop the run, we aren't gonna stand a chance to throw the football even if we tom brady was our qb.




Wow I was just commenting on how our defense could win a superbowl whether our passing game was a big part of our offense or not, you can try to turn that into a T-Jack argument all you want.
Tell you what we'll have an argument in this thread, if I'm not posting in 5 minutes start without me.

come on pal.
just like you can sense my sarcasm, i can sense your complete lack of confidence in tjack. its okay though.
i know you are still upset cuz it doesnt look like the vikes are drafting brian brohm with the number 17 pick anymore, considering we traded it.
maybe he'll be around in the 2nd round and we ignore our other holes there and pluck him up.
and i guess none of my other points that i made in my post made any sense right?

Schutz
04-26-2008, 02:53 AM
"ragz" wrote:


"Schutz" wrote:


"ragz" wrote:


"Schutz" wrote:


"VikingsMB" wrote:


Trent Dilfer won the Superbowl.
He is not really synonymous
with great Superbowl QB's.
The defense could be good enough to improve into the top 5 D's.
We need our guy to adhere to the playbook.

a) Hand it to AP
b) Hand it to CT
c) Throw down the seam to Wade
d) Chuck it every now and then to Berrian
e) Flag it out to Rice

but mostly a) and b)



We could win as a defensive team, it's just that our defense would have to be a competly shut down unit.
The Ravens super bowl defense was one of the all time best, we'd have to have the same kind of defense to win without a game controlling QB.
If Allen allows our pass defense to greatly improve I could see us winning 12 games even if T-Jack never passed the ball all season.

totally.
i mean grossman, delhomme, eli, were awesome game managers who made no mistakes and had baltimore shut down, dont give up a point defenses. that's why they went to the super bowl!


can you smell the sarcasm.

i know you guys like to label tavaris as the equivalent of having a special olympic athlete playing qb, but he has ability, more weapons , and hopefully a defense that gets off the field on 3rd downs this year.
if you remember correctly, it was our conservative hand the ball off and throw 10 times a game management that got us off to a 3-6 start.
so if we stand any chance of going somewhere we have to be balanced.
if we sit around and wait till its too late to keep teams honest we will constantly have to be winning games in the 4th quarter like we have the last 2 years, where we lose about half them.
everyone's real concern should be how the offensive line play is.
cuz if mckinnie is gone for a while and hicks blow, and cook is still erratic, and teams are stacking to stop the run, we aren't gonna stand a chance to throw the football even if we tom brady was our qb.



Wow I was just commenting on how our defense could win a superbowl whether our passing game was a big part of our offense or not, you can try to turn that into a T-Jack argument all you want.
Tell you what we'll have an argument in this thread, if I'm not posting in 5 minutes start without me.

come on pal.
just like you can sense my sarcasm, i can sense your complete lack of confidence in tjack. its okay though.
i know you are still upset cuz it doesnt look like the vikes are drafting brian brohm with the number 17 pick anymore, considering we traded it.
maybe he'll be around in the 2nd round and we ignore our other holes there and pluck him up.
and i guess none of my other points that i made in my post made any sense right?




Yes I'm heart broken we got Jared Allen instead of Brohm, crying right now.
::)
The reason I ignored your other points is frankly I don't give two craps.
I wasn't commenting on that stuff nor do I care to right now, I simply was saying a defense without a star QB can win superbowls just like the Ravens.
Like I care that you think T-Jack is the golden boy, I have my opinion of the whole thing and you have yours.
I just know you simply go off the deep end as soon as somebody mentions the name of our starting QB.
Some people might call it trolling, I just don't care either way.
Although I do constantly enjoy you thinking I am heartbroken over the going ons of Brohm, I've stated I thought he'd be a good pickup and then you just babble on and on like anybody who likes Brohm is some sort of homer fanboy.
Just keep on doing the same old routine you do every night, it's just as awesome as usual.

Here hold on I'll make your next post for you.

Blah blah blah, *vaguely insulting comment about my opinion* blah blah blah T-Jack, blah blah blah.

ragz
04-26-2008, 03:07 AM
"Schutz" wrote:


"ragz" wrote:


"Schutz" wrote:


"ragz" wrote:


"Schutz" wrote:




Trent Dilfer won the Superbowl.
He is not really synonymous
with great Superbowl QB's.
The defense could be good enough to improve into the top 5 D's.
We need our guy to adhere to the playbook.

a) Hand it to AP
b) Hand it to CT
c) Throw down the seam to Wade
d) Chuck it every now and then to Berrian
e) Flag it out to Rice

but mostly a) and b)



We could win as a defensive team, it's just that our defense would have to be a competly shut down unit.
The Ravens super bowl defense was one of the all time best, we'd have to have the same kind of defense to win without a game controlling QB.
If Allen allows our pass defense to greatly improve I could see us winning 12 games even if T-Jack never passed the ball all season.

totally.
i mean grossman, delhomme, eli, were awesome game managers who made no mistakes and had baltimore shut down, dont give up a point defenses. that's why they went to the super bowl!


can you smell the sarcasm.

i know you guys like to label tavaris as the equivalent of having a special olympic athlete playing qb, but he has ability, more weapons , and hopefully a defense that gets off the field on 3rd downs this year.
if you remember correctly, it was our conservative hand the ball off and throw 10 times a game management that got us off to a 3-6 start.
so if we stand any chance of going somewhere we have to be balanced.
if we sit around and wait till its too late to keep teams honest we will constantly have to be winning games in the 4th quarter like we have the last 2 years, where we lose about half them.
everyone's real concern should be how the offensive line play is.
cuz if mckinnie is gone for a while and hicks blow, and cook is still erratic, and teams are stacking to stop the run, we aren't gonna stand a chance to throw the football even if we tom brady was our qb.




Wow I was just commenting on how our defense could win a superbowl whether our passing game was a big part of our offense or not, you can try to turn that into a T-Jack argument all you want.
Tell you what we'll have an argument in this thread, if I'm not posting in 5 minutes start without me.

come on pal.
just like you can sense my sarcasm, i can sense your complete lack of confidence in tjack. its okay though.
i know you are still upset cuz it doesnt look like the vikes are drafting brian brohm with the number 17 pick anymore, considering we traded it.
maybe he'll be around in the 2nd round and we ignore our other holes there and pluck him up.
and i guess none of my other points that i made in my post made any sense right?




Yes I'm heart broken we got Jared Allen instead of Brohm, crying right now.

::)
The reason I ignored your other points is frankly I don't give two craps.
I wasn't commenting on that stuff nor do I care to right now, I simply was saying a defense without a star QB can win superbowls just like the Ravens.
Like I care that you think T-Jack is the golden boy, I have my opinion of the whole thing and you have yours.
I just know you simply go off the deep end as soon as somebody mentions the name of our starting QB.
Some people might call it trolling, I just don't care either way.
Although I do constantly enjoy you thinking I am heartbroken over the going ons of Brohm, I've stated I thought he'd be a good pickup and then you just babble on and on like anybody who likes Brohm is some sort of homer fanboy.
Just keep on doing the same old routine you do every night, it's just as awesome as usual.

Here hold on I'll make your next post for you.

Blah blah blah, *vaguely insulting comment about my opinion* blah blah blah T-Jack, blah blah blah.


oh that was creative.
i make a handful of points and all you see is tjack, so i wonder whos got the problem?
if you make a comment that suggests we could win without a pass being thrown, or without a game managing qb, or if we have ravens type defense, and i refute that, theres not need to get all touchy about it.
if your theory is we can win in spite of how bad our qb play is, i say its not going to happen.
if you can read the topic of the thread it says will jackson be good enough to win the super bowl.
not if he will be bad enough, but our defense will be good enough to win 12 games. it's not my fault the only points you can make is that you think jackson is bad, or that i'm right and you are overly sensative.

singersp
04-26-2008, 07:53 AM
"minvikes01" wrote:


Jackson isn't even good enough to get us into the playoffs, in fact, he is so bad, he could singlehandedly prevent us from making them.
We need a QB who isn't an absolute moron a cut above most D II qbs.



LOL! I love it when people think a QB is a bust/moron simply because his team didn't make the playoffs. Especially after just one year starting in the league.

How many great QB's have fit that bill since modern day football?

So if T-Jack isn't our guy, who do you think the Vikings should have acquired to start?

Just make sure whoever you list, took his team to the playoffs in his 1st year starting.

Mr Anderson
04-26-2008, 08:01 AM
The past few days I've seen this thread and the "Championship run?" thread in the top threads...

I've avoided them as long as possible, but finally broke down.

I have not read a single post in this thread, and will not.

All I can say is: Stop talking about the Super Bowl, all it can do is hurt us.

Stop making super bowl predictions, we don't want to look at ourselves as a super bowl contender. If we don't get there you will only be irrationally angry/disappointed.

Purple Floyd
04-26-2008, 09:04 AM
What I am interested in seeing is what type of team we ultimately put together and how it is maintained.

There has been quite a bit of talk about being able to win a SB with a non-franchise QB, but if you look at the teams mentioned(Most noticeably the Ravens and Bucs). There success was pretty short lived. They won a SB and then following that year and for the next several they had a hard time making the SB and even had problems getting back to the playoffs.

Compared that to the teams who have gone to multiple SB's and that have been competitive over a long period of time and you will see that those teams all had a high quality, long term QB that provided stability as he rest of the roster went through changes.

Take a look at the teams that went to or won SB's in close succession since 1980 and you will find that overwhelmingly those teams had a franchise QB.

- SF
(Twice Montana run and Young run)
-Dallas
-Buffalo
-GB
-Denver
-NE
-StL

Now, in that time span there were a few exceptions to that rule, most obvious being the Washington Redskins who won a SB with Dumbass, Williams and later Rypien. Although those were spread out and neither of the final 2 had a lick of success after their run which leads me to put them into the latter category. Also in there would be the G-men who won with Simms once and then later won with Hostetler who filled in for an injured Simms and then followed up his SB with with a career of disappointment.

So what I am hoping is that the FO is building the team to stay strong for a long run and that the QB they have selected turns out to be one of the few that have been able to lead their team to the promised land on more than one occasion.

DustinDupont
04-26-2008, 09:12 AM
"singersp" wrote:


"minvikes01" wrote:


Jackson isn't even good enough to get us into the playoffs, in fact, he is so bad, he could singlehandedly prevent us from making them.
We need a QB who isn't an absolute moron a cut above most D II qbs.



LOL! I love it when people think a QB is a bust/moron simply because his team didn't make the playoffs. Especially after just one year starting in the league.

How many great QB's have fit that bill since modern day football?

So if T-Jack isn't our guy, who do you think the Vikings should have acquired to start?

Just make sure whoever you list, took his team to the playoffs in his 1st year starting.


Good Post Singer!

I just hate when ppl blame everything on Tjack and nothing else

PackOne
04-26-2008, 10:33 AM
The answer to the question is uh ... no.

tgorsegner
04-26-2008, 10:34 AM
"PackOne" wrote:


The answer to the question is uh ... no.


Would you care to back that up with anything?

Purple Floyd
04-26-2008, 10:37 AM
"tgorsegner" wrote:


"PackOne" wrote:


The answer to the question is uh ... no.


Would you care to back that up with anything?


He used "uh" What else do you need? ;D ;D

PackOne
04-26-2008, 10:38 AM
I meant duh then.

NodakPaul
04-26-2008, 10:49 AM
"PackOne" wrote:


I meant duh then.


Well at least the Packers are in the same boat.
Considering the pack couldn't even make it with Brett Favre (losing at home to a team that we destroyed too), what on earth makes anyone think that they can do it with Aaron Rodgers. Or should I say his backup, since he can't even stay healthy on the bench.
By the way, did you guys sign Culpepper yet?

Marrdro
04-26-2008, 10:51 AM
"PackOne" wrote:


The answer to the question is uh ... no.

I thought Pack was gonna bring some guys over that were articulate and could make a few decent points that we could pick apart.

"No" just doesn't cut the mustard if you ask me.
;D

NodakPaul
04-26-2008, 10:53 AM
"Marrdro" wrote:


"PackOne" wrote:


The answer to the question is uh ... no.

I thought Pack was gonna bring some guys over that were articulate and could make a few decent points that we could pick apart.

"No" just doesn't cut the mustard if you ask me.
;D


We can cut him some slack.
He is doing his best to impersonate a troll.
Luckily we know that despite his best efforts, he is not really an asshole... ;)

Marrdro
04-26-2008, 10:54 AM
"NodakPaul" wrote:


"Marrdro" wrote:


"PackOne" wrote:


The answer to the question is uh ... no.

I thought Pack was gonna bring some guys over that were articulate and could make a few decent points that we could pick apart.

"No" just doesn't cut the mustard if you ask me.

;D


We can cut him some slack.
He is doing his best to impersonate a troll.
Luckily we know that despite his best efforts, he is not really an donkey butt... ;)
How the hell you gonna cut live to my Warroom if you aren't at Winter Park?

PackOne
04-26-2008, 10:56 AM
"Marrdro" wrote:


"PackOne" wrote:


The answer to the question is uh ... no.

I thought Pack was gonna bring some guys over that were articulate and could make a few decent points that we could pick apart.

"No" just doesn't cut the mustard if you ask me.

;D


Many a writer have found little need to articulate.

"He has never been known to use a word that might send a reader to the dictionary."
- William Faulkner (about Ernest Hemingway)

NodakPaul
04-26-2008, 10:56 AM
"Marrdro" wrote:


"NodakPaul" wrote:


"Marrdro" wrote:


"PackOne" wrote:


The answer to the question is uh ... no.

I thought Pack was gonna bring some guys over that were articulate and could make a few decent points that we could pick apart.

"No" just doesn't cut the mustard if you ask me.
;D


We can cut him some slack.
He is doing his best to impersonate a troll.
Luckily we know that despite his best efforts, he is not really an donkey butt... ;)
How the hell you gonna cut live to my Warroom if you aren't at Winter Park?


LOL.
I know.
This is the first year in a few that I haven't been on the radio.
Sucks.

Schutz
04-26-2008, 01:09 PM
"ragz" wrote:


"Schutz" wrote:


"ragz" wrote:


"Schutz" wrote:


"ragz" wrote:






Trent Dilfer won the Superbowl.
He is not really synonymous
with great Superbowl QB's.
The defense could be good enough to improve into the top 5 D's.
We need our guy to adhere to the playbook.

a) Hand it to AP
b) Hand it to CT
c) Throw down the seam to Wade
d) Chuck it every now and then to Berrian
e) Flag it out to Rice

but mostly a) and b)



We could win as a defensive team, it's just that our defense would have to be a competly shut down unit.
The Ravens super bowl defense was one of the all time best, we'd have to have the same kind of defense to win without a game controlling QB.
If Allen allows our pass defense to greatly improve I could see us winning 12 games even if T-Jack never passed the ball all season.

totally.
i mean grossman, delhomme, eli, were awesome game managers who made no mistakes and had baltimore shut down, dont give up a point defenses. that's why they went to the super bowl!


can you smell the sarcasm.

i know you guys like to label tavaris as the equivalent of having a special olympic athlete playing qb, but he has ability, more weapons , and hopefully a defense that gets off the field on 3rd downs this year.
if you remember correctly, it was our conservative hand the ball off and throw 10 times a game management that got us off to a 3-6 start.
so if we stand any chance of going somewhere we have to be balanced.
if we sit around and wait till its too late to keep teams honest we will constantly have to be winning games in the 4th quarter like we have the last 2 years, where we lose about half them.
everyone's real concern should be how the offensive line play is.
cuz if mckinnie is gone for a while and hicks blow, and cook is still erratic, and teams are stacking to stop the run, we aren't gonna stand a chance to throw the football even if we tom brady was our qb.



Wow I was just commenting on how our defense could win a superbowl whether our passing game was a big part of our offense or not, you can try to turn that into a T-Jack argument all you want.
Tell you what we'll have an argument in this thread, if I'm not posting in 5 minutes start without me.

come on pal.
just like you can sense my sarcasm, i can sense your complete lack of confidence in tjack. its okay though.
i know you are still upset cuz it doesnt look like the vikes are drafting brian brohm with the number 17 pick anymore, considering we traded it.
maybe he'll be around in the 2nd round and we ignore our other holes there and pluck him up.
and i guess none of my other points that i made in my post made any sense right?




Yes I'm heart broken we got Jared Allen instead of Brohm, crying right now.
::)
The reason I ignored your other points is frankly I don't give two craps.
I wasn't commenting on that stuff nor do I care to right now, I simply was saying a defense without a star QB can win superbowls just like the Ravens.
Like I care that you think T-Jack is the golden boy, I have my opinion of the whole thing and you have yours.
I just know you simply go off the deep end as soon as somebody mentions the name of our starting QB.
Some people might call it trolling, I just don't care either way.
Although I do constantly enjoy you thinking I am heartbroken over the going ons of Brohm, I've stated I thought he'd be a good pickup and then you just babble on and on like anybody who likes Brohm is some sort of homer fanboy.
Just keep on doing the same old routine you do every night, it's just as awesome as usual.

Here hold on I'll make your next post for you.

Blah blah blah, *vaguely insulting comment about my opinion* blah blah blah T-Jack, blah blah blah.


oh that was creative.
i make a handful of points and all you see is tjack, so i wonder whos got the problem?
if you make a comment that suggests we could win without a pass being thrown, or without a game managing qb, or if we have ravens type defense, and i refute that, theres not need to get all touchy about it.
if your theory is we can win in spite of how bad our qb play is, i say its not going to happen.
if you can read the topic of the thread it says will jackson be good enough to win the super bowl.
not if he will be bad enough, but our defense will be good enough to win 12 games. it's not my fault the only points you can make is that you think jackson is bad, or that i'm right and you are overly sensative.


Blah blah blah, *vaguely insulting comment about my opinion* blah blah blah T-Jack, blah blah blah.


Wow and I called it.
;D

Prophet
04-26-2008, 01:13 PM
"PackOne" wrote:


"Marrdro" wrote:


"PackOne" wrote:


The answer to the question is uh ... no.

I thought Pack was gonna bring some guys over that were articulate and could make a few decent points that we could pick apart.

"No" just doesn't cut the mustard if you ask me.

;D


Many a writer have found little need to articulate.

"He has never been known to use a word that might send a reader to the dictionary."
- William Faulkner (about Ernest Hemingway)


Excellent quote, but Hemingway could have written circles around Faulkner any day of the week.

NodakPaul
04-26-2008, 01:45 PM
"Schutz" wrote:


"ragz" wrote:


"Schutz" wrote:


"ragz" wrote:


"Schutz" wrote:








Trent Dilfer won the Superbowl.
He is not really synonymous
with great Superbowl QB's.
The defense could be good enough to improve into the top 5 D's.
We need our guy to adhere to the playbook.

a) Hand it to AP
b) Hand it to CT
c) Throw down the seam to Wade
d) Chuck it every now and then to Berrian
e) Flag it out to Rice

but mostly a) and b)



We could win as a defensive team, it's just that our defense would have to be a competly shut down unit.
The Ravens super bowl defense was one of the all time best, we'd have to have the same kind of defense to win without a game controlling QB.
If Allen allows our pass defense to greatly improve I could see us winning 12 games even if T-Jack never passed the ball all season.

totally.
i mean grossman, delhomme, eli, were awesome game managers who made no mistakes and had baltimore shut down, dont give up a point defenses. that's why they went to the super bowl!


can you smell the sarcasm.

i know you guys like to label tavaris as the equivalent of having a special olympic athlete playing qb, but he has ability, more weapons , and hopefully a defense that gets off the field on 3rd downs this year.
if you remember correctly, it was our conservative hand the ball off and throw 10 times a game management that got us off to a 3-6 start.
so if we stand any chance of going somewhere we have to be balanced.
if we sit around and wait till its too late to keep teams honest we will constantly have to be winning games in the 4th quarter like we have the last 2 years, where we lose about half them.
everyone's real concern should be how the offensive line play is.
cuz if mckinnie is gone for a while and hicks blow, and cook is still erratic, and teams are stacking to stop the run, we aren't gonna stand a chance to throw the football even if we tom brady was our qb.



Wow I was just commenting on how our defense could win a superbowl whether our passing game was a big part of our offense or not, you can try to turn that into a T-Jack argument all you want.
Tell you what we'll have an argument in this thread, if I'm not posting in 5 minutes start without me.

come on pal.
just like you can sense my sarcasm, i can sense your complete lack of confidence in tjack. its okay though.
i know you are still upset cuz it doesnt look like the vikes are drafting brian brohm with the number 17 pick anymore, considering we traded it.
maybe he'll be around in the 2nd round and we ignore our other holes there and pluck him up.
and i guess none of my other points that i made in my post made any sense right?




Yes I'm heart broken we got Jared Allen instead of Brohm, crying right now.
::)
The reason I ignored your other points is frankly I don't give two craps.
I wasn't commenting on that stuff nor do I care to right now, I simply was saying a defense without a star QB can win superbowls just like the Ravens.
Like I care that you think T-Jack is the golden boy, I have my opinion of the whole thing and you have yours.
I just know you simply go off the deep end as soon as somebody mentions the name of our starting QB.
Some people might call it trolling, I just don't care either way.
Although I do constantly enjoy you thinking I am heartbroken over the going ons of Brohm, I've stated I thought he'd be a good pickup and then you just babble on and on like anybody who likes Brohm is some sort of homer fanboy.
Just keep on doing the same old routine you do every night, it's just as awesome as usual.

Here hold on I'll make your next post for you.

Blah blah blah, *vaguely insulting comment about my opinion* blah blah blah T-Jack, blah blah blah.


oh that was creative.
i make a handful of points and all you see is tjack, so i wonder whos got the problem?
if you make a comment that suggests we could win without a pass being thrown, or without a game managing qb, or if we have ravens type defense, and i refute that, theres not need to get all touchy about it.
if your theory is we can win in spite of how bad our qb play is, i say its not going to happen.
if you can read the topic of the thread it says will jackson be good enough to win the super bowl.
not if he will be bad enough, but our defense will be good enough to win 12 games. it's not my fault the only points you can make is that you think jackson is bad, or that i'm right and you are overly sensative.


Blah blah blah, *vaguely insulting comment about my opinion* blah blah blah T-Jack, blah blah blah.


Wow and I called it.
;D


LMFAO!

Garland Greene
04-27-2008, 12:28 PM
"NodakPaul" wrote:


"Schutz" wrote:


"ragz" wrote:


"Schutz" wrote:


"ragz" wrote:










Trent Dilfer won the Superbowl.
He is not really synonymous
with great Superbowl QB's.
The defense could be good enough to improve into the top 5 D's.
We need our guy to adhere to the playbook.

a) Hand it to AP
b) Hand it to CT
c) Throw down the seam to Wade
d) Chuck it every now and then to Berrian
e) Flag it out to Rice

but mostly a) and b)



We could win as a defensive team, it's just that our defense would have to be a competly shut down unit.
The Ravens super bowl defense was one of the all time best, we'd have to have the same kind of defense to win without a game controlling QB.
If Allen allows our pass defense to greatly improve I could see us winning 12 games even if T-Jack never passed the ball all season.

totally.
i mean grossman, delhomme, eli, were awesome game managers who made no mistakes and had baltimore shut down, dont give up a point defenses. that's why they went to the super bowl!


can you smell the sarcasm.

i know you guys like to label tavaris as the equivalent of having a special olympic athlete playing qb, but he has ability, more weapons , and hopefully a defense that gets off the field on 3rd downs this year.
if you remember correctly, it was our conservative hand the ball off and throw 10 times a game management that got us off to a 3-6 start.
so if we stand any chance of going somewhere we have to be balanced.
if we sit around and wait till its too late to keep teams honest we will constantly have to be winning games in the 4th quarter like we have the last 2 years, where we lose about half them.
everyone's real concern should be how the offensive line play is.
cuz if mckinnie is gone for a while and hicks blow, and cook is still erratic, and teams are stacking to stop the run, we aren't gonna stand a chance to throw the football even if we tom brady was our qb.



Wow I was just commenting on how our defense could win a superbowl whether our passing game was a big part of our offense or not, you can try to turn that into a T-Jack argument all you want.
Tell you what we'll have an argument in this thread, if I'm not posting in 5 minutes start without me.

come on pal.
just like you can sense my sarcasm, i can sense your complete lack of confidence in tjack. its okay though.
i know you are still upset cuz it doesnt look like the vikes are drafting brian brohm with the number 17 pick anymore, considering we traded it.
maybe he'll be around in the 2nd round and we ignore our other holes there and pluck him up.
and i guess none of my other points that i made in my post made any sense right?




Yes I'm heart broken we got Jared Allen instead of Brohm, crying right now.
::)
The reason I ignored your other points is frankly I don't give two craps.
I wasn't commenting on that stuff nor do I care to right now, I simply was saying a defense without a star QB can win superbowls just like the Ravens.
Like I care that you think T-Jack is the golden boy, I have my opinion of the whole thing and you have yours.
I just know you simply go off the deep end as soon as somebody mentions the name of our starting QB.
Some people might call it trolling, I just don't care either way.
Although I do constantly enjoy you thinking I am heartbroken over the going ons of Brohm, I've stated I thought he'd be a good pickup and then you just babble on and on like anybody who likes Brohm is some sort of homer fanboy.
Just keep on doing the same old routine you do every night, it's just as awesome as usual.

Here hold on I'll make your next post for you.

Blah blah blah, *vaguely insulting comment about my opinion* blah blah blah T-Jack, blah blah blah.


oh that was creative.
i make a handful of points and all you see is tjack, so i wonder whos got the problem?
if you make a comment that suggests we could win without a pass being thrown, or without a game managing qb, or if we have ravens type defense, and i refute that, theres not need to get all touchy about it.
if your theory is we can win in spite of how bad our qb play is, i say its not going to happen.
if you can read the topic of the thread it says will jackson be good enough to win the super bowl.
not if he will be bad enough, but our defense will be good enough to win 12 games. it's not my fault the only points you can make is that you think jackson is bad, or that i'm right and you are overly sensative.


Blah blah blah, *vaguely insulting comment about my opinion* blah blah blah T-Jack, blah blah blah.


Wow and I called it.
;D


LMFAO!


I thought I was the only one to be negative of TJack :)

singersp
04-28-2008, 05:54 AM
Vikings’ success is all on Jackson (http://www.marshallindependent.com/page/content.detail/id/501256.html?nav=5021)

Andy Rennecke
marshallindependent.com

POSTED: April 26, 2008


It’s weird what a difference a year makes, though. At this time last year people were wondering what the Vikings were going to do if Peterson was still around.....

Prophet
04-28-2008, 07:23 AM
"singersp" wrote:


Vikings’ success is all on Jackson (http://www.marshallindependent.com/page/content.detail/id/501256.html?nav=5021)

Andy Rennecke
marshallindependent.com

POSTED: April 26, 2008


It’s weird what a difference a year makes, though. At this time last year people were wondering what the Vikings were going to do if Peterson was still around.....


It's even weirder when myopic asshats think that the success/failure of a team rides on a single person.

vike_mike
04-28-2008, 11:42 AM
If Eli Manning can win the Bowl, then definitely T-Jack can do it.
Take a look at the Vikes-Giants game.
We can do it.
Tyrell Johnson is going to be a good one.
Wish we would have drafted Dennis Dixon instead though.
We will be set at QB.

singersp
04-28-2008, 07:23 PM
"vike_mike" wrote:


If Eli Manning can win the Bowl, then definitely T-Jack can do it.
Take a look at the Vikes-Giants game.
We can do it.
Tyrell Johnson is going to be a good one.
Wish we would have drafted Dennis Dixon instead though.
We will be set at QB.



If Grossman can take the Bears to the big dance, anything is possible.
;)

midgensa
04-28-2008, 07:39 PM
Well let's see ... I figure The Dolphins, Bills, Jets, Bengals, Chiefs, Raiders, Lions, Bears and Falcons have NO chance of winning the Super Bowl (not really at least). And the Ravens, Texans, Broncos, 49ers, Rams, Cardinals, Bucs and Panthers are a minimal chance. So that pretty much eliminates 9-17 teams ... so lets eliminate 13 to be fair.
T-Jack has a 1/19 chance to lead us to the Super Bowl title!

ragz
04-28-2008, 10:42 PM
"Schutz" wrote:


"ragz" wrote:


"Schutz" wrote:


"ragz" wrote:


"Schutz" wrote:








Trent Dilfer won the Superbowl.
He is not really synonymous
with great Superbowl QB's.
The defense could be good enough to improve into the top 5 D's.
We need our guy to adhere to the playbook.

a) Hand it to AP
b) Hand it to CT
c) Throw down the seam to Wade
d) Chuck it every now and then to Berrian
e) Flag it out to Rice

but mostly a) and b)



We could win as a defensive team, it's just that our defense would have to be a competly shut down unit.
The Ravens super bowl defense was one of the all time best, we'd have to have the same kind of defense to win without a game controlling QB.
If Allen allows our pass defense to greatly improve I could see us winning 12 games even if T-Jack never passed the ball all season.

totally.
i mean grossman, delhomme, eli, were awesome game managers who made no mistakes and had baltimore shut down, dont give up a point defenses. that's why they went to the super bowl!


can you smell the sarcasm.

i know you guys like to label tavaris as the equivalent of having a special olympic athlete playing qb, but he has ability, more weapons , and hopefully a defense that gets off the field on 3rd downs this year.
if you remember correctly, it was our conservative hand the ball off and throw 10 times a game management that got us off to a 3-6 start.
so if we stand any chance of going somewhere we have to be balanced.
if we sit around and wait till its too late to keep teams honest we will constantly have to be winning games in the 4th quarter like we have the last 2 years, where we lose about half them.
everyone's real concern should be how the offensive line play is.
cuz if mckinnie is gone for a while and hicks blow, and cook is still erratic, and teams are stacking to stop the run, we aren't gonna stand a chance to throw the football even if we tom brady was our qb.




Wow I was just commenting on how our defense could win a superbowl whether our passing game was a big part of our offense or not, you can try to turn that into a T-Jack argument all you want.
Tell you what we'll have an argument in this thread, if I'm not posting in 5 minutes start without me.

come on pal.
just like you can sense my sarcasm, i can sense your complete lack of confidence in tjack. its okay though.
i know you are still upset cuz it doesnt look like the vikes are drafting brian brohm with the number 17 pick anymore, considering we traded it.
maybe he'll be around in the 2nd round and we ignore our other holes there and pluck him up.
and i guess none of my other points that i made in my post made any sense right?




Yes I'm heart broken we got Jared Allen instead of Brohm, crying right now.

::)
The reason I ignored your other points is frankly I don't give two craps.
I wasn't commenting on that stuff nor do I care to right now, I simply was saying a defense without a star QB can win superbowls just like the Ravens.
Like I care that you think T-Jack is the golden boy, I have my opinion of the whole thing and you have yours.
I just know you simply go off the deep end as soon as somebody mentions the name of our starting QB.
Some people might call it trolling, I just don't care either way.
Although I do constantly enjoy you thinking I am heartbroken over the going ons of Brohm, I've stated I thought he'd be a good pickup and then you just babble on and on like anybody who likes Brohm is some sort of homer fanboy.
Just keep on doing the same old routine you do every night, it's just as awesome as usual.

Here hold on I'll make your next post for you.

Blah blah blah, *vaguely insulting comment about my opinion* blah blah blah T-Jack, blah blah blah.


oh that was creative.
i make a handful of points and all you see is tjack, so i wonder whos got the problem?
if you make a comment that suggests we could win without a pass being thrown, or without a game managing qb, or if we have ravens type defense, and i refute that, theres not need to get all touchy about it.
if your theory is we can win in spite of how bad our qb play is, i say its not going to happen.
if you can read the topic of the thread it says will jackson be good enough to win the super bowl.
not if he will be bad enough, but our defense will be good enough to win 12 games. it's not my fault the only points you can make is that you think jackson is bad, or that i'm right and you are overly sensative.


Blah blah blah, *vaguely insulting comment about my opinion* blah blah blah T-Jack, blah blah blah.


Wow and I called it.
;D

i guess when you cant win a discussion you resort to blah blahs.
sounds like something a women would do.

singersp
04-28-2008, 10:53 PM
"ragz" wrote:


i guess when you cant win a discussion you resort to blah blahs.
sounds like something a woman would do.


No, you just wouldn't be getting any.

ragz
04-28-2008, 10:55 PM
"singersp" wrote:


"ragz" wrote:


i guess when you cant win a discussion you resort to blah blahs.
sounds like something a woman would do.


No, you just wouldn't be getting any.

i'm okay with that.
i dont think me and schutz have that kinda relationship

Marrdro
05-09-2008, 04:09 AM
Hold the Booty calls; it’s Jackson’s job to lose
Thursday, May 08, 2008 | Posted by Mike Schoemer

Everyone knows that the most popular player on an NFL franchise that’s struggling on offense is the backup quarterback. The pitch usually hits fever level when said backup is a rookie.

Such is the case with John David Booty, who sounds like he could target a president (the three-name thing) as quickly as he could target a streaking Sidney Rice down the sidelines.

http://www.realfootball365.com/index.php/articles/vikings/11160

Marrdro
05-09-2008, 04:24 AM
Nevertheless, the starting job remains Jackson’s to lose. He has an all-world running game bolstered by Adrian Peterson and Chester Taylor behind him. He has a solid offensive line (with or without Bryant McKinnie). Finally, he now has a respectable receiving corps.


Throw in the 8-4 record and it says it all right thar now doesn't it ya'all.
;D

StillPurple
05-09-2008, 03:38 PM
I really don't care that much who starts at QB, as long as we win.

I also think that the Giants showed how to do it:

a. QB is not egotistical with his decisions (i.e. he doesn't do what Favre did last year, throw ridiculous high-risk passes to showboat in the playoffs, thereby sinking his team, unless he has to !). Eli threw some high-risk passes, but only on 3rd and XXX, i.e. he had to.

b. Good defense.
c. A brutal, punishing running game, with two very good running backs.

Guess which "other" NFC team can do this, IMO ?!!
;D

nailhead77
05-09-2008, 10:02 PM
I see a lot of low scoring games this year.
All jackson has to do is not make the big mistake and we'll be fine.

midgensa
05-09-2008, 10:15 PM
Yeah ... I think there could be some low scoring games, but I think our offense is going to be a lot more effective than people think.
I think T-Jack will be very capable, maybe not a pro-bowler, but solid enough to get the job done. He will put up numbers better than most think. I also think our running game will be EVEN better with All Day having a year under his belt as he will be more dangerous in other facets (blocking, pass receiving) and that should loosen up the running game as well.
All in all though, Jackson's job will be to avoid key mistakes, and I think he is ready to take that step.

ragz
05-10-2008, 12:55 AM
the thing is, all i ever hear about jackson is he has to avoid the big mistake.
if i recall correctly i dont remember him making all these huge mistakes that cost us games.
if anything we just didn't produce enough points and make our passing game effective enough to move the football and get points.
of his picks, how many went back for tds, how many were in the redzone, how many points scored off of his picks by the other team?
he didn't really make the big mistake last year in the games we lost, most times we were too conservative and we didn't move the ball enough to score enough.
maybe we were protecting him which i think is a bad move if you want a qb to develop, but either way, that is what's gonna have to improve if we are legit.
we can win some games 10-7 if our defense turns out to be that good, but new orleans, dallas, new york, maybe even green bay can score some points so defense and running are not gonna cut it alone.

midgensa
05-10-2008, 01:10 AM
"ragz" wrote:


the thing is, all i ever hear about jackson is he has to avoid the big mistake.
if i recall correctly i dont remember him making all these huge mistakes that cost us games.
if anything we just didn't produce enough points and make our passing game effective enough to move the football and get points.
of his picks, how many went back for tds, how many were in the redzone, how many points scored off of his picks by the other team?
he didn't really make the big mistake last year in the games we lost, most times we were too conservative and we didn't move the ball enough to score enough.
maybe we were protecting him which i think is a bad move if you want a qb to develop, but either way, that is what's gonna have to improve if we are legit.
we can win some games 10-7 if our defense turns out to be that good, but new orleans, dallas, new york, maybe even green bay can score some points so defense and running are not gonna cut it alone.




He made some pretty big mistakes. In the first game against the Lions he threw FOUR interceptions. We lost that game in OVERTIME ... a win that would have been huge to us was lost because of his inability to keep the ball. The turnovers that really hurt us ...

Turnover No. 1
3rd and 1 at DET 25 (9:29) T.Jackson pass short middle intended for J.Kleinsasser INTERCEPTED by S.Cody (G.Alexander) at DET 22. S.Cody to DET 20 for -2 yards (B.Wade).
We are in field goal range and he takes out of any chance to get any points.

Turnover No. 2
3rd and 8 at MIN 15 (15:00) (Shotgun) T.Jackson pass deep left intended for R.Ferguson INTERCEPTED by K.Smith at MIN 44. K.Smith to MIN 39 for 5 yards (M.Moore).
Minnesota challenged the runner was down by contact ruling, and the play was REVERSED.
(Shotgun) T.Jackson pass deep left intended for R.Ferguson INTERCEPTED by K.Smith at DET 49. K.Smith to DET 49 for no gain (M.Moore).
He throws TWO picks but gets one reversed. The second gives the Lions the ball at the 49 and allows them to march down a short field to a 7-0 lead.

Turnover No. 3
1st and 10 at MIN 30 (13:42) T.Jackson pass deep middle intended for B.Wade INTERCEPTED by G.Alexander [D.White] at DET 35. G.Alexander to MIN 31 for 34 yards (A.Peterson).
This one puts the Lions at our 31 ... and gives them a really short field again. Shortly there after ... the Lions were in the end zone with a 17-7 lead.

All of those turnovers were crucial and arguably led to at least a 17 point swing in a game we lost in OT.

And of course ... in the biggest game of the year ... T-Jack made a couple of major mistakes against the Redskins in the dome.

On our second play from scrimmage:
2nd and 8 at MIN 39 (13:15) T.Jackson pass deep left intended for R.Ferguson INTERCEPTED by F.Smoot [R.Godfrey] at WAS 45. F.Smoot to MIN 8 for 47 yards (J.Kleinsasser).

Of course only five plays later this was a TD!, but it was reversed! and then we gave up a safety ... all precipitated by this interception.

And then in the second quarter:
2nd and 8 at MIN 22 (8:03) (Shotgun) T.Jackson pass intended for B.Wade INTERCEPTED by S.Springs [C.Griffin] at MIN 34. S.Springs to MIN 32 for 2 yards (B.Wade).

Two plays later it was 16-0 and the Vikes were shellshocked. They never recovered ... and went from playoffs to sitting at home in a matter of two quarters.

These are BIG mistakes made by a young QB. He does have to avoid these in order for us to win a few more games. Both of those games were seriously hurt by his play ... if we win those two games we obviously are in the playoffs ... so he needs to step it up this year. I actually happen to be one of those who thinks he will.

singersp
05-10-2008, 05:47 AM
"midgensa" wrote:


"ragz" wrote:


the thing is, all i ever hear about jackson is he has to avoid the big mistake.
if i recall correctly i dont remember him making all these huge mistakes that cost us games.
if anything we just didn't produce enough points and make our passing game effective enough to move the football and get points.
of his picks, how many went back for tds, how many were in the redzone, how many points scored off of his picks by the other team?
he didn't really make the big mistake last year in the games we lost, most times we were too conservative and we didn't move the ball enough to score enough.
maybe we were protecting him which i think is a bad move if you want a qb to develop, but either way, that is what's gonna have to improve if we are legit.
we can win some games 10-7 if our defense turns out to be that good, but new orleans, dallas, new york, maybe even green bay can score some points so defense and running are not gonna cut it alone.




He made some pretty big mistakes. In the first game against the Lions he threw FOUR interceptions. We lost that game in OVERTIME ... a win that would have been huge to us was lost because of his inability to keep the ball. The turnovers that really hurt us ...

Turnover No. 1
3rd and 1 at DET 25 (9:29) T.Jackson pass short middle intended for J.Kleinsasser INTERCEPTED by S.Cody (G.Alexander) at DET 22. S.Cody to DET 20 for -2 yards (B.Wade).
We are in field goal range and he takes out of any chance to get any points.

Turnover No. 2
3rd and 8 at MIN 15 (15:00) (Shotgun) T.Jackson pass deep left intended for R.Ferguson INTERCEPTED by K.Smith at MIN 44. K.Smith to MIN 39 for 5 yards (M.Moore).
Minnesota challenged the runner was down by contact ruling, and the play was REVERSED.
(Shotgun) T.Jackson pass deep left intended for R.Ferguson INTERCEPTED by K.Smith at DET 49. K.Smith to DET 49 for no gain (M.Moore).
He throws TWO picks but gets one reversed. The second gives the Lions the ball at the 49 and allows them to march down a short field to a 7-0 lead.

Turnover No. 3
1st and 10 at MIN 30 (13:42) T.Jackson pass deep middle intended for B.Wade INTERCEPTED by G.Alexander [D.White] at DET 35. G.Alexander to MIN 31 for 34 yards (A.Peterson).
This one puts the Lions at our 31 ... and gives them a really short field again. Shortly there after ... the Lions were in the end zone with a 17-7 lead.

All of those turnovers were crucial and arguably led to at least a 17 point swing in a game we lost in OT.

And of course ... in the biggest game of the year ... T-Jack made a couple of major mistakes against the Redskins in the dome.

On our second play from scrimmage:
2nd and 8 at MIN 39 (13:15) T.Jackson pass deep left intended for R.Ferguson INTERCEPTED by F.Smoot [R.Godfrey] at WAS 45. F.Smoot to MIN 8 for 47 yards (J.Kleinsasser).

Of course only five plays later this was a TD!, but it was reversed! and then we gave up a safety ... all precipitated by this interception.

And then in the second quarter:
2nd and 8 at MIN 22 (8:03) (Shotgun) T.Jackson pass intended for B.Wade INTERCEPTED by S.Springs [C.Griffin] at MIN 34. S.Springs to MIN 32 for 2 yards (B.Wade).

Two plays later it was 16-0 and the Vikes were shellshocked. They never recovered ... and went from playoffs to sitting at home in a matter of two quarters.

These are BIG mistakes made by a young QB. He does have to avoid these in order for us to win a few more games. Both of those games were seriously hurt by his play ... if we win those two games we obviously are in the playoffs ... so he needs to step it up this year. I actually happen to be one of those who thinks he will.



He already has made progress as it was one of the highlight films Childress showed in the Vikings media clinic


--A tape of quarterback Tarvaris Jackson, illustrating the progress he made last season through a series of missed passes or poor decisions that he made in early games but executed properly in later contests.

http://blogs.twincities.com/Vikings/2008/05/coaching_101_clinic.html

singersp
05-10-2008, 08:14 AM
Vikings' Positional Analysis: Quarterback (http://min.scout.com/2/753543.html)

By John Holler
scout.com

Posted May 9, 2008

Mr-holland
05-10-2008, 08:24 AM
Good read, it sums up what we all know.

TJ is the only one on the roster that should be #1.
He has shown that he is ( very capable ) of managing but he also can get us in trouble with the INT's

He is/was very raw even last season i still have faith that he will do good.

purplepowered
05-10-2008, 12:39 PM
I still say same ol same ol I didnt like the orig move but I do stick with what I said after I seen him at training camp....great kid talented and will be good QB....however great? yet to be seen....Love to be seeing him with great work ethic tho so far. Booty will push him more.

Marrdro
05-10-2008, 06:03 PM
One thing that has become evident over the last year is that Childress has tied his coaching legacy into the production that Jackson brings to the table.

That, right along with the one were they say Booty will push TJ to be better, are the lamest ass cliche's I've seen.

So your telling me that because the Chiller started a young raw QB instead of a Vet, he is tied to him?

What about the other rookies he started.
Is he tied to them as well?
If Cook fails is his coaching legacy tarnished?
Gimme a break.

Again, very lame.
::)

capt.hrod
05-10-2008, 06:55 PM
I'm hoping he will feel a little more comfortable sitting in the pocket and, not make those stupid mistakes. Its easiers said sitting in the stands or behind the TV though.

nephilimstorm
05-10-2008, 07:06 PM
we shall see...i still think TJack is bunk...that is always my thing...he can prove me wrong...hope he does..

Purple Floyd
05-10-2008, 07:34 PM
"Marrdro" wrote:



Nevertheless, the starting job remains Jackson’s to lose. He has an all-world running game bolstered by Adrian Peterson and Chester Taylor behind him. He has a solid offensive line (with or without Bryant McKinnie). Finally, he now has a respectable receiving corps.


Throw in the 8-4 record and it says it all right thar now doesn't it ya'all.
;D


Nope.

Schutz
05-10-2008, 07:44 PM
"Marrdro" wrote:



One thing that has become evident over the last year is that Childress has tied his coaching legacy into the production that Jackson brings to the table.

That, right along with the one were they say Booty will push TJ to be better, are the lamest jiggly butt cliche's I've seen.

So your telling me that because the Chiller started a young raw QB instead of a Vet, he is tied to him?

What about the other rookies he started.
Is he tied to them as well?
If Cook fails is his coaching legacy tarnished?
Gimme a break.

Again, very lame.
::)


Really, because I found your response rather lame.
Like it or not Childress's job may heavily rely on the play of T-Jack, yes he is in fact tied to him, T-Jack was "his guy" and the Vikings never went after a guy like Garcia.
I'm guessing Childress felt happy with T-Jack and then told the ownership he was, believe it or not Mar the FO does listen to the head coach.
So like I said, yes T-Jack is tied to Chilly Dawg wrong or right.


As for Booty, why don't you just give him time to push T-Jack to play better, you're already writing him off for the season and saying he can't play at T-Jack's level.
He's a rookie for crying out loud.
Oh wait, never mind that's just what you like to say about my opinion of T-Jack starting(replacing a couple words).

Lame indeed.

Marrdro
05-10-2008, 09:27 PM
"Schutz" wrote:


"Marrdro" wrote:



One thing that has become evident over the last year is that Childress has tied his coaching legacy into the production that Jackson brings to the table.

That, right along with the one were they say Booty will push TJ to be better, are the lamest jiggly butt cliche's I've seen.

So your telling me that because the Chiller started a young raw QB instead of a Vet, he is tied to him?

What about the other rookies he started.
Is he tied to them as well?
If Cook fails is his coaching legacy tarnished?
Gimme a break.

Again, very lame.
::)


Really, because I found your response rather lame.
Like it or not Childress's job may heavily rely on the play of T-Jack, yes he is in fact tied to him, T-Jack was "his guy" and the Vikings never went after a guy like Garcia.
I'm guessing Childress felt happy with T-Jack and then told the ownership he was, believe it or not Mar the FO does listen to the head coach.
So like I said, yes T-Jack is tied to Chilly Dawg wrong or right.


As for Booty, why don't you just give him time to push T-Jack to play better, you're already writing him off for the season and saying he can't play at T-Jack's level.
He's a rookie for crying out loud.
Oh wait, never mind that's just what you like to say about my opinion of T-Jack starting(replacing a couple words).

Lame indeed.

I would say it is tied more to the opinion of the owner and not specifically to one rookie out of how many that the staff has elected to start.
Like it or not the decision to go with TJ has been a staff decision and not just the Chiller.

(Key note:
I will give you props though.
At least your putting verbiage in your rebuttals that alude to the fact that it was a staff decision and not just the Chiller).

As for Booty, who the hell is writing him off.
Go find one damn place were I say something bad about the kid.....Me thinks you will find alot of stuff out of me that says he is a good fit.


My point is that TJ doesn't need another player on the roster to make him work harder and had has nothing to do with JDB's skill/prowess as a QB.
Show me someplace were TJ has said/or demonstrated that he can just sit back, take life easy and come in and start?

Lame indeed.
Maybe you should re-read my post.

Face it my friend.
You want the Chiller gone right along with TJ.
Until that happens you will keep reading things into my posts that just aren't there.
;D

IwearSox21
05-10-2008, 09:54 PM
I think that the addition BB will effect TJ more than everyone thinks. Randy Moss raised Brady's QB from 87.9 to 117.2 almost 30 points. TO brought Mcnabbs rating from 79.6 to 104.7 almost 25 points. javon Walker got brandon a 88.5 rating. Keenan McCardell and Eric Parker raised Drew Brees Qb rating from 67.5 to 104.8 almost 40 points. Im not saying that BB is Moss or TO. But i think that receivers have a much large effevt on QB's than everyone thinks.

midgensa
05-10-2008, 10:13 PM
"IwearSox21" wrote:


I think that the addition BB will effect TJ more than everyone thinks. Randy Moss raised Brady's QB from 87.9 to 117.2 almost 30 points. TO brought Mcnabbs rating from 79.6 to 104.7 almost 25 points. javon Walker got brandon a 88.5 rating. Keenan McCardell and Eric Parker raised Drew Brees Qb rating from 67.5 to 104.8 almost 40 points. Im not saying that BB is Moss or TO. But i think that receivers have a much large effevt on QB's than everyone thinks.


Uh Walker got who a higher rating? And Parker and McCardell? C'Mon. None-the-less I see what you are saying. I do think Berrian can help quite a bit, but he is definitely not even close to the league of Owens or Moss and T-Jack is nowhere near Brady or McNabb's caliber.

Purple Floyd
05-10-2008, 10:28 PM
"Marrdro" wrote:


"Schutz" wrote:


"Marrdro" wrote:



One thing that has become evident over the last year is that Childress has tied his coaching legacy into the production that Jackson brings to the table.

That, right along with the one were they say Booty will push TJ to be better, are the lamest jiggly butt cliche's I've seen.

So your telling me that because the Chiller started a young raw QB instead of a Vet, he is tied to him?

What about the other rookies he started.
Is he tied to them as well?
If Cook fails is his coaching legacy tarnished?
Gimme a break.

Again, very lame.
::)


Really, because I found your response rather lame.
Like it or not Childress's job may heavily rely on the play of T-Jack, yes he is in fact tied to him, T-Jack was "his guy" and the Vikings never went after a guy like Garcia.
I'm guessing Childress felt happy with T-Jack and then told the ownership he was, believe it or not Mar the FO does listen to the head coach.
So like I said, yes T-Jack is tied to Chilly Dawg wrong or right.


As for Booty, why don't you just give him time to push T-Jack to play better, you're already writing him off for the season and saying he can't play at T-Jack's level.
He's a rookie for crying out loud.
Oh wait, never mind that's just what you like to say about my opinion of T-Jack starting(replacing a couple words).

Lame indeed.

I would say it is tied more to the opinion of the owner and not specifically to one rookie out of how many that the staff has elected to start.
Like it or not the decision to go with TJ has been a staff decision and not just the Chiller.

(Key note:
I will give you props though.
At least your putting verbiage in your rebuttals that alude to the fact that it was a staff decision and not just the Chiller).

As for Booty, who the hell is writing him off.
Go find one damn place were I say something bad about the kid.....Me thinks you will find alot of stuff out of me that says he is a good fit.


My point is that TJ doesn't need another player on the roster to make him work harder and had has nothing to do with JDB's skill/prowess as a QB.
Show me someplace were TJ has said/or demonstrated that he can just sit back, take life easy and come in and start?

Lame indeed.
Maybe you should re-read my post.

Face it my friend.
You want the Chiller gone right along with TJ.
Until that happens you will keep reading things into my posts that just aren't there.
;D


From what I read of his posts, I don't get the impression that he wants childress gone or jackson to fail. What I see id that he wants the team to do well and if there is an area he has concern about, he questions it rather than taking the company line,which is also the way I feel.

Things like saying an 8-4 record solidifies a QB's place on a roster is no more correct than saying a QB from a top university is more prepared to play than a small school player because there are too many factors to consider.

Case-in-point.

I just watched the replay of the Cards- Bears game that got our old coach fired and if you look at those 2 teams you will see that Grossman had a terrible night and Leinart, although he had a few rookie mistakes, looked poised and actually led the team down to the 20 in the final 2 minutes to get into FG range(FG was missed).

Now that game displayed 2 things.

1) Grossman was the QB of a team that went 13-3 and went to the SB. Now, if you take the stance that an 8-4 record makes TJ qualified to be the unchallenged starter and that there is no need to worry about the position, then you would have to really rate Grossman up there at the top.

2) Leinart was a Rookie in that game and he played with poise and confidence. Although he did have an INT returned for a score, he kept in there and put the team in a position to win. They commentators were talking about how he was knocked for his arm strength but after seeing him play they admitted he had plenty to play in the NFL.


So to me that game itself does a good job of dispelling the notion that a rookie from USC couldn't start and be effective in the first year and it also made a strong case that a QB can be on a winning team and still not be worth a shit.

Don't confuse the fact that some people question a decision as a sign that they lack devotion to the team or the staff. ;)

StillPurple
05-11-2008, 12:51 AM
Today on ESPN radio, some guy called in an specifically asked about the Vikings. They said the following:

- Tarvaris Jackson is tough, works hard, and "has earned the respect of his teammates". In addition, he has a very strong arm, and is athletic. I would agree with all those statements.

At the same time, they said he is still more or less an "open question" as to what he will do.

I think this is true. I also think that the QB position is in no way, shape, or form, locked up for him. he has to earn it week to week, like every other player in the NFL.

Marrdro
05-11-2008, 07:21 PM
"UffDaVikes" wrote:


"Marrdro" wrote:


"Schutz" wrote:


"Marrdro" wrote:



One thing that has become evident over the last year is that Childress has tied his coaching legacy into the production that Jackson brings to the table.

That, right along with the one were they say Booty will push TJ to be better, are the lamest jiggly butt cliche's I've seen.

So your telling me that because the Chiller started a young raw QB instead of a Vet, he is tied to him?

What about the other rookies he started.
Is he tied to them as well?
If Cook fails is his coaching legacy tarnished?
Gimme a break.

Again, very lame.
::)


Really, because I found your response rather lame.
Like it or not Childress's job may heavily rely on the play of T-Jack, yes he is in fact tied to him, T-Jack was "his guy" and the Vikings never went after a guy like Garcia.
I'm guessing Childress felt happy with T-Jack and then told the ownership he was, believe it or not Mar the FO does listen to the head coach.
So like I said, yes T-Jack is tied to Chilly Dawg wrong or right.


As for Booty, why don't you just give him time to push T-Jack to play better, you're already writing him off for the season and saying he can't play at T-Jack's level.
He's a rookie for crying out loud.
Oh wait, never mind that's just what you like to say about my opinion of T-Jack starting(replacing a couple words).

Lame indeed.

I would say it is tied more to the opinion of the owner and not specifically to one rookie out of how many that the staff has elected to start.
Like it or not the decision to go with TJ has been a staff decision and not just the Chiller.

(Key note:
I will give you props though.
At least your putting verbiage in your rebuttals that alude to the fact that it was a staff decision and not just the Chiller).

As for Booty, who the hell is writing him off.
Go find one gol 'darnit place were I say something bad about the kid.....Me thinks you will find alot of stuff out of me that says he is a good fit.


My point is that TJ doesn't need another player on the roster to make him work harder and had has nothing to do with JDB's skill/prowess as a QB.
Show me someplace were TJ has said/or demonstrated that he can just sit back, take life easy and come in and start?

Lame indeed.
Maybe you should re-read my post.

Face it my friend.
You want the Chiller gone right along with TJ.
Until that happens you will keep reading things into my posts that just aren't there.

;D


From what I read of his posts, I don't get the impression that he wants childress gone or jackson to fail. What I see id that he wants the team to do well and if there is an area he has concern about, he questions it rather than taking the company line,which is also the way I feel.

Things like saying an 8-4 record solidifies a QB's place on a roster is no more correct than saying a QB from a top university is more prepared to play than a small school player because there are too many factors to consider.

Case-in-point.

I just watched the replay of the Cards- Bears game that got our old coach fired and if you look at those 2 teams you will see that Grossman had a terrible night and Leinart, although he had a few rookie mistakes, looked poised and actually led the team down to the 20 in the final 2 minutes to get into FG range(FG was missed).

Now that game displayed 2 things.

1) Grossman was the QB of a team that went 13-3 and went to the SB. Now, if you take the stance that an 8-4 record makes TJ qualified to be the unchallenged starter and that there is no need to worry about the position, then you would have to really rate Grossman up there at the top.

2) Leinart was a Rookie in that game and he played with poise and confidence. Although he did have an INT returned for a score, he kept in there and put the team in a position to win. They commentators were talking about how he was knocked for his arm strength but after seeing him play they admitted he had plenty to play in the NFL.


So to me that game itself does a good job of dispelling the notion that a rookie from USC couldn't start and be effective in the first year and it also made a strong case that a QB can be on a winning team and still not be worth a pooh.

Don't confuse the fact that some people question a decision as a sign that they lack devotion to the team or the staff. ;)



I have a pretty good idea what my friend Schutz's stance is on TJ and the Chiller.
Thus the smiley at the end of my little dig.


All the other comments don't have a smiley though.

;D


Things like saying an 8-4 record solidifies a QB's place on a roster is no more correct than saying a QB from a top university is more prepared to play than a small school player because there are too many factors to consider.

Were did I say that?
My take is that a 8-4 record is indicative of his ability to learn and lead.
That along with all the other attributes I've mentioned make me believe he is gonna be a hard player to beat out as the starter.


So to me that game itself does a good job of dispelling the notion that a rookie from USC couldn't start and be effective in the first year and it also made a strong case that a QB can be on a winning team and still not be worth a pooh.

You know, I don't put much value on what another player from one school did when I look at how well a player will play at the next level.
Lienart, as with most young QB's, regardless of what school they come from or what system they come from had his issues behind center but that is to be expected one would think.

JDB, if he does win the starting job would also have those very same issues.
Funny thing is, we also saw those same issues with TJ and people are ready to throw him under the bus because he came from a no name school, was thrust into the starters job before he was ready and has done a admirable job learning on the fly.

Problem is, most people don't want to acknowledge that TJ was destined to suck at times and refuse to admit that he is getting better while he gets valuable reps.
They can only focus on the fact that he wasn't NFL ready, made some dumb mistakes and cost us some games but they are are fired up ready to let JDB come in start without having to go through any of those growing pains.

Long story short, I like JDB and think that he could be our eventual starter, just not this year.
When I hear certain posters on here admit that I will quit questioning thier devotion/commitment to the team/staff. ;)

ragz
05-13-2008, 02:05 AM
"midgensa" wrote:


"ragz" wrote:


the thing is, all i ever hear about jackson is he has to avoid the big mistake.
if i recall correctly i dont remember him making all these huge mistakes that cost us games.
if anything we just didn't produce enough points and make our passing game effective enough to move the football and get points.
of his picks, how many went back for tds, how many were in the redzone, how many points scored off of his picks by the other team?
he didn't really make the big mistake last year in the games we lost, most times we were too conservative and we didn't move the ball enough to score enough.
maybe we were protecting him which i think is a bad move if you want a qb to develop, but either way, that is what's gonna have to improve if we are legit.
we can win some games 10-7 if our defense turns out to be that good, but new orleans, dallas, new york, maybe even green bay can score some points so defense and running are not gonna cut it alone.




He made some pretty big mistakes. In the first game against the Lions he threw FOUR interceptions. We lost that game in OVERTIME ... a win that would have been huge to us was lost because of his inability to keep the ball. The turnovers that really hurt us ...

Turnover No. 1
3rd and 1 at DET 25 (9:29) T.Jackson pass short middle intended for J.Kleinsasser INTERCEPTED by S.Cody (G.Alexander) at DET 22. S.Cody to DET 20 for -2 yards (B.Wade).
We are in field goal range and he takes out of any chance to get any points.

Turnover No. 2
3rd and 8 at MIN 15 (15:00) (Shotgun) T.Jackson pass deep left intended for R.Ferguson INTERCEPTED by K.Smith at MIN 44. K.Smith to MIN 39 for 5 yards (M.Moore).
Minnesota challenged the runner was down by contact ruling, and the play was REVERSED.
(Shotgun) T.Jackson pass deep left intended for R.Ferguson INTERCEPTED by K.Smith at DET 49. K.Smith to DET 49 for no gain (M.Moore).
He throws TWO picks but gets one reversed. The second gives the Lions the ball at the 49 and allows them to march down a short field to a 7-0 lead.

Turnover No. 3
1st and 10 at MIN 30 (13:42) T.Jackson pass deep middle intended for B.Wade INTERCEPTED by G.Alexander [D.White] at DET 35. G.Alexander to MIN 31 for 34 yards (A.Peterson).
This one puts the Lions at our 31 ... and gives them a really short field again. Shortly there after ... the Lions were in the end zone with a 17-7 lead.

All of those turnovers were crucial and arguably led to at least a 17 point swing in a game we lost in OT.

And of course ... in the biggest game of the year ... T-Jack made a couple of major mistakes against the Redskins in the dome.

On our second play from scrimmage:
2nd and 8 at MIN 39 (13:15) T.Jackson pass deep left intended for R.Ferguson INTERCEPTED by F.Smoot [R.Godfrey] at WAS 45. F.Smoot to MIN 8 for 47 yards (J.Kleinsasser).

Of course only five plays later this was a TD!, but it was reversed! and then we gave up a safety ... all precipitated by this interception.

And then in the second quarter:
2nd and 8 at MIN 22 (8:03) (Shotgun) T.Jackson pass intended for B.Wade INTERCEPTED by S.Springs [C.Griffin] at MIN 34. S.Springs to MIN 32 for 2 yards (B.Wade).

Two plays later it was 16-0 and the Vikes were shellshocked. They never recovered ... and went from playoffs to sitting at home in a matter of two quarters.

These are BIG mistakes made by a young QB. He does have to avoid these in order for us to win a few more games. Both of those games were seriously hurt by his play ... if we win those two games we obviously are in the playoffs ... so he needs to step it up this year. I actually happen to be one of those who thinks he will.


you brought up the guys 4th career start and he still had us in a position to win the game, while bollinger came in and in 3 plays fumbled and we lost.
my point is mistakes are gonna be made by all qbs, it's how they bounce back and how the rest of the team responds also.
as you've seen on other teams when an offense or qb is killing the team you start to get the feeling of mutiny.
i have yet to get that from the vikings and i think as the season went on you saw more and more confidence being given to tjack from the coaches and the players.

its just as i've been saying now for a year, you have to be somewhat patient.
i've been reading way too much about tjack from before he even made his 3rd start in the nfl that they guy is garbage.
what is it that everyone else has saw that makes him garbage compared to any of the other qbs that were in his draft class. i could see if you all these qbs made all these strides and tjack looks miles behind, but he seems in line and in my opinion ahead of alot of the class.
including guys drafted much higher.
my feeling has always been, what does everyone expect?
too me he is coming along and hopefully that goes in stride to how the whole team is coming along.
on paper this is the most talent we've had on the team in a long time so hopefully it all comes together.
the idea that tjack is a question mark is obviously fair, but i haven't heard much in the posts about that, as much as i've heard the guy needs to be replaced by anyone and everyone.
if that is wrong than maybe i'm not reading these things correctly