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singersp
12-21-2007, 06:38 AM
Stacked defensive lines are slowing down Minnesota Vikings' Adrian Peterson (http://www.twincities.com/vikings/ci_7774972)

Vikings expect similar looks from Redskins

BY DON SEEHOLZER
Pioneer Press

Article Last Updated: 12/21/2007 12:57:17 AM CST


After a humbling 3-yard rushing game at San Francisco, Adrian Peterson said he felt he got back on track in Monday night's victory over Chicago, but it's not like he ran wild....

PurpleTide
12-21-2007, 08:14 AM
I know the Chiller is going to call a flea-flicker real soon... Richarson, followed by AD who turns and laterals the ball back to T-Jack, with the Defense collapsed to stop the run we'd have T-Will, Wade, or Fergy wide open downfield. Sounds perfect, and I bet we see it in the next few games. Pull out all the stops Bevell.

We must also start throwing down the seam, and hitting some screens, slants, and just mix it up a little. Back them off the line of scrimmage and then hit them with the run.

PurplePeopleEaters
12-21-2007, 08:18 AM
Yeah we need to run some Play action bootlegs, PA screens to adrian... anything to catch the defense off guard in a blitz.

Purple Floyd
12-21-2007, 08:25 AM
Our TE should be getting 12 receptions a game with the defenses we are seeing

Marrdro
12-21-2007, 08:31 AM
Peterson and his blockers figure to have their work cut out again on Sunday night against Washington, which ranks ninth in the NFL against the run, allowing 98.0 yards a game.

I saw a couple of you (in the Redskins don't respect us thread) saying how easy it will be to run on them.

Lets not forget this point my friends.

As to screens, reverses, etc, believe it or not, those take more time than a straight handdoff or a quick slant.
If the OL isn't stopping the rush those things don't work and often end up in zero yards gained.

Don't get me wrong, they are all part of the scheme but again, they are not as easy to run as most seem to think.
The best way to attack a good pass rush is to run straight at the rusher or to throw quick passes rather than running gadget plays.

ultravikingfan
12-21-2007, 08:40 AM
When our passing game is "on" (or we develop a moe consistant one) teams will not be able to do this and then they will be in big trouble.

BleedinPandG
12-21-2007, 08:43 AM
"Marrdro" wrote:



Peterson and his blockers figure to have their work cut out again on Sunday night against Washington, which ranks ninth in the NFL against the run, allowing 98.0 yards a game.

I saw a couple of you (in the Redskins don't respect us thread) saying how easy it will be to run on them.

Lets not forget this point my friends.

As to screens, reverses, etc, believe it or not, those take more time than a straight handdoff or a quick slant.
If the OL isn't stopping the rush those things don't work and often end up in zero yards gained.

Don't get me wrong, they are all part of the scheme but again, they are not as easy to run as most seem to think.
The best way to attack a good pass rush is to run straight at the rusher or to throw quick passes rather than running gadget plays.


The big thing is for AD to be able to pick up a run blitzer on play action... they still believe we only run with him on the field and they bring the house.
If he doesn't get the ball he needs to be able to slow down everyone coming after him from getting to TJack for long enough to get the ball out.
Against the Bears, he missed that a few times.
I really think TJack will have 300+ yards against the Skins... this is a must win game... I would not be surprised to see more shot gun formations with AD deep beside TJack to totally confuse the D.

hx38596
12-21-2007, 08:44 AM
With Landry possibly out, it will be very tough for them to run the cover 3 with a single safety.
They are signing up some replacements at safety.

Marrdro
12-21-2007, 08:55 AM
"BleedinPandG" wrote:


"Marrdro" wrote:



Peterson and his blockers figure to have their work cut out again on Sunday night against Washington, which ranks ninth in the NFL against the run, allowing 98.0 yards a game.

I saw a couple of you (in the Redskins don't respect us thread) saying how easy it will be to run on them.

Lets not forget this point my friends.

As to screens, reverses, etc, believe it or not, those take more time than a straight handdoff or a quick slant.
If the OL isn't stopping the rush those things don't work and often end up in zero yards gained.

Don't get me wrong, they are all part of the scheme but again, they are not as easy to run as most seem to think.
The best way to attack a good pass rush is to run straight at the rusher or to throw quick passes rather than running gadget plays.


The big thing is for AD to be able to pick up a run blitzer on play action... they still believe we only run with him on the field and they bring the house.
If he doesn't get the ball he needs to be able to slow down everyone coming after him from getting to TJack for long enough to get the ball out.
Against the Bears, he missed that a few times.
I really think TJack will have 300+ yards against the Skins... this is a must win game... I would not be surprised to see more shot gun formations with AD deep beside TJack to totally confuse the D.

Some of AD's blocking woes can also be attributed to TJ's pre-snap calls/adjustments that are usually adjustments the backs make on thier blitz assignments.
Of course TJ makes his based on what he sees and what the C (Birk) has called.

If both Birk and TJ do thier jobs reading the D then AD should be able to pick the blitzer up if it is his responsibility.

V-Unit
12-21-2007, 10:13 AM
"UffDaVikes" wrote:


Our TE should be getting 12 receptions a game with the defenses we are seeing


It's pretty clear that TE is not meant to be a big receiving threat in our offense. Sure they might get one big catch a game, but that's it.

It would be interesting to see how we fare when using playaction and compare it to when TJ drops straight back. That 10 square-in to Wade was open all day vs. Chicago.

Also, I am so gald we stopped using Chester and AD on the field at the same time. I've been saying it all year. A pro bowl FB blocker is better than a decoy.

I just hope we don't try to catch them off guard by passing early. That has worked maybe twice all year. Stick to your guns!

Marrdro
12-21-2007, 11:18 AM
"V" wrote:


"UffDaVikes" wrote:


Our TE should be getting 12 receptions a game with the defenses we are seeing


It's pretty clear that TE is not meant to be a big receiving threat in our offense. Sure they might get one big catch a game, but that's it.

It would be interesting to see how we fare when using playaction and compare it to when TJ drops straight back. That 10 square-in to Wade was open all day vs. Chicago.

Also, I am so gald we stopped using Chester and AD on the field at the same time. I've been saying it all year. A pro bowl FB blocker is better than a decoy.

I just hope we don't try to catch them off guard by passing early. That has worked maybe twice all year. Stick to your guns!

Again, with the guns....... You did that just to crack me up right?
;D

ejmat
12-21-2007, 11:42 AM
Personally I like the fact teams stack the box.
Sure it may effect AP now but it also give TJack the chance to develope.
It also gives the coaches a better opportunity to see if he read defenses better too.
It's a great chance for TJack to shine or falter.

Keep stacking the box.
It's better for the long run.

Mr-holland
12-21-2007, 11:48 AM
"ejmat" wrote:


Personally I like the fact teams stack the box.
Sure it may effect AP now but it also give TJack the chance to develope.
It also gives the coaches a better opportunity to see if he read defenses better too.
It's a great chance for TJack to shine or falter.

Keep stacking the box.
It's better for the long run.

I agree but it affects our rushing offense, it's clear that especially after the AD injury we havn't been so productive on rushing as we've been before that's a big downside. i do like the fact TJ get's the opportunity to get alot of passing plays and ( like last week ) getting the yards

kevoncox
12-21-2007, 12:29 PM
What about motioning AP out the backfield? The defense will check off of their blitz and bring him back in for the quick hand off. This will catch some of the defensive players off guard. What about starting him at a slot position anf motioning him down the line for a hand off. Screens take time but it's not a time issue we are having. Teams are crashing in.
We need to get outside of the blitz( corners and outside LBs) screens help do that. RUn AO and Ct at the same time. RUn a screen wit Ct and a fake hand off to AP. Trust me the screen will be wide open for CT.

El Vikingo
12-21-2007, 12:39 PM
I am sure the Skins will crowd the center.
-Make PurpleJesus runs to the wings,It is proved is more effective than trying to the middle ,lastly...
-Try some flea-fick or a bomb once again.
-Use more
Playactions ,Chiller!!!
-Screen passes have usually been succesfull for us too.

V-Unit
12-21-2007, 12:45 PM
"El" wrote:


I am sure the Skins will crowd the center.
-Make PurpleJesus runs to the wings,It is proved is more effective than trying to the middle ,lastly...
-Try some flea-fick or a bomb once again.
-Use more
Playactions ,Chiller!!!
-Screen passes have usually been succesfull for us too.




I can't agree with that. AD is best when getting to the edges and in the open field. Chicago shut him down in the first half by attacking the edges with their DL and letting Urlacher blitz up the middle.

Marrdro
12-21-2007, 12:56 PM
I love it when you all come up with all the fancy ways to run the ball against an 8 man front/box.
Believe it or not offenses with running backs less talented as our have been facing this style of defenses for years and have been successfull running against it by doing the following running plays.

This is the primary staple of our running attack.
Nothing fancy.
Blockers do thier job, the RB's do thiers.
Very effective in a Zone blocking scheme with a great one cut back.

Plung/dive
A "plunge" (or "dive") is a type of play in American Football in which the ball carrier (usually a running back or a fullback) attempts to rush through one of the gaps immediately to the left or right of center, denoted as gaps 1 and 0 respectively. It may be run with or without a lead blocker, though when run with a lead blocker it may be called a "lead dive".

This is the another staple of our offense and is best suited to run based on the fact that our backs are great one cut runners and our ZB scheme really opens this hole up.

Off Tackle
An off-tackle run is a play in which the running back runs to the outside of a tackle through a hole created by the tackle and tight end. The fullback lead blocks and attempts to block the outside linebacker. The back also has the option of running to the outside of the tight end and some off-tackle plays are designed specifically for this. Off-tackle plays are somewhat slow to develop and can be broken up by heavy pressure on the center of the line.

Unlike a sweep, an off-tackle run requires specific blocks by the offensive tackle and tight end to create a hole. This often requires a coded discussion at the line when the defense shows its formation.

I still like this one.
It doesn't take alot of time to develop/execute there for it is good when they are zone blitzing us as well as when they aren't.
One drawback is the RB doesn't line up as deep as he normally would during a normall running play which limits his ability to pick and choose which gap/hole he wants to hit.

Draw
A draw is a type of American football play. The draw appears to be a passing play, but is actually a running play; in this way, it can be considered the opposite of the play action pass. The idea behind a draw play is to attack aggressive, pass-rushing defenses by "drawing" them upfield, leaving more open space to run the ball. Draw plays are often run out of the shotgun formation, but can also be run when the quarterback is under center. These types of draw plays are sometimes referred to as delayed handoffs

Hell for that matter we could even run one of thier staples against them.
We have the back(s) and the OL to pull it off.

;D

Counter trey
The counter trey is a misdirection running play used in American football.

This play is designed for the offensive team to feign rushing one way, then attacking the defense in the opposite direction. In a counter trey right, the center, right guard, and right tackle block left as if the play is going left. The left guard and left tackle "pull" from their positions by moving behind the other linemen and around the right corner.

The running back takes an initial feint step to the left, then cuts back to the right, receives the handoff from the quarterback, and follows behind the pulling left guard and left tackle. The left guard and left tackle will usually be blocking smaller linebackers and defensive backs downfield--this mismatch favors the offense. The counter trey requires quick, athletic linemen for good execution.

Many teams have run this play, but it first became well-known when run by the Washington Redskins in the 1980s. In particular, guard Russ Grimm and tackle Joe Jacoby would open up massive holes for John Riggins, George Rogers, and Earnest Byner.

Long story short, OL must do thier job, as well as the FB, TE, and RB's when it comes to running the ball no matter how many are in the box.
With our talent we should be able to get anyweres from 3-5 yards at a pop on almost every play.


Not as sexy as a long run or a deep ball but it will keep thier D on the field, our D off the field and we will win the game.

Jereamiah
12-21-2007, 01:03 PM
I may be mistaken, but the counter trey is a mainstay of the
Wing-T offense? Wouldn't that throw off the 'skins D? ;D

jargomcfargo
12-21-2007, 01:11 PM
I miss the crossbuck LOL!
That counter trey as run by the Skins was a sight to behold. Almost unstoppable.
Gibbs was kind of the run innovater like Walsh was pass innovater.
Gibbs still likes to run. But Collins can pass. So we are going to need some pressure.
I see this as a very physical game that will be won by the team that physically dominates and takes care of the ball.
We need to get the lead early. We got behind the Bears and started pressing a little. We need to do what we are good at. Run the ball and physically dominate the line of scrimmage. Win the time of posesssion battle.
If we attempt to change our stripes; we lose!
If we keep pounding it over and over, we will eventually break off the big runs.

V-Unit
12-21-2007, 05:48 PM
The crossbuck haha.

What do you call the Peterson Iso play we run? I know I'm not the only one who has seen that.

StillPurple
12-21-2007, 07:13 PM
When teams stack the box, it means that they are bringing extra corners and/or safeties up t the line. The Niners started this, and we should have made them pay for it more. The Bears also did it.

The answer is the "hot read". T-Jack has to audible on the line and hit Wade or Shiancoe, or Ferguson, Rice, etc. with a quick out or slant. The defenses are run blitzing us successfully. The hot read is the answer to that.

I mean, what do you think Peyton Manning or Brady do when teams bring up 8 or 9 guys into the box ? Well, we should do that.

CCthebest
12-21-2007, 08:52 PM
Like Steve Young said, a good QB would be able to pass all day on the defenses we are seeing. If they still stack it a year or 2 from now, TJ should get alot of yards.

mr.woo
12-21-2007, 09:18 PM
"StillPurple" wrote:


When teams stack the box, it means that they are bringing extra corners and/or safeties up t the line. The Niners started this, and we should have made them pay for it more. The Bears also did it.

The answer is the "hot read". T-Jack has to audible on the line and hit Wade or Shiancoe, or Ferguson, Rice, etc. with a quick out or slant. The defenses are run blitzing us successfully. The hot read is the answer to that.

I mean, what do you think Peyton Manning or Brady do when teams bring up 8 or 9 guys into the box ? Well, we should do that.


ha ha exently said. i mean cmon t jack. just do what Payton does. duh! learning period OVER! lol