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soonerbornNbred
10-24-2007, 12:12 PM
I am a new Vikings fan
I was looking at Salaries for the NFL my info was coming form the web foxsports it says The Minnesota Vikings Have the 3rd highest salary of all 32 teams The patriots being #1
is this accurate?
It also showed that TJ was paid lower than BB and KH, Holcomb being the highest paid of the Three...Is this accurate ?
Who are the top 5 or six paid players on the Vikings?
It seems that the owners are paying to put out a good product, am I reading to much into this

Frostbite
10-24-2007, 12:20 PM
It probably is accurate....I'm not really sure?? But it would not surprise me one bit....We pay out so much in Salaries and don't get the yield or return on the field....Sounds about right for the recent history of this Franchise....It is disappointing to me! Sounds like it might be time for GM and others to take a serious look at this area.

Cheers!

Mr Anderson
10-24-2007, 12:26 PM
How can that be?

Teams like the Colts and Redskins have been in cap trouble the past few years due to the huge contracts they've been taking on.

If I remember correctly, the Pat Williams deal somehow gave us another 10 million to spend in salary cap space this year? Putting us up to something like 38 million?

Edit: I might be very wrong.

NodakPaul
10-24-2007, 12:32 PM
Cap space is affected by signing bonuses and incentives and all sorts of other things that are not included in the salary reports.
So I wouldn't be surprised if the Vikings have one of the highest base salaries.
We are one of the best in terms of cap space though.

ultravikingfan
10-24-2007, 12:34 PM
We have the 3 and 4:

http://www.nflgridirongab.com/2007/07/05/top-10-salaries-in-the-nfl-as-published-in-the-usa-today/

This works through last year:

http://asp.usatoday.com/sports/football/nfl/salaries/default.aspx?Loc=Vanity

I could not find the 2007 salaries yet.

jmcdon00
10-24-2007, 12:35 PM
I'm in accounting, I do payroll every day, and I have no idea how the nfl does their payroll, it just doesn't make any sense.

ultravikingfan
10-24-2007, 12:39 PM
Ok, I know this is from a FF site.
But they do list the 2007 salary.
Hope it is accurate.

http://www.thenfa.com/html/salaries.html

tb04512
10-24-2007, 12:40 PM
"ultravikingfan" wrote:


We have the 3 and 4:

http://www.nflgridirongab.com/2007/07/05/top-10-salaries-in-the-nfl-as-published-in-the-usa-today/

This works through last year:

http://asp.usatoday.com/sports/football/nfl/salaries/default.aspx?Loc=Vanity

I could not find the 2007 salaries yet.

well get it done i dont want half assed numbers
:P

but wow alot of money being spent

soonerbornNbred
10-24-2007, 01:18 PM
Looking at the two most succesful teams over the past couple years, Im callin that the pats and colts(you insert who u think) their top 3 paid players are WR WR QB(colts) DT QB C WR(pats) the chargers seem to have used a lot on DEF and LT
info from

http://msn.foxsports.com/nfl/teamSalary?statsId=17

vikingivan
10-24-2007, 01:23 PM
"soonerbornNbred" wrote:


I am a new Vikings fan
I was looking at Salaries for the NFL my info was coming form the web foxsports it says The Minnesota Vikings Have the 3rd highest salary of all 32 teams The patriots being #1
is this accurate?
It also showed that TJ was paid lower than BB and KH, Holcomb being the highest paid of the Three...Is this accurate ?
Who are the top 5 or six paid players on the Vikings?
It seems that the owners are paying to put out a good product, am I reading to much into this



If they are saying that we have the 3rd highest team salary that has to be wrong.
We are 28 million dollars under the salary cap.

http://www.askthecommish.com/salarycap/numbers.asp

PurplePackerEater
10-24-2007, 02:01 PM
"soonerbornNbred" wrote:


I am a new Vikings fan
I was looking at Salaries for the NFL my info was coming form the web foxsports it says The Minnesota Vikings Have the 3rd highest salary of all 32 teams The patriots being #1
is this accurate?
It also showed that TJ was paid lower than BB and KH, Holcomb being the highest paid of the Three...Is this accurate ?
Who are the top 5 or six paid players on the Vikings?
It seems that the owners are paying to put out a good product, am I reading to much into this



Here's the deal.

The Vikings offer LOTS of unreachable bonus' in their contracts that must be included in that particular year's Salary Cap. They end up getting that back, credited to the next year, I believe.

Anyways, by the time everything is said and done in a particular season, we end up paying MUCH less. Once or twice, under Red McCombs, we paid out LESS than the Salary Cap MINIMUM.

The Vikings have found a loop hole and have been exploiting it for years.

Some here will say that's genius, it is, from a business standpoint, but from a fan's standpoint, I feel like they're cheating us.

PurplePackerEater
10-24-2007, 02:07 PM
"vikingivan" wrote:


"soonerbornNbred" wrote:


I am a new Vikings fan
I was looking at Salaries for the NFL my info was coming form the web foxsports it says The Minnesota Vikings Have the 3rd highest salary of all 32 teams The patriots being #1
is this accurate?
It also showed that TJ was paid lower than BB and KH, Holcomb being the highest paid of the Three...Is this accurate ?
Who are the top 5 or six paid players on the Vikings?
It seems that the owners are paying to put out a good product, am I reading to much into this



If they are saying that we have the 3rd highest team salary that has to be wrong.
We are 28 million dollars under the salary cap.

http://www.askthecommish.com/salarycap/numbers.asp



Keep in mind that these numbers remain tentative -- and are changing on a daily basis. These "unofficial" figures are approximate as of March 2 , 2007.

Those figures were BEFORE Free Agency and the Draft.

soonerbornNbred
10-24-2007, 02:11 PM
So is if all incentives are met its the leagues 3rd highest, but if their not then its average...is that the reality

PurplePackerEater
10-24-2007, 02:21 PM
"soonerbornNbred" wrote:


So is if all incentives are met its the leagues 3rd highest, but if their not then its average...is that the reality




I haven't studied this years numbers, but judging from the past, I would say that is fairly accurate. ;)

cajunvike
10-24-2007, 02:28 PM
"PurplePackerEater" wrote:


"soonerbornNbred" wrote:


I am a new Vikings fan
I was looking at Salaries for the NFL my info was coming form the web foxsports it says The Minnesota Vikings Have the 3rd highest salary of all 32 teams The patriots being #1
is this accurate?
It also showed that TJ was paid lower than BB and KH, Holcomb being the highest paid of the Three...Is this accurate ?
Who are the top 5 or six paid players on the Vikings?
It seems that the owners are paying to put out a good product, am I reading to much into this



Here's the deal.

The Vikings offer LOTS of unreachable bonus' in their contracts that must be included in that particular year's Salary Cap. They end up getting that back, credited to the next year, I believe.

Anyways, by the time everything is said and done in a particular season, we end up paying MUCH less. Once or twice, under Red McCombs, we paid out LESS than the Salary Cap MINIMUM.

The Vikings have found a loop hole and have been exploiting it for years.

Some here will say that's genius, it is, from a business standpoint, but from a fan's standpoint, I feel like they're cheating us.


True that...unless they were to roll that back in to get more for their money!

jmcdon00
10-24-2007, 02:35 PM
"cajunvike" wrote:


"PurplePackerEater" wrote:


"soonerbornNbred" wrote:


I am a new Vikings fan
I was looking at Salaries for the NFL my info was coming form the web foxsports it says The Minnesota Vikings Have the 3rd highest salary of all 32 teams The patriots being #1
is this accurate?
It also showed that TJ was paid lower than BB and KH, Holcomb being the highest paid of the Three...Is this accurate ?
Who are the top 5 or six paid players on the Vikings?
It seems that the owners are paying to put out a good product, am I reading to much into this



Here's the deal.

The Vikings offer LOTS of unreachable bonus' in their contracts that must be included in that particular year's Salary Cap. They end up getting that back, credited to the next year, I believe.

Anyways, by the time everything is said and done in a particular season, we end up paying MUCH less. Once or twice, under Red McCombs, we paid out LESS than the Salary Cap MINIMUM.

The Vikings have found a loop hole and have been exploiting it for years.

Some here will say that's genius, it is, from a business standpoint, but from a fan's standpoint, I feel like they're cheating us.


True that...unless they were to roll that back in to get more for their money!

It seems like they should be able to use today's cap space to free up extra space for the future. If they could use the 28million in cap space to, for instance, pay Adrian Peterson's entire contract in advance then we would have extra room in the future. Unfortunetly it is not that simple because nothing involving that much money ever is.

PurplePackerEater
10-24-2007, 03:57 PM
"jmcdon00" wrote:


"cajunvike" wrote:


"PurplePackerEater" wrote:


"soonerbornNbred" wrote:


I am a new Vikings fan
I was looking at Salaries for the NFL my info was coming form the web foxsports it says The Minnesota Vikings Have the 3rd highest salary of all 32 teams The patriots being #1
is this accurate?
It also showed that TJ was paid lower than BB and KH, Holcomb being the highest paid of the Three...Is this accurate ?
Who are the top 5 or six paid players on the Vikings?
It seems that the owners are paying to put out a good product, am I reading to much into this



Here's the deal.

The Vikings offer LOTS of unreachable bonus' in their contracts that must be included in that particular year's Salary Cap. They end up getting that back, credited to the next year, I believe.

Anyways, by the time everything is said and done in a particular season, we end up paying MUCH less. Once or twice, under Red McCombs, we paid out LESS than the Salary Cap MINIMUM.

The Vikings have found a loop hole and have been exploiting it for years.

Some here will say that's genius, it is, from a business standpoint, but from a fan's standpoint, I feel like they're cheating us.


True that...unless they were to roll that back in to get more for their money!

It seems like they should be able to use today's cap space to free up extra space for the future. If they could use the 28million in cap space to, for instance, pay Adrian Peterson's entire contract in advance then we would have extra room in the future. Unfortunetly it is not that simple because nothing involving that much money ever is.


They did to something to that effect when we signed Winfield.

BloodyHorns82
10-24-2007, 04:04 PM
"jmcdon00" wrote:


"cajunvike" wrote:


"PurplePackerEater" wrote:


"soonerbornNbred" wrote:


I am a new Vikings fan
I was looking at Salaries for the NFL my info was coming form the web foxsports it says The Minnesota Vikings Have the 3rd highest salary of all 32 teams The patriots being #1
is this accurate?
It also showed that TJ was paid lower than BB and KH, Holcomb being the highest paid of the Three...Is this accurate ?
Who are the top 5 or six paid players on the Vikings?
It seems that the owners are paying to put out a good product, am I reading to much into this



Here's the deal.

The Vikings offer LOTS of unreachable bonus' in their contracts that must be included in that particular year's Salary Cap. They end up getting that back, credited to the next year, I believe.

Anyways, by the time everything is said and done in a particular season, we end up paying MUCH less. Once or twice, under Red McCombs, we paid out LESS than the Salary Cap MINIMUM.

The Vikings have found a loop hole and have been exploiting it for years.

Some here will say that's genius, it is, from a business standpoint, but from a fan's standpoint, I feel like they're cheating us.


True that...unless they were to roll that back in to get more for their money!

It seems like they should be able to use today's cap space to free up extra space for the future. If they could use the 28million in cap space to, for instance, pay Adrian Peterson's entire contract in advance then we would have extra room in the future. Unfortunetly it is not that simple because nothing involving that much money ever is.


Isn't that basically the same as "front loading" the contract?
Pay him 15 million the first year, than league minimum after that?

PurplePackerEater
10-24-2007, 04:47 PM
"BloodyHorns82" wrote:


"jmcdon00" wrote:


"cajunvike" wrote:


"PurplePackerEater" wrote:


"soonerbornNbred" wrote:


I am a new Vikings fan
I was looking at Salaries for the NFL my info was coming form the web foxsports it says The Minnesota Vikings Have the 3rd highest salary of all 32 teams The patriots being #1
is this accurate?
It also showed that TJ was paid lower than BB and KH, Holcomb being the highest paid of the Three...Is this accurate ?
Who are the top 5 or six paid players on the Vikings?
It seems that the owners are paying to put out a good product, am I reading to much into this



Here's the deal.

The Vikings offer LOTS of unreachable bonus' in their contracts that must be included in that particular year's Salary Cap. They end up getting that back, credited to the next year, I believe.

Anyways, by the time everything is said and done in a particular season, we end up paying MUCH less. Once or twice, under Red McCombs, we paid out LESS than the Salary Cap MINIMUM.

The Vikings have found a loop hole and have been exploiting it for years.

Some here will say that's genius, it is, from a business standpoint, but from a fan's standpoint, I feel like they're cheating us.


True that...unless they were to roll that back in to get more for their money!

It seems like they should be able to use today's cap space to free up extra space for the future. If they could use the 28million in cap space to, for instance, pay Adrian Peterson's entire contract in advance then we would have extra room in the future. Unfortunetly it is not that simple because nothing involving that much money ever is.


Isn't that basically the same as "front loading" the contract?
Pay him 15 million the first year, than league minimum after that?


I would say so. I THINK they call it a "roster" bonus, as opposed to a "signing" bonus. I believe a "roster" bonus is payed in one lump sum, while a "signing" bonus is payed out over the length of the contract -but is guarranteed even if released before the contract expires.

I'm not 100% sure about all that, but I believe it's very close.

Overlord
10-24-2007, 05:23 PM
"PurplePackerEater" wrote:


I would say so. I THINK they call it a "roster" bonus, as opposed to a "signing" bonus. I believe a "roster" bonus is payed in one lump sum, while a "signing" bonus is payed out over the length of the contract -but is guarranteed even if released before the contract expires.

I'm not 100% sure about all that, but I believe it's very close.


Actually, both get paid in one lump sum.
For the player, they're basically the same - they get a big check up front.
There is a small difference in what a team can recover from the player if they don't show up, and you can look at the recent Vick decision for more on that.

The big difference (and what you were thinking of) is in how the team writes it down for cap purposes.
The signing bonus is spread out over a number of years for cap purposes, while the roster bonus counts entirely against that years cap.

jessejames09
10-24-2007, 05:31 PM
Pat Williams is paid in various baked goods.

PackSux!
10-24-2007, 06:26 PM
Rob Brezinski rules!

Marrdro
10-24-2007, 06:42 PM
"PackSux!" wrote:


Rob Brezinski rules!

Some would think that based on were we stand so far under the cap.
I for one question some of his decisions right along with some other front office decisions...... ::)

A.
When we needed a VET that could not only teach TJ (Coaches Coach, Players Play) the intricacies of the game, why didn't they offer Brad a 1 or 2 year contract laden with incentives to that would have kept him here?

He had a chance to still start games (what he wanted) he loved being a Viking (or so he said).
Seems all the right pieces were in place but yet, he is gone and we have lots of CAP and no one worth a hook to teach the young Jedi.

Brezinski Rules!!!!!!!

B.
Kevin Curtis visited MN as a possible candidate to be teh Veteran leadership to our young group of WR's.
Sure he would have had a significant drop off in his anticipated production levels was a huge detractor from him staying.

Brezinski could have offered a contract with more front end money instead of something laden with escalator clauses or incentives and that would have kept him here.
OOOPs, that didn't happen did it.

Brezinski Rules!!!!!!!!

C.
Holcomb was targeted early on in the pre-season hunt as a possible Vet to work with the young Jedi and add depth at probably our shakiest position on the team.
Everyone, including Holcomb would have benifited from him getting in early enough to ensure that he was familiar with the staff and the system.

Eagles asking price was to high.
We balked until it became blatantly obvious to the casual observer and some of you posters that TJ wasn't as far along as the staff wanted him to be.
End state is, the front office paid the original asking price and we got him in late, behind the power curve.

Brezinski Rules!!!!!!!!

Comeon people.
I love the guy and think he is a genious when it comes to keeping us under the spending limit, but why the hell do we need to be so far below the limit.

Lets start making some credible posts other than Chilly sucks and TJ sucks and start looking at reality of why we are in the mess we are in.

Brezinski Rules, Fire Childress and his Coaching Staff!!!!!!!!
:o
::)
:o
::)

PackSux!
10-24-2007, 06:48 PM
"Marrdro" wrote:


"PackSux!" wrote:


Rob Brezinski rules!

Some would think that based on were we stand so far under the cap.
I for one question some of his decisions right along with some other front office decisions...... ::)

A.
When we needed a VET that could not only teach TJ (Coaches Coach, Players Play) the intricacies of the game, why didn't they offer Brad a 1 or 2 year contract laden with incentives to that would have kept him here?

He had a chance to still start games (what he wanted) he loved being a Viking (or so he said).
Seems all the right pieces were in place but yet, he is gone and we have lots of CAP and no one worth a hook to teach the young Jedi.

Brezinski Rules!!!!!!!

B.
Kevin Curtis visited MN as a possible candidate to be teh Veteran leadership to our young group of WR's.
Sure he would have had a significant drop off in his anticipated production levels was a huge detractor from him staying.

Brezinski could have offered a contract with more front end money instead of something laden with escalator clauses or incentives and that would have kept him here.
OOOPs, that didn't happen did it.

Brezinski Rules!!!!!!!!

C.
Holcomb was targeted early on in the pre-season hunt as a possible Vet to work with the young Jedi and add depth at probably our shakiest position on the team.
Everyone, including Holcomb would have benifited from him getting in early enough to ensure that he was familiar with the staff and the system.

Eagles asking price was to high.

We balked until it became blatantly obvious to the casual observer and some of you posters that TJ wasn't as far along as the staff wanted him to be.

End state is, the front office paid the original asking price and we got him in late, behind the power curve.

Brezinski Rules!!!!!!!!

Comeon people.

I love the guy and think he is a genious when it comes to keeping us under the spending limit, but why the hell do we need to be so far below the limit.

Lets start making some credible posts other than Chilly sucks and TJ sucks and start looking at reality of why we are in the mess we are in.

Brezinski Rules, Fire Childress and his Coaching Staff!!!!!!!!
:o
::)
:o
::)


Good post.
Except it dont make any sense at all.
Brezinski's job is to write up a contract when the coaches and the player personel tell him to.

And the reason we are so far under the cap each year is because of the up front money.
Do you remember two years ago when we signed Hutch and Taylor and then went on to give K Will a nice big juicy contract?
Not to mention the other contracts that were signed and the rookies as well.
Them kind of contracts would of killed many teams, but not the Vikings.
Rob Brezinski is the reason why.

And if Brezinski is as smart about coaching as he is with salaries then yes he should be coach and gm.

soonerbornNbred
10-24-2007, 07:03 PM
Lets start making some credible posts other than Chilly sucks and TJ sucks and start looking at reality of why we are in the mess we are in.

Thats what Im trying to get a grasp of....If the Vikings third string QB makes the most money (per 2007 foxsports.com salary page) and the starting QB makes the least....and all three of those are like the 20th highest paid on the team
Seems the whole thing is askew
In most organizations your going to be asking for more out of the people I pay the most, and expecting a return on your investment
If a guy is the 32nd highest paid waterboy in the NFL then thats probably what hes worth...now if he can show outstanding waterboy skills( such as the Kwill endzone waterboy) you will get paid more for your waterboy skillz
At the beginning of this thread I asked about the top 5 or 6 paid players on the team, that is were you would expect the leadership and heartbeat of this team to be


It just seemed strange they paid more for Holcomb than they were giving TJ...maybe thats why they baulked,I dont know

jessejames09
10-24-2007, 07:20 PM
"Marrdro" wrote:


"PackSux!" wrote:


Rob Brezinski rules!



B.
Kevin Curtis visited MN as a possible candidate to be teh Veteran leadership to our young group of WR's.
Sure he would have had a significant drop off in his anticipated production levels was a huge detractor from him staying.

Brezinski could have offered a contract with more front end money instead of something laden with escalator clauses or incentives and that would have kept him here.
OOOPs, that didn't happen did it.


I believed it was really Marrdro posting there until this. What happened to the man who says stuff about everyone gathering together watching tape and making decisions as the team. You can't blame our cap manager for Curtis not wanting to come to MN.

I'm almost positive he took less money to go to philly. We're not the most popular destination for NFL players. Do you really think a loaded front end contract would have made him decide to come here & it was just overlooked.

And do you know what contract he was offered and if it truly was incentive laden?

I think the front office is a little more complex then you think ;D



I just took everything I've learned from marrdro and used it against his post. Giggity.

Marrdro
10-24-2007, 07:37 PM
"PackSux!" wrote:


"Marrdro" wrote:


"PackSux!" wrote:


Rob Brezinski rules!

Some would think that based on were we stand so far under the cap.
I for one question some of his decisions right along with some other front office decisions...... ::)

A.
When we needed a VET that could not only teach TJ (Coaches Coach, Players Play) the intricacies of the game, why didn't they offer Brad a 1 or 2 year contract laden with incentives to that would have kept him here?

He had a chance to still start games (what he wanted) he loved being a Viking (or so he said).
Seems all the right pieces were in place but yet, he is gone and we have lots of CAP and no one worth a hook to teach the young Jedi.

Brezinski Rules!!!!!!!

B.
Kevin Curtis visited MN as a possible candidate to be teh Veteran leadership to our young group of WR's.
Sure he would have had a significant drop off in his anticipated production levels was a huge detractor from him staying.

Brezinski could have offered a contract with more front end money instead of something laden with escalator clauses or incentives and that would have kept him here.
OOOPs, that didn't happen did it.

Brezinski Rules!!!!!!!!

C.
Holcomb was targeted early on in the pre-season hunt as a possible Vet to work with the young Jedi and add depth at probably our shakiest position on the team.
Everyone, including Holcomb would have benifited from him getting in early enough to ensure that he was familiar with the staff and the system.

Eagles asking price was to high.

We balked until it became blatantly obvious to the casual observer and some of you posters that TJ wasn't as far along as the staff wanted him to be.

End state is, the front office paid the original asking price and we got him in late, behind the power curve.

Brezinski Rules!!!!!!!!

Comeon people.

I love the guy and think he is a genious when it comes to keeping us under the spending limit, but why the hell do we need to be so far below the limit.

Lets start making some credible posts other than Chilly sucks and TJ sucks and start looking at reality of why we are in the mess we are in.

Brezinski Rules, Fire Childress and his Coaching Staff!!!!!!!!
:o
::)
:o
::)


Good post.
Except it dont make any sense at all.
Brezinski's job is to write up a contract when the coaches and the player personel tell him to.

And the reason we are so far under the cap each year is because of the up front money.
Do you remember two years ago when we signed Hutch and Taylor and then went on to give K Will a nice big juicy contract?
Not to mention the other contracts that were signed and the rookies as well.

Them kind of contracts would of killed many teams, but not the Vikings.
Rob Brezinski is the reason why.

And if Brezinski is as smart about coaching as he is with salaries then yes he should be coach and gm.


I've kindof been on this soap box all week, if you haven't noticed.
;D

The coaches do not make the decision who gets contracts.
In fact, in its simplest form, it is a more of a front office kindof thing that the coaches have input into.

The Owner(s), Studwell, Medical Doctors, Capologist, Psychologist, PR reps etc etc etc all have an input.
The Head Coach has a say as well, however, not as much as some people think.

You seen the quote I've been stealing from Parcells lately?


"If they want you to cook the dinner, at least they ought to let you shop for some of the groceries."

He was alluding to the fact that he didn't have very much say in the players that were put on the field.
He just had to coach what they gave him.

That was from Coach Parcells.
The Tuna.
Master of his own destinay, and yet, he didn't get to select his players.

No my friend, the coaches don't tell Mr. Brazsinski who to sign.

Overlord
10-24-2007, 07:42 PM
"soonerbornNbred" wrote:


Lets start making some credible posts other than Chilly sucks and TJ sucks and start looking at reality of why we are in the mess we are in.

Thats what Im trying to get a grasp of....If the Vikings third string QB makes the most money (per 2007 foxsports.com salary page) and the starting QB makes the least....and all three of those are like the 20th highest paid on the team
Seems the whole thing is askew
In most organizations your going to be asking for more out of the people I pay the most, and expecting a return on your investment
If a guy is the 32nd highest paid waterboy in the NFL then thats probably what hes worth...now if he can show outstanding waterboy skills( such as the Kwill endzone waterboy) you will get paid more for your waterboy skillz
At the beginning of this thread I asked about the top 5 or 6 paid players on the team, that is were you would expect the leadership and heartbeat of this team to be


It just seemed strange they paid more for Holcomb than they were giving TJ...maybe thats why they baulked,I dont know


TJ is paid less because he is working under his rookie contract (4 years, $2.9 million total).
It's value was based on his slot.
Outside of the top 20 players or so, rookie contracts are very team friendly.
Here's a comparison - Kellen Clemens was drafted by the Jets not too far ahead of Tarvaris and got a $3.5 million contract over 4 years.

Holcomb was given a starting, veteran QB contract (4 years, $6.6 million total).
More than half of that was paid by his previous employers, so the Vikes are only on the hook for $1.5 million this year, and another $1.5 million if they keep him around next year.


So the minimal monetary investment in Tarvaris doesn't necessarily reflect his skills.
This really isn't that uncommon.
You're paid for what they think you'll do, not what you've already done.

soonerbornNbred
10-24-2007, 08:29 PM
Overlord,Thank you for the enlightment on QBs ...Now who are the 5 or 6 highest paid guys and shouldnt they be the teams leaders or accountable core....as in Pats and Colts top paid players are the reason for their success or so it seems.

jessejames09
10-24-2007, 08:41 PM
"Marrdro" wrote:


"PackSux!" wrote:


"Marrdro" wrote:


"PackSux!" wrote:


Rob Brezinski rules!

Some would think that based on were we stand so far under the cap.
I for one question some of his decisions right along with some other front office decisions...... ::)

A.
When we needed a VET that could not only teach TJ (Coaches Coach, Players Play) the intricacies of the game, why didn't they offer Brad a 1 or 2 year contract laden with incentives to that would have kept him here?

He had a chance to still start games (what he wanted) he loved being a Viking (or so he said).
Seems all the right pieces were in place but yet, he is gone and we have lots of CAP and no one worth a hook to teach the young Jedi.

Brezinski Rules!!!!!!!

B.
Kevin Curtis visited MN as a possible candidate to be teh Veteran leadership to our young group of WR's.
Sure he would have had a significant drop off in his anticipated production levels was a huge detractor from him staying.

Brezinski could have offered a contract with more front end money instead of something laden with escalator clauses or incentives and that would have kept him here.
OOOPs, that didn't happen did it.

Brezinski Rules!!!!!!!!

C.
Holcomb was targeted early on in the pre-season hunt as a possible Vet to work with the young Jedi and add depth at probably our shakiest position on the team.
Everyone, including Holcomb would have benifited from him getting in early enough to ensure that he was familiar with the staff and the system.

Eagles asking price was to high.
We balked until it became blatantly obvious to the casual observer and some of you posters that TJ wasn't as far along as the staff wanted him to be.
End state is, the front office paid the original asking price and we got him in late, behind the power curve.

Brezinski Rules!!!!!!!!

Comeon people.
I love the guy and think he is a genious when it comes to keeping us under the spending limit, but why the hell do we need to be so far below the limit.

Lets start making some credible posts other than Chilly sucks and TJ sucks and start looking at reality of why we are in the mess we are in.

Brezinski Rules, Fire Childress and his Coaching Staff!!!!!!!!
:o
::)
:o
::)


Good post.
Except it dont make any sense at all.
Brezinski's job is to write up a contract when the coaches and the player personel tell him to.

And the reason we are so far under the cap each year is because of the up front money.
Do you remember two years ago when we signed Hutch and Taylor and then went on to give K Will a nice big juicy contract? Not to mention the other contracts that were signed and the rookies as well.
Them kind of contracts would of killed many teams, but not the Vikings.
Rob Brezinski is the reason why.

And if Brezinski is as smart about coaching as he is with salaries then yes he should be coach and gm.


I've kindof been on this soap box all week, if you haven't noticed.
;D

The coaches do not make the decision who gets contracts.
In fact, in its simplest form, it is a more of a front office kindof thing that the coaches have input into.

The Owner(s), Studwell, Medical Doctors, Capologist, Psychologist, PR reps etc etc etc all have an input.
The Head Coach has a say as well, however, not as much as some people think.

You seen the quote I've been stealing from Parcells lately?


"If they want you to cook the dinner, at least they ought to let you shop for some of the groceries."

He was alluding to the fact that he didn't have very much say in the players that were put on the field.
He just had to coach what they gave him.

That was from Coach Parcells.
The Tuna.
Master of his own destinay, and yet, he didn't get to select his players.

No my friend, the coaches don't tell Mr. Brazsinski who to sign.




We don't really know how much say BC gets, my guess would be a good sum seeing as we don't have a GM.

But the Tuna had Jerry Jones. And Jerry Jones likes to bring his guys in. I know Zygi has much less input than some owners in the NFL.

Purple Floyd
10-24-2007, 08:46 PM
"soonerbornNbred" wrote:


Overlord,Thank you for the enlightment on QBs ...Now who are the 5 or 6 highest paid guys and shouldnt they be the teams leaders or accountable core....as in Pats and Colts top paid players are the reason for their success or so it seems.


That is an interesting perspective, but it does not necessarily lead to success and you can have a successful team without those positions being the highest paid.

For instance, Baltimore and Tampa both had QB's during their championship year that were not at the top of the payroll and neither were their RB's or WR's. They were both geared toward the defense and the quarterbacks were journeymen.Chicago last year I suspect was very similar and I don't have time to go back and look, but my guess is that there were more super bowl winners in the past 2 decades who wouldn't fit your economic model. BTW, I don't think there is anything wrong with your idea and if we had the talent to demand that much salary to be committed to those positions I would be happy. But there are always more ways to skin the cat if that luxury is not at your disposal.

Good points though.

Marrdro
10-24-2007, 08:47 PM
"jessejames09" wrote:


"Marrdro" wrote:


"PackSux!" wrote:


Rob Brezinski rules!



B.
Kevin Curtis visited MN as a possible candidate to be teh Veteran leadership to our young group of WR's.
Sure he would have had a significant drop off in his anticipated production levels was a huge detractor from him staying.

Brezinski could have offered a contract with more front end money instead of something laden with escalator clauses or incentives and that would have kept him here.
OOOPs, that didn't happen did it.


I believed it was really Marrdro posting there until this. What happened to the man who says stuff about everyone gathering together watching tape and making decisions as the team. You can't blame our cap manager for Curtis not wanting to come to MN.

I'm almost positive he took less money to go to philly. We're not the most popular destination for NFL players. Do you really think a loaded front end contract would have made him decide to come here & it was just overlooked.

And do you know what contract he was offered and if it truly was incentive laden?

I think the front office is a little more complex then you think ;D



I just took everything I've learned from marrdro and used it against his post. Giggity.

Not quite there but I gotta give you credit for trying my friend. You are getting there.
;D

Who knows what he took to go to Philly, the front end/gaurenteed money might be lower than we offered, but his incentives could have been alot more based on the QB throwing to him, WR's that would compliment him and the recent success that the team has had being a throwing team vice a running team.
Again, who cares.


My point is, did the staff (Capologist) give him a followup offer once he said no?
Probably.
When he said no again, did they followup with another? Not sure, but I am sure there was a price in there someplace that he would have said yes to.

Case in point, Moss said yes to the Raiders.
Was it because they had a great QB and OL and RB that made them instant contenders for a SB?
Nope.
It was the price.

Back to Curtis, I do believe thier is a price that he would have said yes to, what that price is isn't my point.
My point is that the
the front office is the one who makes those offers, not the Chiller my friend.
Do you really think the Chiller would sit down with the Curtis's agent and discuss escalators and incentives plus gaurenteed money spread out over the life of the contract?

Heavens forbid.
He has more to do than that.

I believe it was Caine who made a comment a few weeks back about maybe if we had a GM things like this wouldn't slip through the cracks.
I agreed with Caine on that but there sure was alot of Pooo Poooing over that.
Just shows, IMHO, that some people don't even have the faintest idea of how complex a front office is or what it does for that matter.

Look, I am not pretending to think I know how this organization works, but I have read some books/studied on this subject and I know how the owner structured his staff and trust me when I tell you, the Chiller doesn't negotiate contracts with players.
He only says that they meet his standards with respect to abilities and potential.
;D

Purple Floyd
10-24-2007, 08:51 PM
"jessejames09" wrote:


"Marrdro" wrote:


"PackSux!" wrote:


"Marrdro" wrote:


"PackSux!" wrote:


Rob Brezinski rules!

Some would think that based on were we stand so far under the cap.
I for one question some of his decisions right along with some other front office decisions...... ::)

A.
When we needed a VET that could not only teach TJ (Coaches Coach, Players Play) the intricacies of the game, why didn't they offer Brad a 1 or 2 year contract laden with incentives to that would have kept him here?

He had a chance to still start games (what he wanted) he loved being a Viking (or so he said).
Seems all the right pieces were in place but yet, he is gone and we have lots of CAP and no one worth a hook to teach the young Jedi.

Brezinski Rules!!!!!!!

B.
Kevin Curtis visited MN as a possible candidate to be teh Veteran leadership to our young group of WR's.
Sure he would have had a significant drop off in his anticipated production levels was a huge detractor from him staying.

Brezinski could have offered a contract with more front end money instead of something laden with escalator clauses or incentives and that would have kept him here.
OOOPs, that didn't happen did it.

Brezinski Rules!!!!!!!!

C.
Holcomb was targeted early on in the pre-season hunt as a possible Vet to work with the young Jedi and add depth at probably our shakiest position on the team.
Everyone, including Holcomb would have benifited from him getting in early enough to ensure that he was familiar with the staff and the system.

Eagles asking price was to high.
We balked until it became blatantly obvious to the casual observer and some of you posters that TJ wasn't as far along as the staff wanted him to be.
End state is, the front office paid the original asking price and we got him in late, behind the power curve.

Brezinski Rules!!!!!!!!

Comeon people.
I love the guy and think he is a genious when it comes to keeping us under the spending limit, but why the hell do we need to be so far below the limit.

Lets start making some credible posts other than Chilly sucks and TJ sucks and start looking at reality of why we are in the mess we are in.

Brezinski Rules, Fire Childress and his Coaching Staff!!!!!!!!
:o
::)
:o
::)


Good post.
Except it dont make any sense at all.
Brezinski's job is to write up a contract when the coaches and the player personel tell him to.

And the reason we are so far under the cap each year is because of the up front money.
Do you remember two years ago when we signed Hutch and Taylor and then went on to give K Will a nice big juicy contract? Not to mention the other contracts that were signed and the rookies as well.
Them kind of contracts would of killed many teams, but not the Vikings.
Rob Brezinski is the reason why.

And if Brezinski is as smart about coaching as he is with salaries then yes he should be coach and gm.


I've kindof been on this soap box all week, if you haven't noticed.
;D

The coaches do not make the decision who gets contracts.
In fact, in its simplest form, it is a more of a front office kindof thing that the coaches have input into.

The Owner(s), Studwell, Medical Doctors, Capologist, Psychologist, PR reps etc etc etc all have an input.
The Head Coach has a say as well, however, not as much as some people think.

You seen the quote I've been stealing from Parcells lately?


"If they want you to cook the dinner, at least they ought to let you shop for some of the groceries."

He was alluding to the fact that he didn't have very much say in the players that were put on the field.
He just had to coach what they gave him.

That was from Coach Parcells.
The Tuna.
Master of his own destinay, and yet, he didn't get to select his players.

No my friend, the coaches don't tell Mr. Brazsinski who to sign.




We don't really know how much say BC gets, my guess would be a good sum seeing as we don't have a GM.

But the Tuna had Jerry Jones. And Jerry Jones likes to bring his guys in. I know Zygi has much less input than some owners in the NFL.


Isn't Brazyznski our GM? And if he is, does he have the credentials to be an effective GM as it relates to things other than salary cap management? Does anybody know what his job description consists of at all or is the structure of the organization clouded in mystery?

singersp
10-24-2007, 08:51 PM
"ultravikingfan" wrote:


We have the 3 and 4:

http://www.nflgridirongab.com/2007/07/05/top-10-salaries-in-the-nfl-as-published-in-the-usa-today/

This works through last year:

http://asp.usatoday.com/sports/football/nfl/salaries/default.aspx?Loc=Vanity

I could not find the 2007 salaries yet.


They'll be out towards the end of the year or early next.

Interesting note............ Everyone kept saying how Smoot was way over paid, yet last year he made a little over half of what Cedric Griffin did.

Griffin, Cedric - $ 1,575,000

Smoot, Fred - $ 852,941

Marrdro
10-24-2007, 08:55 PM
"UffDaVikes" wrote:


"jessejames09" wrote:


"Marrdro" wrote:


"PackSux!" wrote:


"Marrdro" wrote:




Rob Brezinski rules!

Some would think that based on were we stand so far under the cap.
I for one question some of his decisions right along with some other front office decisions...... ::)

A.
When we needed a VET that could not only teach TJ (Coaches Coach, Players Play) the intricacies of the game, why didn't they offer Brad a 1 or 2 year contract laden with incentives to that would have kept him here?

He had a chance to still start games (what he wanted) he loved being a Viking (or so he said).
Seems all the right pieces were in place but yet, he is gone and we have lots of CAP and no one worth a hook to teach the young Jedi.

Brezinski Rules!!!!!!!

B.
Kevin Curtis visited MN as a possible candidate to be teh Veteran leadership to our young group of WR's.
Sure he would have had a significant drop off in his anticipated production levels was a huge detractor from him staying.

Brezinski could have offered a contract with more front end money instead of something laden with escalator clauses or incentives and that would have kept him here.
OOOPs, that didn't happen did it.

Brezinski Rules!!!!!!!!

C.
Holcomb was targeted early on in the pre-season hunt as a possible Vet to work with the young Jedi and add depth at probably our shakiest position on the team.
Everyone, including Holcomb would have benifited from him getting in early enough to ensure that he was familiar with the staff and the system.

Eagles asking price was to high.

We balked until it became blatantly obvious to the casual observer and some of you posters that TJ wasn't as far along as the staff wanted him to be.

End state is, the front office paid the original asking price and we got him in late, behind the power curve.

Brezinski Rules!!!!!!!!

Comeon people.

I love the guy and think he is a genious when it comes to keeping us under the spending limit, but why the hell do we need to be so far below the limit.

Lets start making some credible posts other than Chilly sucks and TJ sucks and start looking at reality of why we are in the mess we are in.

Brezinski Rules, Fire Childress and his Coaching Staff!!!!!!!!
:o
::)
:o
::)


Good post.
Except it dont make any sense at all.
Brezinski's job is to write up a contract when the coaches and the player personel tell him to.

And the reason we are so far under the cap each year is because of the up front money.
Do you remember two years ago when we signed Hutch and Taylor and then went on to give K Will a nice big juicy contract? Not to mention the other contracts that were signed and the rookies as well.

Them kind of contracts would of killed many teams, but not the Vikings.
Rob Brezinski is the reason why.

And if Brezinski is as smart about coaching as he is with salaries then yes he should be coach and gm.


I've kindof been on this soap box all week, if you haven't noticed.

;D

The coaches do not make the decision who gets contracts.
In fact, in its simplest form, it is a more of a front office kindof thing that the coaches have input into.

The Owner(s), Studwell, Medical Doctors, Capologist, Psychologist, PR reps etc etc etc all have an input.
The Head Coach has a say as well, however, not as much as some people think.

You seen the quote I've been stealing from Parcells lately?


"If they want you to cook the dinner, at least they ought to let you shop for some of the groceries."

He was alluding to the fact that he didn't have very much say in the players that were put on the field.
He just had to coach what they gave him.

That was from Coach Parcells.
The Tuna.
Master of his own destinay, and yet, he didn't get to select his players.

No my friend, the coaches don't tell Mr. Brazsinski who to sign.




We don't really know how much say BC gets, my guess would be a good sum seeing as we don't have a GM.

But the Tuna had Jerry Jones. And Jerry Jones likes to bring his guys in. I know Zygi has much less input than some owners in the NFL.


Isn't Brazyznski our GM? And if he is, does he have the credentials to be an effective GM as it relates to things other than salary cap management? Does anybody know what his job description consists of at all or is the structure of the organization clouded in mystery?

No, as a matter of fact, we don't have a GM.
We have a 3 people that make decisions (The triangle of Authority) which didn't work with the first iteration.
Someone got fired after only being here a few months, after he almost screwed the pooch on the draft (my assumption it is because we didn't get Cutler or Kellen and had to settle for TJ) in 2006.

There still has been a few snaffu's (I can only assume but it is/was over the FA period this year) so now the owner wants to be more involved in day to day operations and personnel decisions.

End all to be all, we have a Triangle of Authority plus one, the owner.
Kindof wierd if you ask me.

soonerbornNbred
10-24-2007, 09:15 PM
uffda you are getting at exactly what Im trying to say... Yes baltimore , chicago, Tampa Bay did succeed in different style than Pats Colts...but 10 to 1 says their "core" guys the ones they call the identity of their teams
Ray Lewis, Urlacher...TB's def players were the highest paid players on their teams....so Im thinking the 5-7 highest paid guys on the Vikings are the guys that need to be takin the lead and carryin this team to succeed.....I might be crazy