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View Full Version : FIRE TILLMAN!!!



kramer9guy
11-21-2004, 12:07 PM
Our special teams are horrid. Rusty Tillman sucks!!! Every decision the guy has made has been a joke.

XTAP59
11-21-2004, 12:17 PM
"kramer9guy" wrote:

Our special teams are horrid. Rusty Tillman sucks!!! Every decision the guy has made has been a joke.

And draft Nugent in 2005....

ItalianStallion
11-21-2004, 12:46 PM
Seriously stop mentioning Nugent, its getting old. It like the people who wanted to draft Kaeding this year in the second round. Not to mention the draft is a long way off.

Rusty Tillman should be fired and probably will be, he is a terrible special teams coach.

XTAP59
11-21-2004, 12:56 PM
"ItalianStallion" wrote:

Seriously stop mentioning Nugent, its getting old. It like the people who wanted to draft Kaeding this year in the second round. Not to mention the draft is a long way off.

Rusty Tillman should be fired and probably will be, he is a terrible special teams coach.

Excuse me. I was continuing a thread about a position that we seriously need for the past 5 years...

Tell you what. I'll stop posting about the special teams, you stop posting about Tillman, Tice, Moss, Bennett, Smith, Hovan, and any other topic that has more than 5 replies to....

I'm sorry if this topic doesn't interest you. It does to me. I would suggest that you merely don't read this thread anymore instead of dictating to me what I can and cannot post about.

VikingsTw
11-21-2004, 01:07 PM
I'm agree with you X Tap, problems are problems, if we have to beg to get a kicker then so be it. The lions kicker just pounded a 48 yard kick, man i wish we could do that.


NUGENT FIRST ROUND F*CK IT!

VikingsTw
11-21-2004, 01:09 PM
"ItalianStallion" wrote:

Seriously stop mentioning Nugent, its getting old. It like the people who wanted to draft Kaeding this year in the second round. Not to mention the draft is a long way off.

Rusty Tillman should be fired and probably will be, he is a terrible special teams coach.

You wanna know what else is getting old, kicks to the 20 yard line and not having a kicker that can kick a 40+ field goal, PATHETIC. :angryfire:

kramer9guy
11-21-2004, 01:19 PM
Yes, we do need a kicker...but no, do not use a first round pick on one. Nugent would be the number one kicker to draft but not in the 1st round. I'd say that if he's still available in the 3rd round then take him. If we drafted a kicker in the first and he crumbled in the big league, we would be second guessing that pick for a very long time. Eddie Johnson was a very good college punter. He sucked in the NFL. Who knows, probably Tillman's fault.

CanuckVike
11-21-2004, 01:35 PM
If this game keeps going the same way, you'll probably end up adding Tice, Linehan and Cotrell to that list!

The defense is the worst I've ever seen...either is getting stupider with experience or Cotrell can't anything out of them.

That 4th and 1 call was the WORST! Stupid call and terribly executed on top of that...and Tice...I'm sorry to say is who's responsible for letting it all happen.

LosAngelis
11-21-2004, 01:39 PM
Here's the rub:

The Packers went in with the attitude of getting the best punter. The best punter, however, in a given year, is going to be the best punter ever, and we traded up to get a guy who is, at best, a developmental project.

Go in with the attitude of getting the best kicker in the draft, and you just might get him...but will he be the best kicker.

The thing talked about a lot on Packer boards is having your scouts really be scouting the kickers, and immediately signing the best that aren't drafted...maybe two of them.

So many kickers need to to develop, and its hard to guess which one will do it.

ItalianStallion
11-21-2004, 02:51 PM
"XTAP59" wrote:

"ItalianStallion" wrote:

Seriously stop mentioning Nugent, its getting old. It like the people who wanted to draft Kaeding this year in the second round. Not to mention the draft is a long way off.

Rusty Tillman should be fired and probably will be, he is a terrible special teams coach.

Excuse me. I was continuing a thread about a position that we seriously need for the past 5 years...

Tell you what. I'll stop posting about the special teams, you stop posting about Tillman, Tice, Moss, Bennett, Smith, Hovan, and any other topic that has more than 5 replies to....

I'm sorry if this topic doesn't interest you. It does to me. I would suggest that you merely don't read this thread anymore instead of dictating to me what I can and cannot post about.

I don't mind you talking about special teams, I don't even mind the comments about us getting a new kicker.

It just seems like your this kid's agent or something the way you bring him up in EVERY thread.

XTAP59
11-21-2004, 03:08 PM
"kramer9guy" wrote:

Yes, we do need a kicker...but no, do not use a first round pick on one. Nugent would be the number one kicker to draft but not in the 1st round. I'd say that if he's still available in the 3rd round then take him. If we drafted a kicker in the first and he crumbled in the big league, we would be second guessing that pick for a very long time. Eddie Johnson was a very good college punter. He sucked in the NFL. Who knows, probably Tillman's fault.

You mean kind of like second guessing picking DE Underwood in the first round a few years back.....?
Yes, the draft is a crapshoot but a kicker like nugent is proven in College, should be a great pick.

whackthepack
11-22-2004, 09:17 AM
Rusty Tillman should be FIRED today!!!

For 3 years we have been hearing how he is one of the best special teams coaches in the league and I have yet to see any proof of this.

Our special teams play has not gotten better over the last 3 years but worse, anybody could do as bad as this jackass!!!!!!!!!!!!

Maybe it will send a message to everybody in the organization that their job could be next!

snowinapril
11-22-2004, 09:57 AM
Do you realize if we needed to kick a FG like the infamous Atlanta FG, we wouldn't be able to attempt it.

We don't even have a kicker to get it that far. We would probably have DC take a whack at it, cause Morty is not even going to try. His leg would fall off if he had to attempt a FG that long.

Point: If we have a FG of importance, we are screwed if it is longer than 42 yds. If it is under 7 sec on the clock we can't even run a nother play to get closer. He have to go for the end zone. Now this is a TICE decision more so than a Tillman decision. If he would have made the decision to find a kicker that could do both KOs and FGs it would make Tillmans job a little easier.

I am not defending Tillman as much as I am calling out Tice. Tice hired Tillman.

snowinapril
11-22-2004, 10:01 AM
"whackthepack" wrote:

Rusty Tillman should be FIRED today!!!

For 3 years we have been hearing how he is one of the best special teams coaches in the league and I have yet to see any proof of this.

Our special teams play has not gotten better over the last 3 years but worse, anybody could do as bad as this jackass!!!!!!!!!!!!

Maybe it will send a message to everybody in the organization that their job could be next!

I think that the kickers are the Problem as much as the coach. Except for Berger, our kickers have been sub-par. Old ass kickers and now an Old ass punter. Their strength is gone along with their youth. Their disire to get a check outways their desire to keep improving, just part of getting older.

whackthepack
11-22-2004, 10:24 AM
It's not even the kicking or punting as much as the cover units and who and where they are on the field.

They are always trying new guys at coverage and it never gets better, and I blame that on Tillman and think that he is not the answer.

UTVikfan
11-22-2004, 10:30 AM
I am just not seeing, except for long field goals, the problem with our kickers. I must be nuts.
And YES, let draft Ted Nugent. If he can't kick it, he can shoot it with his bow. =P. Seriously, The only first round kicker I can think of was Ray Guy, and he WAS actually worth it. But, I bet they coulda got him in the third round, too.

snowinapril
11-22-2004, 10:32 AM
"whackthepack" wrote:

It's not even the kicking or punting as much as the cover units and who and where they are on the field.

They are always trying new guys at coverage and it never gets better, and I blame that on Tillman and think that he is not the answer.

Injuries are playing a big part in the personel.

The lack of kicking it into the end zone or being able to kick it where you are suppose to also plays a huge part. The coverage guys know they need to get to a certain spot at a certain amount of time. When the timing and positioning is off then the coverage is off.

It isn't worth arguing about, all I can really be confident in saying is that the Special Teams are playing poorly. It sound like it could be a personel problem from your comments as much as a coaching problem.

VKG4LFE
11-22-2004, 10:40 AM
Wasn't Sebastian Janikowski a first rounder a few years ago for Oakland? I could be wrong but I thought they drafted him in the first and their punter (Lechler from Texas A&M) in the second round. Unless it was Janikowski in the 6th round and Lechler in the 7th.

XTAP59
11-22-2004, 11:34 AM
"UTVikfan" wrote:

I am just not seeing, except for long field goals, the problem with our kickers. I must be nuts.
And YES, let draft Ted Nugent. If he can't kick it, he can shoot it with his bow. =P. Seriously, The only first round kicker I can think of was Ray Guy, and he WAS actually worth it. But, I bet they coulda got him in the third round, too.

I believe Janokowski went in the first to Oakland several years ago.
As for the problems with our kickers. Look at the average starting point for the opposing teams we play compared to ours.
Just look at Sundays game for the answer. The Lions kicked out butts on special teams not just for the return on opening kickoff for a TD, but on almost every kickoff.
They had great field advantage, and were more apt to score easier than driving an additional 15-20 yards per possession.

A big time kicker would eliminate that.

snowinapril
11-22-2004, 11:39 AM
"XTAP59" wrote:

"UTVikfan" wrote:

I am just not seeing, except for long field goals, the problem with our kickers. I must be nuts.
And YES, let draft Ted Nugent. If he can't kick it, he can shoot it with his bow. =P. Seriously, The only first round kicker I can think of was Ray Guy, and he WAS actually worth it. But, I bet they coulda got him in the third round, too.

I believe Janokowski went in the first to Oakland several years ago.
As for the problems with our kickers. Look at the average starting point for the opposing teams we play compared to ours.
Just look at Sundays game for the answer. The Lions kicked out butts on special teams not just for the return on opening kickoff for a TD, but on almost every kickoff.
They had great field advantage, and were more apt to score easier than driving an additional 15-20 yards per possession.

A big time kicker would eliminate that.

Those 20 yds are six more chances for our D to make a stop and keep the other team from scoring.

whackthepack
11-22-2004, 12:31 PM
"snowinapril" wrote:

"whackthepack" wrote:

It's not even the kicking or punting as much as the cover units and who and where they are on the field.

They are always trying new guys at coverage and it never gets better, and I blame that on Tillman and think that he is not the answer.

Injuries are playing a big part in the personel.

The lack of kicking it into the end zone or being able to kick it where you are suppose to also plays a huge part. The coverage guys know they need to get to a certain spot at a certain amount of time. When the timing and positioning is off then the coverage is off.

It isn't worth arguing about, all I can really be confident in saying is that the Special Teams are playing poorly. It sound like it could be a personel problem from your comments as much as a coaching problem.


Sorry snowapril have to disagree, he has had 3 years to get players in the right places and every year our coverages is the worst in the league! I am positive that every team in the NFL has had injury issues but they seem to be able to find guys that can play on special teams!

Fire Tillman!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!

and I have been a Tice backer but this team is lacking stupid penalties at stupid times and the same mistakes week after week.

It seems to come down to either coaching or personal, and I think we have added enough talent on this team to be playing better than we are.

UTVikfan
11-22-2004, 12:43 PM
Xtap59 every one? Hmm, Did I miss a tackle at like the 10 or so in the 4th quarter? I WILL see that game again. My memory is not so sharp, I miss more sleep than I should. But WHO cares if he takes it at the 15 if he is dropped on the spot. Ummmm, you know the guy who returned TWO kicks for TD's last week? Yeah, look at that game again. If you don't have Tivo and can't. Get it. One, hey, that guy IS good. Two? DIDN"T HAPPEN. From what I have seen, and again, I am crazy, our special teams are doing pretty good. Its only in Madden that you can create your very own special kicker that is better than real life. Go find one now.....Its almost Dec. and we couldn't even find anyone but Andersen and Elling back before this all started. Here is my question, who you gonna replace Tillman with? Oh thats easy, just like the kicker get Vinetari, right? Fantasy. Yep. The Dante Hall of this year runs one back, nbd. You all do remember last year and what Hall did to us RIGHT?

VKG4LFE
11-22-2004, 12:53 PM
"UTVikfan" wrote:

Xtap59 every one? Hmm, Did I miss a tackle at like the 10 or so in the 4th quarter? I WILL see that game again. My memory is not so sharp, I miss more sleep than I should. But WHO cares if he takes it at the 15 if he is dropped on the spot. Ummmm, you know the guy who returned TWO kicks for TD's last week? Yeah, look at that game again. If you don't have Tivo and can't. Get it. One, hey, that guy IS good. Two? DIDN"T HAPPEN. From what I have seen, and again, I am crazy, our special teams are doing pretty good. Its only in Madden that you can create your very own special kicker that is better than real life. Go find one now.....Its almost Dec. and we couldn't even find anyone but Andersen and Elling back before this all started. Here is my question, who you gonna replace Tillman with? Oh thats easy, just like the kicker get Vinetari, right? Fantasy. Yep. The Dante Hall of this year runs one back, nbd. You all do remember last year and what Hall did to us RIGHT?

Yeah, Hall did nothing against us last year!

XTAP59
11-22-2004, 01:30 PM
"UTVikfan" wrote:

Xtap59 every one? Hmm, Did I miss a tackle at like the 10 or so in the 4th quarter? I WILL see that game again. My memory is not so sharp, I miss more sleep than I should. But WHO cares if he takes it at the 15 if he is dropped on the spot. Ummmm, you know the guy who returned TWO kicks for TD's last week? Yeah, look at that game again. If you don't have Tivo and can't. Get it. One, hey, that guy IS good. Two? DIDN"T HAPPEN. From what I have seen, and again, I am crazy, our special teams are doing pretty good. Its only in Madden that you can create your very own special kicker that is better than real life. Go find one now.....Its almost Dec. and we couldn't even find anyone but Andersen and Elling back before this all started. Here is my question, who you gonna replace Tillman with? Oh thats easy, just like the kicker get Vinetari, right? Fantasy. Yep. The Dante Hall of this year runs one back, nbd. You all do remember last year and what Hall did to us RIGHT?

Let me try to decipher your reply.....
First, everyone what?....Please explain....
Second, No, I don't have TIVO but if I did it wouldn't matter. The fact is the Lion returner took it to the house on the opening play. He fielded a short, low kickoff and and took it to the house. That doesn't excuse the poor play from our special teams, but my point was/ is that if we had a kicker like Nugent, the Lions would be starting at their own 20 yard line instead of getting a quick 7 points on us.
Third, your comment that our special teams are "Doing pretty good". I beg to differ. I think we are one of the worst, if not the worst special teams in the league. Our FG kicker does not have a range past 42 yards, our so-called kickoff specialist cannot get the ball deep hence leeting opposing teams start around their 35 yard line. Our coverage guys whiff and miss consistently. On almost every return for the Vikings, there is a penalty for blocking in the back or whatever other stupid penalty that draw. In essence, the Vikes special teams are not special.
Fourth, cannot figure out the Madden comment you made. Are you talking play station 2?
Fifth, you tell me to go find a kicker now. Why me? I'm only a fan. I trust the management to do so. They didn't do it for the past 4-5 years. My reply was to draft a kicker like Nugent in next years draft. Where did I say that we HAVE to replace one now?
Sixth, who to replace tillman with? Mayor McCheese or Ronald McDonald could do a better job than Tillman.
Seventh, please explain your statement on "Vinetari".
Eight, What does Dante Hall have to do with the Vikes drafting a kicker in 2005? Is that what you're asking? If so, if we had a kicker that could put the ball in the endzone almost every time, than we wouldn't have to contend with Hall on kickoffs, only punts.

I hope this clears things up for you. Next time, please copy quote the post you are replying so I may give you a better reply.

Skol Vikings