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View Full Version : Is Tice at fault for the lack of discipline on the team?



Viking_Spirit
08-20-2004, 12:22 PM
OK, with another recent substance abuse related suspension on our team, I think the lack of discipline is evident. The question is, is Tice at fault for it? I think he is. Don't get me wrong, I like Tice as a coach, but I think he needs to clamp down on all this substance abuse, and he's done a pretty bad job at it so far. i think that's evident with everything that's taken place over the last year. So, I'll be looking for these substance abuse cases to stop.

What do you think?

bigdogbovy
08-20-2004, 12:26 PM
Tice had done a lot to avoid these types of things. Made unpopular decisions like keeping the guys at camp overnight instead of lettign them go before a game. The fault here lies squrely on the retarded head of the idiot who has everything he needs, but want to add a pile of $hit to his life for a little "fun". congradulations Smith your "fun" for one night just set your carreer back at least a year.

sdvikefan
08-20-2004, 12:30 PM
Onterrio Smith is responsible for his actions. But there are some coaches in this league who would never tolerate this kind of crap. Tice needs to toughen up and bring more discipline to the team.

purplehorn
08-20-2004, 12:58 PM
These players are adults who make their own
decisions and than face the action imposed by
the NFL. Clearly not Tices fault.

triedandtruevikesfan
08-20-2004, 01:00 PM
Tice has been trying to keep these boys in line! He can't hold there hands 24 hrs a day. At this point the only thing he can do is crack down and take playing time away from the idiots!

Viking_Spirit
08-20-2004, 01:02 PM
"triedandtruevikesfan" wrote:

Tice has been trying to keep these boys in line! He can't hold there hands 24 hrs a day. At this point the only thing he can do is crack down and take playing time away from the idiots!
The problem is that he really hasn't cracked down. That's where I put the fault with him. I think a coach like Parcells or Coughlin would have cracked down on this a long time ago. Tice needs to crack down now.

triedandtruevikesfan
08-20-2004, 01:03 PM
I can't argue with you there!

Webby
08-20-2004, 01:05 PM
He isn't at fault.

RK.
08-20-2004, 01:13 PM
When you guys say "crack down" what exactly is it you expect him to do? Spank them? Treat them like children?

The truth is drugs are a problem in all facets of this country and sports are not exempt from it. :(

triedandtruevikesfan
08-20-2004, 01:18 PM
No Webby its not his fault at all... these are grown men. And when I say crack down... I mean make it matter when they do this stupid crap. Bench them or take away playing time... its about all he can do!

Viking_Spirit
08-20-2004, 01:19 PM
"RK" wrote:

When you guys say "crack down" what exactly is it you expect him to do? Spank them? Treat them like children?

The truth is drugs are a problem in all facets of this country and sports are not exempt from it. :(
I expect him to get the players in trouble. Like with EJ, he should have done something to him (he did nothing). Same with K. Willliams. I think it would help tremendously with team discipline if he did something to either of them, show the players that doing drugs and DUI's are unacceptable under him. Right now he's not doing that.

Just look at how many times there have been substance abuse related incidents in the last year. Onterrio with his pot (happened in college, and it's back again). EJ's drunk driving (second time it happened to him). Mixon's drunk driving (hat this problem when he came from Miami, then gets 2 DUI's up here). K Will's drunk driving. The problem is with 3 out of these 4 guys, Tice knew that they had substance abuse problems when he put them on the team. What does he do about it? NOTHING. Look what happens. They get in trouble again. I don't care if they are grown adults. Tice needs to do something about it, because this comes back to hurt team discipline. Players get the preception that they can run around and smoke dope, and Tice will do nothing about it. That's unacceptable.

This is the one problem I have with Tice.

purplehorn
08-20-2004, 01:54 PM
"Viking_Spirit" wrote:

. Players get to run around and smoke dope, and that's acceptable.

.

Sweet 8)

packmanxxxi
08-20-2004, 01:56 PM
You needed to have a "somewhat" category on the poll. Is he totally at fault? NO. Adults can make their own choices. However, he IS at fault for CONSTANTLY surrounding himself with players who routinly make bad choices- ala Moss, Smith, etc.

Viking_Spirit
08-20-2004, 02:03 PM
"purplehorn" wrote:

"Viking_Spirit" wrote:

. Players get to run around and smoke dope, and that's acceptable.

.

Sweet 8)
That was a typo by me, I edited it.
*edit*-did you just change my words when you quoted me?

Also, Byron Chamberlian needs to be added to the list. It's gotten to the point where Tice needs to show some athourity and do something about this. What has he done so far? NOTHING. He has to do something to stop this problem of substance abuse on our team.

jiggyjack
08-20-2004, 02:49 PM
these guys make there own choices. im just glad that tice does not seem to play favorites like denny did. regardless of who it is there should be team penalties for this kind of garbage. i think overall he hurt himself with this one. he had a chance to shine over bennett. too bad.

Viking_Spirit
08-20-2004, 02:51 PM
"jiggyjack" wrote:

these guys make there own choices. im just glad that tice does not seem to play favorites like denny did. regardless of who it is there should be team penalties for this kind of garbage. i think overall he hurt himself with this one. he had a chance to shine over bennett. too bad.
The thing is Tice can influence these choices. So far he has not chosen to do so.

RK.
08-20-2004, 03:21 PM
I would have to assume that these guys know that the coach as well as the rest of the team are down on them for screwing up. And I assume there are things going on that are not in the press. The fact that they are missing games from suspensions is a pretty big deal. I doubt that it is accurate to say that nothing is being done.

VikingsTw
08-20-2004, 03:27 PM
you can influence at some point but then they are on there own, i'm sure of it that tice has stressed the fact of staying out of trouble, we dont know what he has said to people like EJ and K.Williams, i'm sure he has them behaving if not they need to be cut or traded.

The fact is u can only influence them so far after that there own little ego takes affect "ow i play for the vikings i can do whatever i want"

Onterrio may grow out of this little stage, I talked to one of his high school teachers he said he was an unbalievable football player but acedemically he wasnt so great and sometimes was in trouble, I hope he can get past this and be our back up RB

RandyMoss8404
08-20-2004, 03:51 PM
There's a slight - and by slight I mean gargantuan difference between Mike Tice and Bill Parcells.

EJ, Mixon, etc, get drunk, drive, suspended, etc. They come back and play.

Quincy Carter fails a drug test? GONE.

That's what Tice should have done.

whackthepack
08-20-2004, 04:02 PM
Maybe they knew there was a problem with Onterrio and that might be why they took Moore in this years draft. Maybe Onterrio will not be on this team long term?

pudgesoprano
08-20-2004, 04:03 PM
"RandyMoss8404" wrote:

There's a slight - and by slight I mean gargantuan difference between Mike Tice and Bill Parcells.

EJ, Mixon, etc, get drunk, drive, suspended, etc. They come back and play.

Quincy Carter fails a drug test? GONE.

That's what Tice should have done.



didn't quincy fail a drug test twice

sdvikefan
08-20-2004, 04:04 PM
"RandyMoss8404" wrote:

There's a slight - and by slight I mean gargantuan difference between Mike Tice and Bill Parcells.

EJ, Mixon, etc, get drunk, drive, suspended, etc. They come back and play.

Quincy Carter fails a drug test? GONE.

That's what Tice should have done.

Exactly. That move may not have been popular and it may have set the offense back temporarily, but it shows that Parcells does not tolerate screwing around. Onterrio Smith should be out a lot longer than four games. This is going to be a problem again later down the road if it's not handled properly now. And it's up to Tice to handle it.

Jer
08-20-2004, 04:14 PM
Mike McKenzie-This is related to disciplinary issues. He isn't doing what he should be doing and Mike Sherman isn't having any of it. He got rid of JJ. Sherman has done a good job. There were some questions this offeason about whether or not Mike had control of the team citing the several times they came out of the gate flat against bad teams, but he seems to have made this a "don't miss the boat because its leaving whether or not you want to be on it team." Only guys with positive attitudes and desire to work hard will be on the team. Cletidus got chewed out for his mess-ups.

Bill Belicheck (spelling) is the best example of this. He does this all the time regardless of the player whether it be a cap issue concerning a holdout, drugs, star player or not a star player he cuts ties when it hurts the team. As Vikings fans you guys want this to turn out better and have Tice in control of things. For the good of the NFL I would love to see all teams improve upon this. If you let in to a guy it will let in to further problems. I like it when its the Vikes, but generally its just like, "Wow you're stupid." He is stupid and I'm glad at least he's on the Vikes, but this junk happens everywhere in the NFL and it needs to stop. We all should stop pampering the primma donna athlete.

pudgesoprano
08-20-2004, 04:17 PM
"Jer" wrote:

Mike McKenzie-This is related to disciplinary issues. He isn't doing what he should be doing and Mike Sherman isn't having any of it. He got rid of JJ. Sherman has done a good job. There were some questions this offeason about whether or not Mike had control of the team citing the several times they came out of the gate flat against bad teams, but he seems to have made this a "don't miss the boat because its leaving whether or not you want to be on it team." Only guys with positive attitudes and desire to work hard will be on the team. Cletidus got chewed out for his mess-ups.

Bill Belicheck (spelling) is the best example of this. He does this all the time regardless of the player whether it be a cap issue concerning a holdout, drugs, star player or not a star player he cuts ties when it hurts the team. As Vikings fans you guys want this to turn out better and have Tice in control of things. For the good of the NFL I would love to see all teams improve upon this. If you let in to a guy it will let in to further problems. I like it when its the Vikes, but generally its just like, "Wow you're stupid." He is stupid and I'm glad at least he's on the Vikes, but this junk happens everywhere in the NFL and it needs to stop. We all should stop pampering the primma donna athlete.



did the patriots just trade for dillion,farve went rehab and freeman got arrested for drinking and driving

packmanxxxi
08-20-2004, 05:32 PM
"pudgesoprano" wrote:

"Jer" wrote:

Mike McKenzie-This is related to disciplinary issues. He isn't doing what he should be doing and Mike Sherman isn't having any of it. He got rid of JJ. Sherman has done a good job. There were some questions this offeason about whether or not Mike had control of the team citing the several times they came out of the gate flat against bad teams, but he seems to have made this a "don't miss the boat because its leaving whether or not you want to be on it team." Only guys with positive attitudes and desire to work hard will be on the team. Cletidus got chewed out for his mess-ups.

Bill Belicheck (spelling) is the best example of this. He does this all the time regardless of the player whether it be a cap issue concerning a holdout, drugs, star player or not a star player he cuts ties when it hurts the team. As Vikings fans you guys want this to turn out better and have Tice in control of things. For the good of the NFL I would love to see all teams improve upon this. If you let in to a guy it will let in to further problems. I like it when its the Vikes, but generally its just like, "Wow you're stupid." He is stupid and I'm glad at least he's on the Vikes, but this junk happens everywhere in the NFL and it needs to stop. We all should stop pampering the primma donna athlete.



did the patriots just trade for dillion,farve went rehab and freeman got arrested for drinking and driving

I toally agree with the Dillon and Freeman comment- but Favre went to rehab VOLUNTARILY, after being hooked on painkillers, which EVERY NFL player takes. Anyone here who smokes or has any other addiction can tell you what its like. The Favre situation is no where near this one. An addiction is not a choice, this situation was.

duffVIkEs
08-21-2004, 01:13 AM
nah its not his fault,its the players attitudes

dan3ski
08-21-2004, 01:20 AM
Did not Parcells cut his starting QB from last year due to a positive drug test the Cowboys did? Mike Tice take notice! This was not a league test it was a team test!

muchluv4smoot
08-21-2004, 10:22 AM
"Viking_Spirit" wrote:

"jiggyjack" wrote:

these guys make there own choices. im just glad that tice does not seem to play favorites like denny did. regardless of who it is there should be team penalties for this kind of garbage. i think overall he hurt himself with this one. he had a chance to shine over bennett. too bad.
The thing is Tice can influence these choices. So far he has not chosen to do so.



Yeah, I get so sick of hearing that the players are adults and they are solely resposible. I wonder why there have been so many viking players getting into trouble, yet you don't see and patriot players get into trouble. Personally I think it is because of the 2 coaches. Guys like parcells and bellicick(SP?) would never have let this many players get into trouble before he started to get pissed and started fining and suspending them. I have been saying this all offseason, that when mixon got his last DUI, Tice shouldn't have stood by him and kept him as a starter, he shoulkd have released him and showed the players that he isn't gonna tolerate this crap. He acted like it was no big deal, so other vikes players didn't worry about getting into trouble, and they did get into trouble.

Players are adults and make their own descisions, yes I know this, but it is a coaches job to constantly burn into their heads that it is unacceptable to get into trouble and give the vikes organiztion a bad name. This is where Tice is to blame. He doesn't seem to care when guys get into trouble and that isn't right at all. Remember when Tice took over this team and he said he wasn't gonna draft and sign just any players, that he was gonna bring in guys with great character first before great skills?? What happened to that?

Sure each player deserves some blame, but to say no blame goes on the coach, is the reason why this crap will continue, until tice makes an example of someone.

casper
08-21-2004, 12:12 PM
VS and Et All remember the song "one bad apple don't spoil the hole bunch" as a number of folks have said Smith is a big boy let him take the hit, how do you think the rest of the team will feel like if they have done nothing wrong work hard followed the rules to get razed by the coaching staff and rode harder for WHAT? someone else's off time screw-up.....OFF TIME....NOT on the practice field not on the gridiron, not in the training area...kind of makes you wonder why they call it Training Camp :scratch: hunnnn

If the team has a weak link they all should suffer is whatyou are saying...sorry I believe it is better to pull that link out and put a new one in so the training can continue at the same pace no problems.

TICE is fine Smith is the bone head

Viking_Spirit
08-21-2004, 12:23 PM
OK, I saw Onterrio Smith in the game lastnight. What the hell? The guy just got suspended and Tice lets him play? This is the kind of crap I am talking about. Tice needs to bench Onterrio for the rest of the preseason...although that wouldn't be enough.

And Casper, if the rest of the team took the hit, I think they would realize that substance abuse is not the way to go and that Tice is going to take no more BS. Right now they do not realize that, that's why all these substance abuse cases are occuring, and in some cases reoccuing. Tice needs to take some kind of stand like that to show the team that substance abuse will not cut it under him.

Muchluv4moss, you hit the nail right on the head.

purplehorn
08-21-2004, 12:55 PM
"dan3ski" wrote:

Did not Parcells cut his starting QB from last year due to a positive drug test the Cowboys did? !

Ya Quincy watchin the playoffs from the house Carter whipty Freakin
Do.

muchluv4smoot
08-21-2004, 12:56 PM
Look at it this way, do you guys think that if bill parcells or billicheck were the coach of the vikes, that we would have had all these players getting into trouble? Hell no! We may have had one guy get into trouble, but that would be when parcells or billicheck would put their foot down and stop it from happening again. I can garauntee you guys that the pats and cowboys have a bunch of guys that are every bit as dumb as our guys, yet they aren't getting into trouble like ours are. There must be a reason for that?

muchluv4smoot
08-21-2004, 12:58 PM
"purplehorn" wrote:

"dan3ski" wrote:

Did not Parcells cut his starting QB from last year due to a positive drug test the Cowboys did? !

Ya Quincy watchin the playoffs from the house Carter whipty Freakin
Do.



Cutting your starting QB, who lead your team to a 10-6 record and to the playoffs, is no big deal??? WOW! What r you talking about. Carter might not have been a great QB, but he was their starter and there was a reason for that.

muchluv4smoot
08-21-2004, 01:01 PM
"muchluv4moss" wrote:

"purplehorn" wrote:

"dan3ski" wrote:

Did not Parcells cut his starting QB from last year due to a positive drug test the Cowboys did? !

Ya Quincy watchin the playoffs from the house Carter whipty Freakin
Do.



Cutting your starting QB, who lead your team to a 10-6 record and to the playoffs, is no big deal??? WOW! What r you talking about. Carter might not have been a great QB, but he was their starter and there was a reason for that.



And are you trying to argue that bill parcells and tice deal with their players the same way? Ask any player that has played for parcells and a different coach, and they will tell you the difference that parcells makes.

purplehorn
08-21-2004, 01:12 PM
If I wasn't clear I promise you Parcells and co
will be watching the Tice and co in the playoffs
so big deal.

muchluv4smoot
08-21-2004, 01:24 PM
The fact is, tice doesn't discipline his team like parcells does, and that would give him some blame on all this too, not just the players.

pudgesoprano
08-21-2004, 08:38 PM
"muchluv4moss" wrote:

Look at it this way, do you guys think that if bill parcells or billicheck were the coach of the vikes, that we would have had all these players getting into trouble? Hell no! We may have had one guy get into trouble, but that would be when parcells or billicheck would put their foot down and stop it from happening again. I can garauntee you guys that the pats and cowboys have a bunch of guys that are every bit as dumb as our guys, yet they aren't getting into trouble like ours are. There must be a reason for that?

And are you trying to argue that bill parcells and tice deal with their players the same way? Ask any player that has played for parcells and a different coach, and they will tell you the difference that parcells makes.[/quote]









LT did not get cut,he keep keyshawn johnson after he wrote a book ripping he's teamates then traded for him again, after he was suspened from his team,antino bryant throw a towel at him he's still there,drafted julius jones who was kick out of notre dame yeah he was let back in but bill parcells is not perfect

muchluv4smoot
08-22-2004, 07:40 PM
"pudgesoprano" wrote:

"muchluv4moss" wrote:

Look at it this way, do you guys think that if bill parcells or billicheck were the coach of the vikes, that we would have had all these players getting into trouble? Hell no! We may have had one guy get into trouble, but that would be when parcells or billicheck would put their foot down and stop it from happening again. I can garauntee you guys that the pats and cowboys have a bunch of guys that are every bit as dumb as our guys, yet they aren't getting into trouble like ours are. There must be a reason for that?

And are you trying to argue that bill parcells and tice deal with their players the same way? Ask any player that has played for parcells and a different coach, and they will tell you the difference that parcells makes.









LT did not get cut,he keep keyshawn johnson after he wrote a book ripping he's teamates then traded for him again, after he was suspened from his team,antino bryant throw a towel at him he's still there,drafted julius jones who was kick out of notre dame yeah he was let back in but bill parcells is not perfect[/quote]



How many bill parcell players have you seen get DUI's or suspended for drugs, and that remain on the team. A coach is actually not supose to cut a guy for violating the leagues substance abuse policy, but that is clearly what happened with quincy. Meshawn did sbsolutely nothing when playing for parcells, so i don't know what he has to do with this? Did he get in trouble with the law, like all our vikes players have been since tice has been here? Antonio bryant, again not in trouble with the law, LT the same. Parcells is not perfect, but he would not allow our team to get this bad and in this much trouble, same with bellicheck. NO DOUBT IN MY MIND. I don't understand why people think he has no responsibility in these matters? I am not putting the blame all on him, but to say it is only the players to blame, thats not right.

Kleinsasser40
08-23-2004, 01:00 PM
I don't think it is Tice's fault for the lack of discipline on the team. If you look all around the leage players are getting caught doing all sorts of things, like Jamal Lewis for example. Its not something exclusive to the Vikes, its going all around the leage and is just something you see more of in players these days.

If anything, I think Tice has helped the players becomre more disciplined. Look what he has done to Moss. He turned him from a "all about me cop runner-over" into a mature leader for the offense and for the team. I cannot believe the turnaround in Randy!

josdin00
08-23-2004, 01:44 PM
Drug tests can only be conducted by the league, and not by individual teams. If Parcells did conduct a drug test on his own, then he will face sanctions from the league and from the players union.

Also, teams and coaches are not notified of the results of drug tests unless a player is suspended and/or fined. Even then, I'm not sure if the league even tells the team what drug showed up positive.

Now, I don't remember reading ever that Smith got fined by the league, so they might have immediately put him at the third stage of the drug monitering program because of the problems he had in college. Therefore, this suspension could be the first thing Tice has heard about Onterrio's drug problem re-surfacing.

I think it's pure ignorance to assume that nothing is going on behind the scenes. There are a lot of rules put into the CBA as to what a coach and a team can do in response to a positive test. I'm sure Tice is trying to get the message across, but there's only so much he can do within the rules.

VikingsTw
08-23-2004, 03:55 PM
I think parcells is gay. I dont like him hes wierd he doesnt let his players talk to him on monday, If i was drafted by the cowboys i would ask to be traded imediatly the dude is a fruit. He may be a good coach but there is other good coaches out there to. I would want to play for a coach u can joke with and have fun but still get the job done. Parcells is uptight and wierd i would hate to play for him he always seems to be pissed and never in a good mood.

purplehorn
08-23-2004, 05:36 PM
He's ugly and his mamma dresses him funny too.

VikingsTw
08-23-2004, 06:21 PM
Tell me about it, he looks like a mushroom.

Kleinsasser40
08-24-2004, 10:41 AM
"vikingstw" wrote:

I think parcells is ***. I dont like him hes wierd he doesnt let his players talk to him on monday, If i was drafted by the cowboys i would ask to be traded imediatly the dude is a fruit. He may be a good coach but there is other good coaches out there to. I would want to play for a coach u can joke with and have fun but still get the job done. Parcells is uptight and wierd i would hate to play for him he always seems to be pissed and never in a good mood.


I agree dude, he seems just too bitter and anal. It seems like he is always pissed off, and if I was playing football professionally, even though I would be getting paid I would want to be having fun, and I'm sorry, but playing for him does not look like any part of it would be fun.

VKG4LFE
08-24-2004, 10:58 AM
Hey packman, he didn't draft Moss. I don't think he is surrounding himself with these "types" of players. I bet if the NFL took a mandatory anonymous poll that about 80 to 90% of the players at one time have used some type of drug or steroid or something. Some just never did or haven't been caught! Tice cannot be blamed for what his players do off the field. He is a coach, not a babysitter. These are all grown men who have had things (for the most part) handed to them in life and are going to do what they want when they want!

whackthepack
08-24-2004, 08:57 PM
Looks like Tice might have had enough of Onterrio, and the way Smith responded in this interview I don't think it will be a year before he fails his next drug test and is out for an entire year. :angryfire:

What a shame the guy can't walk the straight and narrow, an 8 to 10 year career with his talent could have put him up with the top backs currently playing in the NFL and millions & millions of dollars in the bank.

After he retired he could have sat around with Ricky Williams and got stoned all day who would care, he wouldn't have had to worry about money :tongue: .


Posted on Tue, Aug. 24, 2004





Smith's absence is one of substance

BOB SANSEVERE

Pioneer Press Columnist


Onterrio Smith didn't run the ball a whole lot during Vikings practice Monday at Winter Park. Mostly he stood around, watching others do what he would be doing if he hadn't gotten into trouble again.

"He won't be there against Dallas,' Vikings coach Mike Tice said, referring to the opener Sept. 12. "Why get him ready?'

Smith violated the NFL's substance-abuse policy and, barring a successful appeal, will miss the first four games of the season.

"Things just happen,' Smith said. "It's the world we live in. I've got to be a man and overcome it.'

Doug Hendrickson, one of Smith's agents, said Monday the paperwork for an appeal was being completed and likely will be submitted to the league today.

"It's something I believe strongly I need to do — question how everything went down,' Smith said.

He will question and he will hope the suspension is overturned, though that's uncommon.

"He's got unbelievable talent,' Hendrickson said. "The future for him will be very bright.'

The future would dim considerably if Smith fails another drug test. A positive test, reportedly for marijuana, caused this four-game suspension. If Smith's appeal is not upheld and he fails a drug test again, he will be suspended for an entire season.

"I don't imagine something like that happening again,' Hendrickson said.

That is the hope. That has always been the hope with Smith.

Sadly, this is nothing new. In 1999, he was tossed out of the University of Tennessee for smoking marijuana. Then, after enrolling at Oregon, he was arrested for drunken driving. He came into the NFL with red flags attached. He had the talent of a first-rounder but skidded to the fourth round because of his past.

The Vikings took a shot. They could plainly see Smith had skills as a running back. What they didn't know was whether he could juke and swivel on the field while staying on the straight and narrow off it.

Now they have a better idea.

Smith kept it together last season, leading NFC rookies with 579 yards while averaging a gaudy 5.4 yards a carry. In the offseason, he faltered. Already under scrutiny because of his college setbacks, he failed two drug tests, the latest one before the start of training camp, people familiar with the situation said. At the time, he was in a league counseling program.

You have to wonder: With so much to lose, is Smith a numbskull or does he have a serious problem?

"He's a product of his environment,' said Dean Dalton, the Vikings' running backs coach. "When he is here, he works hard and does things right.'

Apparently, problems arise when Smith is on his own. He has been described as having football sense but lacking common sense, and that seems a fair appraisal.

Mindful of his troubled past, the Vikings persuaded Smith to reside in Minnesota in the offseason. That way, they could keep an eye on him. Be there for him. The thing is, they can't watch over him 24/7. They can't be there when temptation hits, possibly harder than any linebacker.

If he doesn't win his appeal, Smith will be an outcast for four weeks. He cannot attend practices or take part in meetings at the Vikings' Winter Park facility. It would be a good time for reflection on his part, a time to decide what is important and what isn't.

"A situation like this, you've got to stay concerned,' Smith said. "It's just another obstacle I have to overcome. I wouldn't say it's a little bump in the road. More of a big bump.'

The Vikings were planning to use Smith often. Even though Michael Bennett will start, Smith was considered too talented to stand around and watch.

He is too talented to stand around and watch, but that's what he's doing. And it's his own doing.

"I've got to look forward from this day on, be a man about the whole situation,' Smith said. "Just stride it out.'

LosAngelis
08-26-2004, 11:55 AM
There's no reason any coach should have to hold a players hand all day. However, he sets the tone that the team must follow, and Tice's tone is the buddy-buddy/I'll yell at you routine that just doesn't stick. Tice, to me, tries to be one of the guys instead of the guy the players respect and/or fear. Lombardi, Burns, Landry all perfected this.

casper
08-26-2004, 12:50 PM
and lets not forget Bud Grant, lets just hope smith turns the corner and relaizes the team who gave him the chance to go all the way is on his side but only if he is straight... rules are the rules no matter who you are or what you have follow them thing will flow break them and thing will go... good artical whack thanks
Good luck to him

little redhead
08-26-2004, 01:38 PM
Tice can only do so much to keep these players in line. You have to keep in mind that the choice isn't entirely his all the time. You have other interference such as the owners opinion etc I mean come on didn't you see that episode of play makers where the coach wanted to get rid of the junkie but the owner refused ... just kidding on that point so don't pick on me but anyways Tice isn't the only coach that has these problems. I don't think there is one team in the league that hasn't had some type of big trouble this year or previously whether it be involved in a drug trafficking ring and that dude is still playing for the Ravens etc the list goes on and on guys that have beaten there wives/ murder trials it is up to the individual themselves to keep their own ass out of trouble and Tice can only be at fault or held slightly accountable for these players actions they are all over 21 and are free to make their own decisions if they want to throw their carrer and life and monetary future down the toilet no one is going to stop them. You will only get so many strikes I am guessing in Tices books before you would totally be out there. I am sure they pay some sort of consequence or get some type of disciplinary action from Tice and I would say a lot of the players wouldn't want to have Tice down on them but the players that are doing these things are the players that have had problems like that there whole life and one coach isn't going to make the difference. You say pick wiser when you select players well Randy Moss was one of those people and we took a chance on him and although he has done a few stupid things he has learned as well and some of that can be attributed to outside influences(coaches, chris carter etc) but it was Randy who decided to grow up but not all players are going to choose to grow up no matter what the consequence is so no I don't think Tice is entirely responsible. Tice is not their parent he is their coach and he can only discipline so much perhaps we should put more blame on the parents then but then again you would say this person is old enough and you can't hold the parents responsible so why should Tice take the blame? Ok I am done ranting now.

LosAngelis
08-26-2004, 05:22 PM
"LosAngelis" wrote:

There's no reason any coach should have to hold a players hand all day. However, he sets the tone that the team must follow, and Tice's tone is the buddy-buddy/I'll yell at you routine that just doesn't stick. Tice, to me, tries to be one of the guys instead of the guy the players respect and/or fear. Lombardi, Burns, Landry all perfected this.

Ack...I meant to say Bud Grant, not Burns. Casper gets SKOL bucks for catching that...

VKG4LFE
08-26-2004, 05:44 PM
No more skol bucks los!! :(

bigdogbovy
08-26-2004, 06:18 PM
I never got to spend my skol bucks

VKG4LFE
08-26-2004, 08:20 PM
I know, either did I, damn it!