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singersp
02-18-2006, 07:51 PM
Zygi puts faith in the untested

The puzzle is this: Why has the new owner given a pair of football management neophytes the keys to the Vikings' store?

Patrick Reusse, Star Tribune
Last update: February 18, 2006 – 12:43 AM

Dennis Green required six playoff appearances and a 15-1 season that led to hosting the NFC title game to be granted the loudest say in Vikings football operations.

The ownership has given that authority instantly to new coach Brad Childress.

Childress, in turn, had received his initial recommendation to the Vikings from Tom Heckert, a football executive whom the new owners led by Zygi Wilf were not able to hire.

Childress' main task as offensive coordinator in Philadelphia was to make sure the plastic was attached properly to head coach Andy Reid's play sheet, so that the ink would not smudge in the rain.

The fact the Vikings were willing to give so much influence to a nobody assistant probably was the reason that they ran through Heckert and another handful of candidates before settling for Fran Foley as vice president for player personnel.

Foley was a 44-year-old lackey in San Diego. He was behind coach Marty Schottenheimer, General Manager A.J. Smith, Vice President Ed McGuire and assistant GM Buddy Nix in the Chargers' personnel pecking order, which left him to do what ... make sure the staplers were filled?

Foley will be holding up the bottom two-thirds of the power triangle with Rob Brzezinski, the Vikings' capologist since the 1999 season. He is the one member of ZIT (Zygi's Isosceles Triangle) with a track record for doing his job.

Brzezinski treated previous owner Red McCombs' money with tender loving care -- so much so that he was able to convince quarterback Daunte Culpepper to sign the least cash-filled alleged big-money contract in NFL history.

Last summer's ownership change did not cause a shift in Brzezinski's modus operandi. Culpepper's one-day walkout in training camp was said to have produced $8 million more in guaranteed money, but Brzezinski outsmarted Daunte and his now-fired agent on that one, too.

He kept about half of that cash, to be paid as part of a $6 million roster bonus due in mid-March. The Vikings now are attempting to unload Culpepper, before Mr. Wilf would be required to issue that check.

The autumn of 2005 was disastrous for Culpepper: poor play in his team's first five games, a serious injury to his right knee in game No. 7, and his high profile with Sex Cruise.

Wilf digested this and repeatedly assured the public that the Vikings would pay the $6 million and retain Culpepper. Either Zygi is a liar, or the change in attitude toward Daunte arrived on Jan. 13.

That's the day Culpepper came to Winter Park, met with Brzezinski, asked for more guaranteed cash in that fool's gold contract of his, was told "no way," and then headed back to Orlando, Fla., in full pout without meeting with his new coach.

There's already evidence Childress is too self-important to handle such a snub, so the Vikings are now prepared to give away Culpepper, a 29-year-old quarterback with 20,162 yards and 135 touchdowns on his résumé.

Allowing a coach who has been on the job for six weeks to steer the franchise toward such an epic decision would be the ultimate in naiveté for this ownership.

And why should we expect anything other than naiveté from Zygi and family, since they fell hopelessly in awe of the first assistant coach they interviewed, and now they have Scott Studwell begging Foley to keep his job.

Studwell has run the Vikings' draft for three years. He's done above-average work and has been the recipient of big accolades from two great football men: Jerry Reichow and Paul Wiggin.

Whether this will be enough for Studwell to be deemed qualified to run college scouting by a fifth-stringer from San Diego remains uncertain.

For Zygi, this week's big event was his stadium presentation before a drooling collection of Blaine city council members on Thursday.

Does it bother anyone else that what the county and the state would be doing in this deal would be covering the $354 million profit that Zygi gave McCombs when be bought the team?

If the Twins get a new ballpark, the deal with Hennepin County calls for the public to reclaim much of the increase in sale price if it occurs in the first few years. In the Vikings' case, McCombs already has absconded to Texas with a new-stadium increase in sale price.

Fifteen cents on a $20 bill up there in Anoka County ... and all that change is already in Red's pocket. Go ahead, folks: Keep on droolin'.

Patrick Reusse can be heard weekdays on AM-1500 KSTP at 6:45 and 7:45 a.m. and 4:40 p.m. • preusse@startribune.com

Zygi (http://www.startribune.com/508/story/255682.html)

COJOMAY
02-18-2006, 08:03 PM
I HAVE ALWAYS HATED PAT REUSSE!
This is another case where the tail is wagging the dog. They feel Wilf may be getting too close to convincing the public that a new stadium is needed and so what better thing to do than to make Zygi look like some kind of crook!
And speaking of Studwell, what great things has he done in the draft? Missed two times when he missed his slot? Yup, that's a real great job. I like Studwell, but don't for one minute think he acted alone in any of the decisions of who to draft. In fact, just the opposite. I remember reading several times where he wanted to draft someone else and Green overturned him. Daunte Culpepper is just one case in point.

PurplePumpkin
02-18-2006, 08:29 PM
I dont get the Star Tribune just becuz all they do is trash the Vikings. Someone once said here at PPO said they lease the land that the the MetroDoom is on. I dont know if this is true but I wouldnt be surprised! I wish another paper would research this. It would be nice to know the truth!

VikesfaninWis
02-18-2006, 08:35 PM
I hate writers. Especially ones that are from the same area and criticize every move from the home town team.. He should check his own articles for once.. Note to Pat Reusse, Your Articles Suck!!!!

FedjeViking
02-18-2006, 08:51 PM
The media is trying to get information that is not forthcoming. Make it up, maybe we'll get a slip-up from anger of yet another rumor!
I just wish the media would just shut the h#&& up unless they have facts to report!

VikesfaninWis
02-18-2006, 09:36 PM
"FedjeViking" wrote:

The media is trying to get information that is not forthcoming. Make it up, maybe we'll get a slip-up from anger of yet another rumor!
I just wish the media would just shut the h#&& up unless they have facts to report!


Thats the problem though. The media will hardly ever have facts because the players and coaches have been refusing to talk with them..

They have to spread gossip somehow.. Why not at the expense of the team? Jerks, they need to get a hobby..

Toro
02-18-2006, 09:56 PM
I'm sorry, I have to disagree. I think the article is bang on.

You have an owner with no experience being an owner hiring someone with no experience as a head coach, who then hired an offensive and defensive coordinator with no experience as co-ordinators and who have the combined age of Bud Grant, who wants to implement an offense that never actually won anything in Philadelphia all the while willing to give away a Pro Bowl QB for a bargain basement price because he doesn't supposedly fit the offense, and said new owner hired a personnel director on a team that first round draft picks were refusing to go to a mere two years ago!

FFS!

This has the makings of Les Steckel written all over it.

Man, I hope I'm wrong, but I have not been impressed so far.

This is a talented team that needed some adjustments, not to be torn down and built up again.

NordicNed
02-18-2006, 11:04 PM
"Toro" wrote:

I'm sorry, I have to disagree. I think the article is bang on.

You have an owner with no experience being an owner hiring someone with no experience as a head coach, who then hired an offensive and defensive coordinator with no experience as co-ordinators and who have the combined age of Bud Grant, who wants to implement an offense that never actually won anything in Philadelphia all the while willing to give away a Pro Bowl QB for a bargain basement price because he doesn't supposedly fit the offense, and said new owner hired a personnel director on a team that first round draft picks were refusing to go to a mere two years ago!

FFS!

This has the makings of Les Steckel written all over it.

Man, I hope I'm wrong, but I have not been impressed so far.

This is a talented team that needed some adjustments, not to be torn down and built up again.

Sorry Toro,


But I'll have to disagree with your take on our changes going on.

I think this is exactly what this team needs, our coaching was very sad and lost most of the time. I think it's going to bring a breath of freshness to the team and I think that alone is a positive for our players.

But like you said, only time can tell, but I feel this time we got something good going on....JMHO

NordicNed
02-18-2006, 11:07 PM
As for Patrick Reusse,


One of you guys or gals ( Country or WBL) living in MN., needs to go down to that news papers parking lot and catch ole Pat going to his car...

He needs to hear a few choice words, then get either a boot up his ass or a good ole bitch slap down. Hey, why not just give him both while at it.

The guy is a bum and should be living in Wisconson....

SharperVikings
02-18-2006, 11:18 PM
Yep, trash his car!

singersp
02-18-2006, 11:26 PM
"VikingNed" wrote:

As for Patrick Reusse,


One of you guys or gals ( Country or WBL) living in MN., needs to go down to that news papers parking lot and catch ole Pat going to his car...

He needs to hear a few choice words, then get either a boot up his jiggly butt or a good ole beeyatch slap down. Hey, why not just give him both while at it.

The guy is a bum and should be living in Wisconson....

In his own sarcastic way, he does make some valid points.

collegeguyjeff
02-18-2006, 11:32 PM
terrible article reusse is a fool

NodakPaul
02-18-2006, 11:42 PM
"Toro" wrote:

I'm sorry, I have to disagree. I think the article is bang on.

You have an owner with no experience being an owner hiring someone with no experience as a head coach, who then hired an offensive and defensive coordinator with no experience as co-ordinators and who have the combined age of Bud Grant, who wants to implement an offense that never actually won anything in Philadelphia all the while willing to give away a Pro Bowl QB for a bargain basement price because he doesn't supposedly fit the offense, and said new owner hired a personnel director on a team that first round draft picks were refusing to go to a mere two years ago!

FFS!

This has the makings of Les Steckel written all over it.

Man, I hope I'm wrong, but I have not been impressed so far.

This is a talented team that needed some adjustments, not to be torn down and built up again.

I don't know what it takes to impress you Toro, but for me, having an owner who actually gives a crap about the team instead of the dollar behind it impresses me. Having a head coach who, as an offensive coordinator, helped bring his team to the superbowl only a year ago impresses me. Implementing the offense and defense that have enjoyed more success in the past decade than ony other ocmbination impresses me. The way the Chargers stuck it to Eli in 2004 impressed me (no player is better than the draft, especially him).

Red's refusal to put any money into the team did not impress me.
Tice's inability to ascend from the lovable Player's coach to a coach that actually wins did not impress me.
Cotrell's refusal to adapt any part of his defense to meet the onciming team (like refsuing to give Smoot any help over the top against Carolina) did not impress me.

This is a talented team. Just because the team may or may not be considering trading a player who may or may not be able to return to his Pro bowl self doesn't mean we are tearing the entire down.

I look forward to being even more impressed this coming season.

Toro
02-19-2006, 12:21 AM
Look, don't get me wrong, I'd rather have Zigi as owner than Red. I do think it was time for a change as head coach.

But there are a lot of potential problems.

Zigi has no experience running an NFL team.

The head coach has no experience as a head coach.

The head coach with no experience as a head coach hired an offensive co-ordinator who has no experience as an offensive co-ordinator, and is 36 years old.

The head coach with no experience as a head coach hired a defensive co-ordinator who has no experience as a defensive co-ordinator, and is 33 years old.

The director of player personnel from San Diego, or whatever his title, has no experience in his new position.

And they fired the frickin' trainer!

THAT's the problem!

There's no experience in their positions!

Its not one thing or another - it's all of them combined. That's what makes me worried! If they hired a guy with gray hair as one of the co-ordinators, or someone with extensive personnel experience in the NFL, I wouldn't be so vocal. But it frickin' worries me!

Now, who knows what is happening behind closed doors, but this Culpepper thing has been handled so badly - and I think it reflects on the lack of experience within the organization. Culpepper is just as much to blame for this. However, look at it from his POV. He probably realized after his injury that, like the rest of us, he's mortal. So now he's realized he's locked into a bad deal and wants to re-negotiate. As I've posted elsewhere here, well, too bad Daunte. Not after you just blew out your knee my man. But management is supposed to be smarter. They're supposed to rise above this. They're the ones who, with age, wisdom and experience, are supposed to be able to guide the team through difficult situations like this one. Well, maybe this is the best response, I don't know. But it sure in heck doesn't look like it.

And this West Coast offense stuff - why? Last time I checked, Minnesota has had a much more proficient offense over the past 5, 10 years than the Eagles. The Eagles got to where they were because they continuously sent more guys to the Pro Bowl on defense than on offense. So why is he coming in and making all this noise about changing offenses?

Remember, the Detroit Lions fired Wayne Fontes after a disappointing 9-7 season (or maybe it was 7-9, I can't remember) and handed the team off to an inexperienced GM who hired an inexperienced head coach who also wanted to run a West Coast offense. Now I'm not saying the same fate awaits the Vikings, but its not impossible either. And the best way to avoid such a fate is to have experienced coaches and management.

**** I hope I'm over-reacting.

Ltrey33
02-19-2006, 12:27 AM
I just don't understand his argument. What's wrong with putting faith in new people with new plans? So what if they've never had that much responsibility or power before? It's not like hiring guys like Marty Shottenheimer, Dennis Green, Dick Vermiel etc. who have had that experience and power before is working all that well either. Finding the right staff for your team is a crapshoot. Sometimes you'll win, but more times than not, it's not the right guy. Were people thrilled about Belichick (who failed with the Browns) in New England when they first hired him? No. I say give a new guy with a lack of experience a shot, he's at least better than a guy who has proven he CAN'T get it done.

Toro
02-19-2006, 12:38 AM
I think hiring a new, inexperienced guy is fine. But why hire new, inexperienced guys everywhere? How about Jim Hazlett as the DC (or someone like him)? Linehan, who is a new guy, hired at least one co-ordinator (whose name escapes me) in St. Louis.

I could understand wanting to come in and rip everything up and start anew if we were 2-14. But we aren't. We're a good football team. The coaching staff and management should be pushing things forward. I'm not convinced they are.

This is a team that isn't that far away. I just think adding a whole bunch of inexperience at this point in time, handling your Pro Bowl QB badly and changing what has historically been a very good offense when the Vikings are a potential NFC Championship game calibre team is not strong tactical or strategic thinking.

NordicNed
02-19-2006, 12:39 AM
"Toro" wrote:

Look, don't get me wrong, I'd rather have Zigi as owner than Red. I do think it was time for a change as head coach.

But there are a lot of potential problems.

Zigi has no experience running an NFL team.

The head coach has no experience as a head coach.

The head coach with no experience as a head coach hired an offensive co-ordinator who has no experience as an offensive co-ordinator, and is 36 years old.

The head coach with no experience as a head coach hired a defensive co-ordinator who has no experience as a defensive co-ordinator, and is 33 years old.

The director of player personnel from San Diego, or whatever his title, has no experience in his new position.

And they fired the frickin' trainer!

THAT's the problem!

There's no experience in their positions!

Its not one thing or another - it's all of them combined. That's what makes me worried! If they hired a guy with gray hair as one of the co-ordinators, or someone with extensive personnel experience in the NFL, I wouldn't be so vocal. But it frickin' worries me!

Now, who knows what is happening behind closed doors, but this Culpepper thing has been handled so badly - and I think it reflects on the lack of experience within the organization. Culpepper is just as much to blame for this. However, look at it from his POV. He probably realized after his injury that, like the rest of us, he's mortal. So now he's realized he's locked into a bad deal and wants to re-negotiate. As I've posted elsewhere here, well, too bad Daunte. Not after you just blew out your knee my man. But management is supposed to be smarter. They're supposed to rise above this. They're the ones who, with age, wisdom and experience, are supposed to be able to guide the team through difficult situations like this one. Well, maybe this is the best response, I don't know. But it sure in heck doesn't look like it.

And this West Coast offense stuff - why? Last time I checked, Minnesota has had a much more proficient offense over the past 5, 10 years than the Eagles. The Eagles got to where they were because they continuously sent more guys to the Pro Bowl on defense than on offense. So why is he coming in and making all this noise about changing offenses?

Remember, the Detroit Lions fired Wayne Fontes after a disappointing 9-7 season (or maybe it was 7-9, I can't remember) and handed the team off to an inexperienced GM who hired an inexperienced head coach who also wanted to run a West Coast offense. Now I'm not saying the same fate awaits the Vikings, but its not impossible either. And the best way to avoid such a fate is to have experienced coaches and management.

**** I hope I'm over-reacting.

Let me put it this way, in real life terms...

I've seen alot, and sometimes the people at lower positions are held down by their superiors because, their superiors know the lesser guy or gal can do a better job..

I worked my way up the ladder from being a laborer, to a carpenter, to a lead carpenter, to a foreman, to superitendent, and now I own my own buisness...

during my travels, many a bosses above me, tried to hold me down. Most because they knew I was better and smarter than them.....Sure I've worked under some great people in my life, and those are the ones that help to teach me and gave me opportunitys to grow...To them I'm thankful and owe everything.

So just like our new coaches, I say hey, give them a shot. I bet some have been held back for years......And I have a gut feeling Childress is one of them...

I think this young group of coaches is going to shine and grow together, and make the Vikings a better team because of it...

Toro
02-19-2006, 12:41 AM
And another thing, why is Studwell so insecure in his job? The Vikings have drafted pretty well the past 3 years. Why hasn't he been told to go keep doing what he's doing?

This, to me, is another example of coming in and tearing things apart when there is no need to.

Toro
02-19-2006, 12:41 AM
Damn Ned, I hope you're right.

BigMoInAZ
02-19-2006, 06:12 AM
"singersp" wrote:

"VikingNed" wrote:

As for Patrick Reusse,


One of you guys or gals ( Country or WBL) living in MN., needs to go down to that news papers parking lot and catch ole Pat going to his car...

He needs to hear a few choice words, then get either a boot up his jiggly butt or a good ole beeyatch slap down. Hey, why not just give him both while at it.

The guy is a bum and should be living in Wisconson....

In his own sarcastic way, he does make some valid points.
LOL! I can empathize with Toro's position and sadly agree with you on this take Singer. That doesn't change my OPINION of the Minnesota Media one bit. Judd Zulgad's recent article: "Broadcast Sports: Vikings want privacy and lots of public money" (http://www.startribune.com/510/story/252732.html) was another one that hit home and sadly had some valid points as well. Still I found myself cheering for the bad guy in his article, Wilf and his team!

At any rate, I still can understand Toro's concerns! This team should not be looking at itself as "Rebuilding" and neither should the coaches or owner. If so, than god-bless us all cause the next two years are gonna suck wazoo!http://www.vikingsmessageboard.com/images/smiles/captain.gif

seaniemck7
02-21-2006, 03:19 AM
Toro, you have some valid concerns. However you need to keep in mind how assistant coaches are acquired. Assistant coaches under contract cannot move laterally unless their team allows them to do so. Meaning an Offensive Coordinator under contract can't take another OC job on another team. For example if we wanted to hire, say Indy's OC, there is no way they would let him out of his contract. You sited Scott Linehan as someone to hire, but when he left for Miami, his contract in Minny was up. That is not the case this year.

Typically in the NFL, assistants and coordinators are allowed to accept jobs if they are hired for a "higher" position a la our new DC who was previously a Defensive Backs coach. Now, right or wrong, Zygi put a big emphasis on getting people in the door ASAP in order to solidify our coaching staff. I believe his logic revolved around giving the new staff the greatest amount of time to work together before the new year. I think this logic is sound considering the amount of change in the organization.

You also mention hiring someone like Jim Haslett or someone with experience at these Coordinator positions. The problem Zygi, and later on, Childress were facing was not only time, but availability of coaches with these experiences. In order to hire someone like this, the candidate would have either needed to be fired or released from his contract. Not every coodinator or head coach was fired immediately by their respective teams. So instead of waiting, Zygi found what they deamed the brightest and most qualified personnel available to him at the time.

Speaking specifically about Haslett, he was fired by N.O. at the beginning of January. But after a grueling year, he wasn't sure if he wanted to jump right back in to coaching. In fact it wasn't until after a day in the life of a broadcaster, that he decided that he wanted back in coaching for next year. So Haslett did not necessarily fit into Zygi's time frame for getting the staff put together. Mike Tomlin was hired two weeks before Haslett had the opportunity to take the Rams position. Keep in mind, if Haslett has immediate success as the Rams DC, you can bet his name will soon be on the short list for HC jobs within a year or two.

I for one am actually excited about this young staff. Its a group upon which the organization can build. I think they are going to be one of the hardest working and close knit groups among the NFL next year. I cannot wait to see what they have to offer us as fans.

COJOMAY
02-21-2006, 03:25 AM
Great post seaniemck7

NordicNed
02-21-2006, 03:32 AM
"seaniemck7" wrote:

Toro, you have some valid concerns. However you need to keep in mind how assistant coaches are acquired. Assistant coaches under contract cannot move laterally unless their team allows them to do so. Meaning an Offensive Coordinator under contract can't take another OC job on another team. For example if we wanted to hire, say Indy's OC, there is no way they would let him out of his contract. You sited Scott Linehan as someone to hire, but when he left for Miami, his contract in Minny was up. That is not the case this year.

Typically in the NFL, assistants and coordinators are allowed to accept jobs if they are hired for a "higher" position a la our new DC who was previously a Defensive Backs coach. Now, right or wrong, Zygi put a big emphasis on getting people in the door ASAP in order to solidify our coaching staff. I believe his logic revolved around giving the new staff the greatest amount of time to work together before the new year. I think this logic is sound considering the amount of change in the organization.

You also mention hiring someone like Jim Haslett or someone with experience at these Coordinator positions. The problem Zygi, and later on, Childress were facing was not only time, but availability of coaches with these experiences. In order to hire someone like this, the candidate would have either needed to be fired or released from his contract. Not every coodinator or head coach was fired immediately by their respective teams. So instead of waiting, Zygi found what they deamed the brightest and most qualified personnel available to him at the time.

Speaking specifically about Haslett, he was fired by N.O. at the beginning of January. But after a grueling year, he wasn't sure if he wanted to jump right back in to coaching. In fact it wasn't until after a day in the life of a broadcaster, that he decided that he wanted back in coaching for next year. So Haslett did not necessarily fit into Zygi's time frame for getting the staff put together. Mike Tomlin was hired two weeks before Haslett had the opportunity to take the Rams position. Keep in mind, if Haslett has immediate success as the Rams DC, you can bet his name will soon be on the short list for HC jobs within a year or two.

I for one am actually excited about this young staff. Its a group upon which the organization can build. I think they are going to be one of the hardest working and close knit groups among the NFL next year. I cannot wait to see what they have to offer us as fans.

Nice post is right........Thanks for the How it Works update.....

Toro
02-21-2006, 03:33 AM
"seaniemck7" wrote:

Toro, you have some valid concerns. However you need to keep in mind how assistant coaches are acquired. Assistant coaches under contract cannot move laterally unless their team allows them to do so. Meaning an Offensive Coordinator under contract can't take another OC job on another team. For example if we wanted to hire, say Indy's OC, there is no way they would let him out of his contract. You sited Scott Linehan as someone to hire, but when he left for Miami, his contract in Minny was up. That is not the case this year.

Typically in the NFL, assistants and coordinators are allowed to accept jobs if they are hired for a "higher" position a la our new DC who was previously a Defensive Backs coach. Now, right or wrong, Zygi put a big emphasis on getting people in the door ASAP in order to solidify our coaching staff. I believe his logic revolved around giving the new staff the greatest amount of time to work together before the new year. I think this logic is sound considering the amount of change in the organization.

You also mention hiring someone like Jim Haslett or someone with experience at these Coordinator positions. The problem Zygi, and later on, Childress were facing was not only time, but availability of coaches with these experiences. In order to hire someone like this, the candidate would have either needed to be fired or released from his contract. Not every coodinator or head coach was fired immediately by their respective teams. So instead of waiting, Zygi found what they deamed the brightest and most qualified personnel available to him at the time.

Speaking specifically about Haslett, he was fired by N.O. at the beginning of January. But after a grueling year, he wasn't sure if he wanted to jump right back in to coaching. In fact it wasn't until after a day in the life of a broadcaster, that he decided that he wanted back in coaching for next year. So Haslett did not necessarily fit into Zygi's time frame for getting the staff put together. Mike Tomlin was hired two weeks before Haslett had the opportunity to take the Rams position. Keep in mind, if Haslett has immediate success as the Rams DC, you can bet his name will soon be on the short list for HC jobs within a year or two.

I for one am actually excited about this young staff. Its a group upon which the organization can build. I think they are going to be one of the hardest working and close knit groups among the NFL next year. I cannot wait to see what they have to offer us as fans.

Good post seaniemck

cajunvike
02-21-2006, 09:45 AM
"VikingNed" wrote:

"Toro" wrote:

Look, don't get me wrong, I'd rather have Zigi as owner than Red. I do think it was time for a change as head coach.

But there are a lot of potential problems.

Zigi has no experience running an NFL team.

The head coach has no experience as a head coach.

The head coach with no experience as a head coach hired an offensive co-ordinator who has no experience as an offensive co-ordinator, and is 36 years old.

The head coach with no experience as a head coach hired a defensive co-ordinator who has no experience as a defensive co-ordinator, and is 33 years old.

The director of player personnel from San Diego, or whatever his title, has no experience in his new position.

And they fired the frickin' trainer!

THAT's the problem!

There's no experience in their positions!

Its not one thing or another - it's all of them combined. That's what makes me worried! If they hired a guy with gray hair as one of the co-ordinators, or someone with extensive personnel experience in the NFL, I wouldn't be so vocal. But it frickin' worries me!

Now, who knows what is happening behind closed doors, but this Culpepper thing has been handled so badly - and I think it reflects on the lack of experience within the organization. Culpepper is just as much to blame for this. However, look at it from his POV. He probably realized after his injury that, like the rest of us, he's mortal. So now he's realized he's locked into a bad deal and wants to re-negotiate. As I've posted elsewhere here, well, too bad Daunte. Not after you just blew out your knee my man. But management is supposed to be smarter. They're supposed to rise above this. They're the ones who, with age, wisdom and experience, are supposed to be able to guide the team through difficult situations like this one. Well, maybe this is the best response, I don't know. But it sure in heck doesn't look like it.

And this West Coast offense stuff - why? Last time I checked, Minnesota has had a much more proficient offense over the past 5, 10 years than the Eagles. The Eagles got to where they were because they continuously sent more guys to the Pro Bowl on defense than on offense. So why is he coming in and making all this noise about changing offenses?

Remember, the Detroit Lions fired Wayne Fontes after a disappointing 9-7 season (or maybe it was 7-9, I can't remember) and handed the team off to an inexperienced GM who hired an inexperienced head coach who also wanted to run a West Coast offense. Now I'm not saying the same fate awaits the Vikings, but its not impossible either. And the best way to avoid such a fate is to have experienced coaches and management.

**** I hope I'm over-reacting.

Let me put it this way, in real life terms...

I've seen alot, and sometimes the people at lower positions are held down by their superiors because, their superiors know the lesser guy or gal can do a better job..

I worked my way up the ladder from being a laborer, to a carpenter, to a lead carpenter, to a foreman, to superitendent, and now I own my own buisness...

during my travels, many a bosses above me, tried to hold me down. Most because they knew I was better and smarter than them.....Sure I've worked under some great people in my life, and those are the ones that help to teach me and gave me opportunitys to grow...To them I'm thankful and owe everything.

So just like our new coaches, I say hey, give them a shot. I bet some have been held back for years......And I have a gut feeling Childress is one of them...

I think this young group of coaches is going to shine and grow together, and make the Vikings a better team because of it...

Way to keep it REAL, Ned!!! Props to those who pay their dues and finally get their chance to shine! And OUR guys will shine next year fo' sho'!!! :grin:

whackthepack
02-21-2006, 05:15 PM
"singersp" wrote:

Zygi puts faith in the untested

The puzzle is this: Why has the new owner given a pair of football management neophytes the keys to the Vikings' store?

Patrick Reusse, Star Tribune
Last update: February 18, 2006 – 12:43 AM

Dennis Green required six playoff appearances and a 15-1 season that led to hosting the NFC title game to be granted the loudest say in Vikings football operations.

The ownership has given that authority instantly to new coach Brad Childress.

Childress, in turn, had received his initial recommendation to the Vikings from Tom Heckert, a football executive whom the new owners led by Zygi Wilf were not able to hire.

Childress' main task as offensive coordinator in Philadelphia was to make sure the plastic was attached properly to head coach Andy Reid's play sheet, so that the ink would not smudge in the rain.

The fact the Vikings were willing to give so much influence to a nobody assistant probably was the reason that they ran through Heckert and another handful of candidates before settling for Fran Foley as vice president for player personnel.

Foley was a 44-year-old lackey in San Diego. He was behind coach Marty Schottenheimer, General Manager A.J. Smith, Vice President Ed McGuire and assistant GM Buddy Nix in the Chargers' personnel pecking order, which left him to do what ... make sure the staplers were filled?

Foley will be holding up the bottom two-thirds of the power triangle with Rob Brzezinski, the Vikings' capologist since the 1999 season. He is the one member of ZIT (Zygi's Isosceles Triangle) with a track record for doing his job.

Brzezinski treated previous owner Red McCombs' money with tender loving care -- so much so that he was able to convince quarterback Daunte Culpepper to sign the least cash-filled alleged big-money contract in NFL history.

Last summer's ownership change did not cause a shift in Brzezinski's modus operandi. Culpepper's one-day walkout in training camp was said to have produced $8 million more in guaranteed money, but Brzezinski outsmarted Daunte and his now-fired agent on that one, too.

He kept about half of that cash, to be paid as part of a $6 million roster bonus due in mid-March. The Vikings now are attempting to unload Culpepper, before Mr. Wilf would be required to issue that check.

The autumn of 2005 was disastrous for Culpepper: poor play in his team's first five games, a serious injury to his right knee in game No. 7, and his high profile with Sex Cruise.

Wilf digested this and repeatedly assured the public that the Vikings would pay the $6 million and retain Culpepper. Either Zygi is a liar, or the change in attitude toward Daunte arrived on Jan. 13.

That's the day Culpepper came to Winter Park, met with Brzezinski, asked for more guaranteed cash in that fool's gold contract of his, was told "no way," and then headed back to Orlando, Fla., in full pout without meeting with his new coach.

There's already evidence Childress is too self-important to handle such a snub, so the Vikings are now prepared to give away Culpepper, a 29-year-old quarterback with 20,162 yards and 135 touchdowns on his résumé.

Allowing a coach who has been on the job for six weeks to steer the franchise toward such an epic decision would be the ultimate in naiveté for this ownership.

And why should we expect anything other than naiveté from Zygi and family, since they fell hopelessly in awe of the first assistant coach they interviewed, and now they have Scott Studwell begging Foley to keep his job.

Studwell has run the Vikings' draft for three years. He's done above-average work and has been the recipient of big accolades from two great football men: Jerry Reichow and Paul Wiggin.

Whether this will be enough for Studwell to be deemed qualified to run college scouting by a fifth-stringer from San Diego remains uncertain.

For Zygi, this week's big event was his stadium presentation before a drooling collection of Blaine city council members on Thursday.

Does it bother anyone else that what the county and the state would be doing in this deal would be covering the $354 million profit that Zygi gave McCombs when be bought the team?

If the Twins get a new ballpark, the deal with Hennepin County calls for the public to reclaim much of the increase in sale price if it occurs in the first few years. In the Vikings' case, McCombs already has absconded to Texas with a new-stadium increase in sale price.

Fifteen cents on a $20 bill up there in Anoka County ... and all that change is already in Red's pocket. Go ahead, folks: Keep on droolin'.

Patrick Reusse can be heard weekdays on AM-1500 KSTP at 6:45 and 7:45 a.m. and 4:40 p.m. • preusse@startribune.com

Zygi (http://www.startribune.com/508/story/255682.html)





This is in retaliation for the Vikings not giving the media access to the Vikings like Tice did and for not telling the media everything the Vikings think and do with regard to their players.

This article came out a day after Foley basically told the media that they would not discuss what the Vikings were going to do with their players (Daunte) or how they were evaluating the players on the roster.

Reese is an old crumedgon and I have hated the guy for years, his cute little articles on bowling and girls high school hockey make me want to puke. He thinks he is actually above having to following the major sports and report on them! And I will bet my soul this is completely done out of retaliation for the Vikes daring to not let the media know what their plans are for this off-season!

Benet
02-21-2006, 07:40 PM
Unfortunately, articles such as this can only fan the flames of insecurity in the Vikes fans who don't come on this board to be reassured by you fine people! However, even a tiny amount of analysis can show this article is entirely one-sided. Childress is called the "nobody assistant"; so what was Andy Reid before the Eagles hired him? If we all cast our minds back then, we'll find that Reid was the Packers Quarterbacks Coach.. A position even lower than Offensive Co-ordinator! Now I'm sure all of you can agree with me that a Quarterbacks coach (while EXTREMELY important, as we saw with Scott Linehan's impact on Culpepper's development) has less of an input on an offensive gameplan than an OC who doesn't call the plays.

Yes, there are both advantages and disadvantages to hiring your staff as quickly as possible. The point about Jim Haslett as a Defensive Co-ordinator has already been raised, you could also make the same case for or against Mike Martz. Martz would certainly do his best to bring back the kind of offense we Vikings fans grew to love during the best years of Dennis Green's tenure, and his background at St Louis would make him the most likely person to do it. However we'd have only just signed Martz if we went for him, and with Free Agency (still) scheduled to begin on March 3rd, and the draft only 5 weeks away, the Vikes would not have had any time to analyse Martz's preferences regarding players. It's not hard to conclude that we'd have an unfocused Free Agency and a poor draft.

Honestly, I think the time for an overhaul of the offense is due. Look at the threads on this board; they're being started by people clamouring for a decision to made about our Quarterback (either releasing or trading or keeping Culpepper), a new Offensive Line (with the exception of Bryant McKinnie), new Running Backs (the threads regarding Edge James, Shaun Alexander, DeAngelo Williams and Laurence Maroney), new Tight Ends (releasing or trading Jimmy Kleinsasser and drafting Vernon Davis), and a change in our starting Wide Receivers. Apart from Fullback, which Goodspeed has locked by default, that sure sounds to me like every skill position on the Vikings Offense is up for grabs.

I'm digressing, but I promise I'll get back to the point now.

Remember; the Vikings Head Coach and Defensive Co-ordinator were both HIGHLY sought-after in this coaching cycle. Yes, Philly have only made the Superbowl once while Childress was the OC, but if it wasn't for the consecutive trips to the NFC Championship Game, you can bet your bottom Dollar he would have been hired as someone's Head Coach before now. And Mike Tomlin was a part of a top 10 defense for a number of years, being promoted almost every year. That takes some doing.

My point (finally): These are all successful coaches. Unlike the majority of former Head Coaches who become available, as they only usually become available because of a poor record at their former club. Sometimes this works (see: Belichick, Bill). Other times it doesn't.

Personally, I'd rather have a new staff who doesn't immediately bring in the bad taste of failure at a prior team. I'm really optimistic about the Vikings coaches.

VikesfaninWis
02-21-2006, 07:45 PM
"Benet" wrote:

Unfortunately, articles such as this can only fan the flames of insecurity in the Vikes fans who don't come on this board to be reassured by you fine people! However, even a tiny amount of analysis can show this article is entirely one-sided. Childress is called the "nobody assistant"; so what was Andy Reid before the Eagles hired him? If we all cast our minds back then, we'll find that Reid was the Packers Quarterbacks Coach.. A position even lower than Offensive Co-ordinator! Now I'm sure all of you can agree with me that a Quarterbacks coach (while EXTREMELY important, as we saw with Scott Linehan's impact on Culpepper's development) has less of an input on an offensive gameplan than an OC who doesn't call the plays.

Yes, there are both advantages and disadvantages to hiring your staff as quickly as possible. The point about Jim Haslett as a Defensive Co-ordinator has already been raised, you could also make the same case for or against Mike Martz. Martz would certainly do his best to bring back the kind of offense we Vikings fans grew to love during the best years of Dennis Green's tenure, and his background at St Louis would make him the most likely person to do it. However we'd have only just signed Martz if we went for him, and with Free Agency (still) scheduled to begin on March 3rd, and the draft only 5 weeks away, the Vikes would not have had any time to analyse Martz's preferences regarding players. It's not hard to conclude that we'd have an unfocused Free Agency and a poor draft.

Honestly, I think the time for an overhaul of the offense is due. Look at the threads on this board; they're being started by people clamouring for a decision to made about our Quarterback (either releasing or trading or keeping Culpepper), a new Offensive Line (with the exception of Bryant McKinnie), new Running Backs (the threads regarding Edge James, Shaun Alexander, DeAngelo Williams and Laurence Maroney), new Tight Ends (releasing or trading Jimmy Kleinsasser and drafting Vernon Davis), and a change in our starting Wide Receivers. Apart from Fullback, which Goodspeed has locked by default, that sure sounds to me like every skill position on the Vikings Offense is up for grabs.

I'm digressing, but I promise I'll get back to the point now.

Remember; the Vikings Head Coach and Defensive Co-ordinator were both HIGHLY sought-after in this coaching cycle. Yes, Philly have only made the Superbowl once while Childress was the OC, but if it wasn't for the consecutive trips to the NFC Championship Game, you can bet your bottom Dollar he would have been hired as someone's Head Coach before now. And Mike Tomlin was a part of a top 10 defense for a number of years, being promoted almost every year. That takes some doing.

My point (finally): These are all successful coaches. Unlike the majority of former Head Coaches who become available, as they only usually become available because of a poor record at their former club. Sometimes this works (see: Belichick, Bill). Other times it doesn't.

Personally, I'd rather have a new staff who doesn't immediately bring in the bad taste of failure at a prior team. I'm really optimistic about the Vikings coaches.


Couldn't have said it any better myself. Good post.

COJOMAY
02-21-2006, 07:47 PM
Good post Benner and I agree with almost all of what you said.
What you have to remember on this board is that people have "favorite" players and don't want to see them leave. They want to build around those favorites rather than looking at the big picture of what's best for the team as a whole.
Frankly, I wouldn't care if every player on the team were let go if Childress and his staff couple prove to me that his direction for the team will produce a winning attitude and "TEAM" play as a whole which I think is one of the most important aspects of any NFL organization.
You have to look no futher than the NE Patroits and the Steelers to see that it isn't a team of superstars that are winners but players who work with and for one another in a "team" atmosphere. And I think the same goes for the coaching staff.

singersp
02-22-2006, 04:13 AM
"COJOMAY" wrote:

Good post Benner and I agree with almost all of what you said.
What you have to remember on this board is that people have "favorite" players and don't want to see them leave. They want to build around those favorites rather than looking at the big picture of what's best for the team as a whole.
Frankly, I wouldn't care if every player on the team were let go if Childress and his staff couple prove to me that his direction for the team will produce a winning attitude and "TEAM" play as a whole which I think is one of the most important aspects of any NFL organization.
You have to look no futher than the NE Patroits and the Steelers to see that it isn't a team of superstars that are winners but players who work with and for one another in a "team" atmosphere. And I think the same goes for the coaching staff.

We have talent on this team.

If producing a winning attitude and "TEAM" play is the only thing missing, then all Childress & company have to do is instill that in our current team & we would dominate.

UTVikfan
02-22-2006, 05:44 PM
The recipe for success. Get a new owner, with no experience. Fire EVERY SINGLE PERSON with experience. Hire a HC with no experience. Hire a DC with no experience. Hire a OC with no experience. Hire a line coach with no experience. Hire a DB coach aint done it before. Hire a trainer off the street. Hire a GM that is good at saying "YES SIR!". Hire everyone else in the place with no experience (I wonder if the janitor's were spared....bet not), and send your franchise QB to Miami cause he miffed the HC, and owner.

The NFL is a copy cat league. Do you really see everyone in the league doing that after we "win the superbowl" next year? I bet we will be really pushing the pack for last in the division, with all these "good" changes.

Won't work in any other business. I dont see it happening in the NFL either.

cajunvike
02-22-2006, 06:11 PM
"UTVikfan" wrote:

The recipe for success. Get a new owner, with no experience. Fire EVERY SINGLE PERSON with experience. Hire a HC with no experience. Hire a DC with no experience. Hire a OC with no experience. Hire a line coach with no experience. Hire a DB coach aint done it before. Hire a trainer off the street. Hire a GM that is good at saying "YES SIR!". Hire everyone else in the place with no experience (I wonder if the janitor's were spared....bet not), and send your franchise QB to Miami cause he miffed the HC, and owner.

The NFL is a copy cat league. Do you really see everyone in the league doing that after we "win the superbowl" next year? I bet we will be really pushing the pack for last in the division, with all these "good" changes.

Won't work in any other business. I dont see it happening in the NFL either.

Could you TONE DOWN your unbridled enthusiasm a few notches...some of us here want to wallow in our negativity! :lol: :razz:

NodakPaul
02-22-2006, 06:20 PM
I think you are being a little pesimistic. Granted, I doubt we will be making a superbowl run, but I don't think we will be finishing last in the division either.

Keep in mind that it is not like our coaching staff was picked at random out of a crowd at the mall. They all have experience, and success, at other levels. And keep in mind that the "inexperienced" HC, OC, and DC are all respected in their fields.

I think we did pretty well with our new coaching changes. Even if 50% are a bust, we will still be better off than we were last year!

seaniemck7
02-22-2006, 08:15 PM
The recipe for success. Get a new owner, with no experience. Fire EVERY SINGLE PERSON with experience. Hire a HC with no experience. Hire a DC with no experience. Hire a OC with no experience. Hire a line coach with no experience. Hire a DB coach aint done it before. Hire a trainer off the street. Hire a GM that is good at saying "YES SIR!". Hire everyone else in the place with no experience (I wonder if the janitor's were spared....bet not), and send your franchise QB to Miami cause he miffed the HC, and owner.

Maybe we should have kept the same mediocre coaching staff for the next 5 years as well. Let's take a look at what our coaching staff is doing next year:
Tice: Assistant Coach
Loney: Offensive Line Coach
Cotrell: Retired (because No One offered him a job even with the plethora of openings this year)
Yeah, we should have stuck with that staff. That is a recipe for success. :roll:

Or Maybe we should have waited to hire people with "experience" who had all been fired from their respective positions. That what sounds like a great plan. Lets get some experienced guys who suck. That sounds great!

snowinapril
02-22-2006, 08:24 PM
"UTVikfan" wrote:

The recipe for success. Get a new owner, with no experience. Fire EVERY SINGLE PERSON with experience. Hire a HC with no experience. Hire a DC with no experience. Hire a OC with no experience. Hire a line coach with no experience. Hire a DB coach aint done it before. Hire a trainer off the street. Hire a GM that is good at saying "YES SIR!". Hire everyone else in the place with no experience (I wonder if the janitor's were spared....bet not), and send your franchise QB to Miami cause he miffed the HC, and owner.

The NFL is a copy cat league. Do you really see everyone in the league doing that after we "win the superbowl" next year? I bet we will be really pushing the pack for last in the division, with all these "good" changes.

Won't work in any other business. I dont see it happening in the NFL either.

Sometimes that is what it takes to think outside the box.

I can see your concerns, I have pondered on them as well. Put on top of your concerns, the guys that we got rid of last season, and then the guys that are rumored to be gone this offseason, WOW. That much change is hard to swallow.

singersp
02-22-2006, 08:33 PM
"snowinapril" wrote:

"UTVikfan" wrote:

The recipe for success. Get a new owner, with no experience. Fire EVERY SINGLE PERSON with experience. Hire a HC with no experience. Hire a DC with no experience. Hire a OC with no experience. Hire a line coach with no experience. Hire a DB coach aint done it before. Hire a trainer off the street. Hire a GM that is good at saying "YES SIR!". Hire everyone else in the place with no experience (I wonder if the janitor's were spared....bet not), and send your franchise QB to Miami cause he miffed the HC, and owner.

The NFL is a copy cat league. Do you really see everyone in the league doing that after we "win the superbowl" next year? I bet we will be really pushing the pack for last in the division, with all these "good" changes.

Won't work in any other business. I dont see it happening in the NFL either.

Sometimes that is what it takes to think outside the box.

I can see your concerns, I have pondered on them as well. Put on top of your concerns, the guys that we got rid of last season, and then the guys that are rumored to be gone this offseason, WOW. That much change is hard to swallow.

:wink:

UTVikfan
02-23-2006, 05:33 PM
I got that outta my system for another week or so. I figure NBD, LOL, I shoulda got TORCHED by you guys, but, I have all off-season to deal with this.

We could however get 53 rookies for our rost....nm. I will behave.

I really do wish we had some experience. We were very, very close rosterwise to a bowl. Very close, IMO. It pains me to have another learning curve for all those folks to go through. It drives me nuts. And if we have to baby sit a new QB...oh man! But, what can you do?