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singersp
10-28-2005, 03:17 AM
From Vikings update.com

Are Vikings Believers in Themselves?

By Scout.com
Date: Oct 27, 2005

The Vikings’ win over Green Bay could be a turning point in the season or just a momentary lapse of happiness in an otherwise gloomy season, depending on their follow-up in Carolina.

The Vikings’ season of turmoil and disappointment looked finished at halftime of last Sunday’s game against Green Bay. Trailing 17-0, the Vikings were booed off the Metrodome field and appeared destined to for a 1-5 start.

And then everything changed ...

Perhaps inspired by embattled coach Mike Tice’s halftime speech or maybe just embarrassed enough by a combination of off-the-field issues and on-the-field ineptitude, the Vikings rallied for 23 second-half points en route a 23-20 victory.

As kicker Paul Edinger’s team-record 56-yard field goal went through the uprights, the Vikings were given a second lease on life in the NFC North.

On Sunday, we’ll find out how Tice’s team handles this bit of prosperity. It won’t be an easy task for the Vikings, who at 2-4 are amazingly only one game behind division co-leaders Chicago (3-3) and Detroit (3-3).

The Vikings will make their first-ever regular-season trip to Carolina, a much better team than Green Bay. The Panthers (4-2) are tied for second place in the highly competitive NFC South and will be well-rested coming off a bye. It’s the second consecutive week the Vikings will face a team that had a bye.

Tice’s biggest concern will be getting his team to believe it can win a game away from the Metrodome. At home, the Viking are 2-1, losing the season-opener to Tampa Bay (24-13) and then rebounding with victories over New Orleans (33-16) and the Packers.

Away from home is a different story.

The Vikings have been dreadful on the road, getting routed by Cincinnati (37-8), Atlanta (30-10) and Chicago (28-3). There only two touchdowns have been late scores that came when the games were out of hand.

Getting this type of failure turnaround quickly won’t be easy for Tice. Since taking over in 2001, his teams have never had much success on the road and it has been especially tough in outdoor stadiums.

Tice is 9-18 on the road since taking over for the final game of the 2002 season after Dennis Green was fired. Overall, the Vikings have lost 31 of their past 40 contests as visitors, dating to the middle of the 2000 season. Minnesota has a 3-20 record outdoors in that time.

One of the Vikings’ biggest problems is an inability to keep cool after something goes wrong on the road. Quarterback Daunte Culpepper and Co., seem to get rattled far too easily at the first sign of trouble.

But if the Vikings are too stay within striking distance of the NFC North lead — and they are being every chance to do so — they must prove that not only was last Sunday no fluke but that this team can win in a tough environment.

singersp
10-28-2005, 03:23 AM
Even though Tice is 9-18 on the road, that's an improvement from the Denny era!

gregair13
10-28-2005, 03:54 AM
hopefully we believe in ourself. i know some of the players do, but i dont think all of them are on the same page yet. winning this weekend would help that along.

ultravikingfan
10-28-2005, 05:02 AM
I believe in the Vikes.

Doesn't that count for something?

PurplePeopleEaters
10-28-2005, 05:08 AM
Me too ultra. We can do it!

singersp
10-28-2005, 05:59 AM
I've never stopped believing in them!

audioghost
10-28-2005, 06:03 AM
"singersp" wrote:

Even though Tice is 9-18 on the road, that's an improvement from the Denny era!

It is??? I'm pretty sure the Denny era was one of the best in our history, unlike this year when the talent is there but we're underachieving....when Denny coached we did more with (maybe) less talent and if not the same amount....

The "Denny Years"
W L
1992 min | 11 5 0 |
| 1993 min | 9 7 0 |
| 1994 min | 10 6 0 |
| 1995 min | 8 8 0 |
| 1996 min | 9 7 0 |
| 1997 min | 9 7 0 |
| 1998 min | 15 1 0 |
| 1999 min | 10 6 0 |
| 2000 min | 11 5
|2001 min| 5 11

I believe we only missed the playoffs twice those years.....

97-63 overall record with the Vikes, purdy darn good.... those were the years where I could make it to the end of the season and actually feel good about what the Vikes did that year.....

Tice: 25-30 overall record.....I wish cheapy McCombs wouldn't have blown his load when the Vikes had 1 losing season....shoulda kept him or got somebody better....but we got Tice, the team got the short end of that deal......I want John Randle and Chris Doleman and Cris Carter and Robert Smith and Randall McDaniel and Denny back!!! :sad:


DENNY ACTUALLY WON, I loved him as a coach....he knew how to get results.....Green and Grant, the best coaches in our history.....

audioghost
10-28-2005, 06:05 AM
That being said....I believe the Vikings can WIN THE SUPERBOWL....but I 'd be a lot more confident if we had a better coach....

snowinapril
10-28-2005, 06:11 AM
"audioghost" wrote:


Tice: 25-30 overall record.....I wish cheapy McCombs wouldn't have blown his load when the Vikes had 1 losing season....shoulda kept him (Denny) or got somebody better....but we got Tice, the team got the short end of that deal......I want John Randle and Chris Doleman and Cris Carter and Robert Smith and Randall McDaniel and Denny back!!! :sad:


DENNY ACTUALLY WON, I loved him as a coach....he knew how to get results.....Green and Grant, the best coaches in our history.....

I liked Denny too. I think what happened with Denny was him and Red got into it. I think Denny got sick of him talking to the players like he was the pep ralley king. I can see it in Tice's eyes too every clip in the locker room after the games when Red speaks. Tice's eyes and Denny's had a lot in them that said, "just shut up old man."

Seriously, next time you see one of those year highlight films and you see Red talking, look for Tice's face and his eyes. It is something to see.

snowinapril
10-28-2005, 06:15 AM
"singersp" wrote:



And then everything changed ...

Perhaps inspired by embattled coach Mike Tice’s halftime speech or maybe just embarrassed enough by a combination of off-the-field issues and on-the-field ineptitude, the Vikings rallied for 23 second-half points en route a 23-20 victory.


I heard a comment from a player, and it went like this, I think it was Burley on NFL TA.

Tice gave a speach at half time and if you closed your eyes and listened, you would have thought it was on of the players talking.

He meant it as a positive for Tice. But the first thing that I thought was "players coach."

Good or Bad???????

singersp
10-28-2005, 06:20 AM
"audioghost" wrote:

"singersp" wrote:

Even though Tice is 9-18 on the road, that's an improvement from the Denny era!

It is??? I'm pretty sure the Denny era was one of the best in our history, unlike this year when the talent is there but we're underachieving....when Denny coached we did more with (maybe) less talent and if not the same amount....

I was refering to the article;


"Tice is 9-18 on the road since taking over for the final game of the 2002 season after Dennis Green was fired. Overall, the Vikings have lost 31 of their past 40 contests as visitors, dating to the middle of the 2000 season"

If we lost 31 out of our last 40 games on the road & we were 9-18 with Tice, that means Denny was 0-13.

audioghost
10-28-2005, 06:22 AM
I mean I hate to be negative, and I KNOW we have the players this year.....but I can't let someone diss Denny Green like that, because the fact is he was a great coach.....a short one (I met him, looked like an old black elf...kinda like the one on bad santa, xcept old (looks much older in person)) but a goodie!

ultravikingfan
10-28-2005, 06:25 AM
"audioghost" wrote:

"singersp" wrote:

Even though Tice is 9-18 on the road, that's an improvement from the Denny era!

It is??? I'm pretty sure the Denny era was one of the best in our history, unlike this year when the talent is there but we're underachieving....when Denny coached we did more with (maybe) less talent and if not the same amount....

The "Denny Years"
W L
1992 min | 11 5 0 |
| 1993 min | 9 7 0 |
| 1994 min | 10 6 0 |
| 1995 min | 8 8 0 |
| 1996 min | 9 7 0 |
| 1997 min | 9 7 0 |
| 1998 min | 15 1 0 |
| 1999 min | 10 6 0 |
| 2000 min | 11 5
|2001 min| 5 11

I believe we only missed the playoffs twice those years.....

97-63 overall record with the Vikes, purdy darn good.... those were the years where I could make it to the end of the season and actually feel good about what the Vikes did that year.....

Tice: 25-30 overall record.....I wish cheapy McCombs wouldn't have blown his load when the Vikes had 1 losing season....shoulda kept him or got somebody better....but we got Tice, the team got the short end of that deal......I want John Randle and Chris Doleman and Cris Carter and Robert Smith and Randall McDaniel and Denny back!!! :sad:


DENNY ACTUALLY WON, I loved him as a coach....he knew how to get results.....Green and Grant, the best coaches in our history.....

This says nothing about Denny's road record in which singer was referring too.

audioghost
10-28-2005, 06:29 AM
I can't see how he could be 0-13 when in his last 4 seasons the Vikes went

15-1
10-6
11-5
then 5-11 (one bad year)

Ok, correct me if I'm wrong....but you play hlaf of your games on the road, right? And there's 16 games in a season, right? So that means 8 home games, 8 away games, right? So if you go 11-5 you win at least 3 away games, 10-6 at least 2 away games won, 15-1 at least 7 away games won....thats a horrible stat ya got there....because the Vikings didn't go perfect at home those 4 years, therefore the worst case scenerio is that they were 12-20....12-20 AT LEAST in Denny's last 4 years, and thats if all their losses from 98-2000 were on the road, which they were not....so that stat is incorrect......

singersp
10-28-2005, 06:32 AM
"snowinapril" wrote:

"singersp" wrote:



And then everything changed ...

Perhaps inspired by embattled coach Mike Tice’s halftime speech or maybe just embarrassed enough by a combination of off-the-field issues and on-the-field ineptitude, the Vikings rallied for 23 second-half points en route a 23-20 victory.


I heard a comment from a player, and it went like this, I think it was Burley on NFL TA.

Tice gave a speach at half time and if you closed your eyes and listened, you would have thought it was on of the players talking.

He meant it as a positive for Tice. But the first thing that I thought was "players coach."

Good or Bad???????

If it worked it must be good! Burley has a lot of respect for Tice.

I taped the progam on DVR. He also said something like it felt as if Tice wanted to strap on the pads & run down field & hit somebody!

I was out of the room for awhile & when I came back in I heard Burley saying something like "Make a trade for me & we'll score a lot of TDs!

After saying WTF? I rewound it only to find out he was talking about Fantasy Football.

audioghost
10-28-2005, 06:32 AM
Denny was bad his last 2 years....that is it....before those last 2, they were at least 12-7 on the road then if they were 0-13 since the middle of the '00 season.....

In other words NOT AN IMPROVEMENT....Tice hasn't improved on anything since the "Denny years", he never had a 5-11 season, but he had a 6-10 season which is just as bad in my book....before 2000 Denny was solid on the road, so no, it isn't better than we Denny Green coached

singersp
10-28-2005, 06:36 AM
I know that audioghost. Once again, I'm refering too how were improving from those last 2 years of Denny, when we 0-13 on the road.

audioghost
10-28-2005, 06:39 AM
OK, WE STILL SUCK....thats all I'm saying.....WE STILL SUCK ON THE ROAD....we didn't always suck on the road with Denny AT LEAST...but we've ALWAYS sucked on the road with Tice....thats all I'm saying

singersp
10-28-2005, 06:47 AM
I understand you. I liked Denny myself. We went up hill with Denny, then down hill with Denny (his last 2 years), stayed pretty much on a flat with Tice & now I believe were goning to start going back up again.

I see improvement finally coming on road wins, as compared to those last 2 denny years. Thats all I'm saying.

singersp
10-28-2005, 06:56 AM
"audioghost" wrote:

I can't see how he could be 0-13 when in his last 4 seasons the Vikes went

15-1
10-6
11-5
then 5-11 (one bad year)

Ok, correct me if I'm wrong....but you play hlaf of your games on the road, right? And there's 16 games in a season, right? So that means 8 home games, 8 away games, right? So if you go 11-5 you win at least 3 away games, 10-6 at least 2 away games won, 15-1 at least 7 away games won....thats a horrible stat ya got there....because the Vikings didn't go perfect at home those 4 years, therefore the worst case scenerio is that they were 12-20....12-20 AT LEAST in Denny's last 4 years, and thats if all their losses from 98-2000 were on the road, which they were not....so that stat is incorrect......

In his last two years he lost 13, 8 in 2001 & 5 in 2000. Actually Green went 5-10 in his last year, because Tice coached the last game of that year at home & I believe we lost.

audioghost
10-28-2005, 06:58 AM
Yeah, but then again you gotta see that we lost by a combined 70 some points on the road this year.....so we saw Denny fail those last two years after seeing the Vikes do good on the road, so we had high expectations, therefore it looked worse....but with Tice on the road, we got loooooow expectations so any improvement might look like a big improvement to us.....we just need to start WINNING...whether its on the road or not.....

The Vikings need to realize that a football field is a football field no matter what the setting and we got the talent to win at any field....I think the players take way too much energy from the crowd at home or something....cuz its just ridiculous.....

FuadFan
10-28-2005, 06:59 AM
Green had pretty much lost the team at that point near the end of his run as our coach so it isn't to surprising and it wasn't like he was preventing the controversies that kept coming up about himself.

ultravikingfan
10-28-2005, 07:10 AM
I did some research. Here is the Vikings road record under Green:

1992: 6-2---Overall: 11-5
1993: 5-3---Overall: 9-7
1994: 4-4---Overall: 10-6
1995: 2-6---Overall: 8-8
1996: 4-4---Overall: 9-7
1997: 4-4---Overall: 9-7
1998: 7-1---Overall: 15-1
1999: 4-4---Overall: 10-6
2000: 4-4---Overall: 11-5
2001: 0-8---Overall: 5-11


So, Green was 40-40 on the road. Overall he was 97-63.

Denny really only sucked his final year. In 2000 we were 11-5 and in 2001 we were 5-11.

Tice's road record:

2002: 2-6---Overall: 6-10
2003: 3-5---Overall: 9-7
2004: 3-5---Overall: 8-8
2005: 0-3---Overall: 2-4

Road: 8-19. Overall: 25-29.

Here is where I got all this info.
http://vikings.scout.com/2/34990.html
http://vikings.scout.com/2/34991.html
http://vikings.scout.com/2/34992.html
http://vikings.scout.com/2/34992.html#2002
http://www.nfl.com/standings/2004/regular

singersp
10-28-2005, 07:11 AM
"audioghost" wrote:

Yeah, but then again you gotta see that we lost by a combined 70 some points on the road this year.....so we saw Denny fail those last two years after seeing the Vikes do good on the road, so we had high expectations, therefore it looked worse....but with Tice on the road, we got loooooow expectations so any improvement might look like a big improvement to us.....we just need to start WINNING...whether its on the road or not.....

The Vikings need to realize that a football field is a football field no matter what the setting and we got the talent to win at any field....I think the players take way too much energy from the crowd at home or something....cuz its just ridiculous.....

With the exception of the "hi & lo expectations" were on the same page.

Us Vikings fans have always had high expectations of our team, no matter who was coaching.

audioghost
10-28-2005, 07:14 AM
If only we could get up to .500 on the road every year once again....I think the rest of the stuff would sort itself out if we could at least do that..!

singersp
10-28-2005, 07:17 AM
Then the article is off the mark. 8 + 19 (Tice) = 27 games + 8 (2001) & 4(2000) = 39, not 40.

ultravikingfan
10-28-2005, 07:21 AM
I just added everything by hand. I double checked it too.

Did not take into account that Tice coached the last game of 2001. But, from all my info you get the picture.

singersp
10-28-2005, 02:47 PM
"ultravikingfan" wrote:

I just added everything by hand. I double checked it too.

Did not take into account that Tice coached the last game of 2001. But, from all my info you get the picture.

That was my picture. Thanx Ultra.

BigSkyvikefan
10-28-2005, 07:12 PM
"singersp" wrote:

I've never stopped believing in them!

I second that! I have NEVER stopped believing in the Vikings! Once a Viking.........ALWAYS a Viking! :grin:

gregair13
10-28-2005, 07:24 PM
so we are a bad road team. who cares. a win this week will help people forget and move tice towards .500

ultravikingfan
10-28-2005, 07:51 PM
"gregair13" wrote:

so we are a bad road team. who cares. a win this week will help people forget and move tice towards .500

Exactly!

We could win this one 8 more in a row on the road! You never know what is going to happen! :wink:

PurpleBlood
10-29-2005, 05:54 AM
"ultravikingfan" wrote:

"gregair13" wrote:

so we are a bad road team. who cares. a win this week will help people forget and move tice towards .500

Exactly!

We could win this one 8 more in a row on the road! You never know what is going to happen! winkAny given sunday~thats why we go into every week like were gonna clean the other teams' clocks