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View Full Version : An outsiders point of view



PackerPride
10-06-2005, 06:04 AM
Me, being a Packer fan, I feel that these are the biggest problems I see with the Vikes thus far (and I'm not saying I know more than any educated Vikes fan would). The biggest and most obvious problem is your coach, atleast to this point. I read an article yesterday about Tice and his 80 minute team meeting. 3 players (who didn't want their names disclosed) said they felt that their coach gave up on the team. Several other players also thought the meeting sounded like he (Mike Tice) was going to resign. Those are 2 things a coach should never portray.

The second problem I see is Culpepper getting used to the offense without the best wide receiver in the game (I hated Moss as much as you guys hate Favre, but I still respected the hell out of him). Most great QBs had a great WR to work with (Montana & Rice, Manning & Harrison, ect). Whether DC can turn a WR into Pro Bowl type player is still anybody's guess.

The third real problem is team chemistry (or lack of gelling). I feel like you guys definately have the talent on defense, but for some reason they aren't clicking well together as of yet. Maybe the lack of scoring, or being put in too many bad situations by the offense makes them look worse than they have been.

Which brings me to the last thing I've noticed, the offensive line. They don't seem to be opening up many holes for the running game (no matter which back is in) and are doing even worse pass blocking (I think I counted 9 sacks on DC the last game). This could very well be the 2nd biggest problem, right behind Tice still being coach after his little meeting.

Well, that's the problems I've noticed being an outsider. If you could find a good head coach and a way to make the O-line play better, you guys would have a very solid team. I hope I didn't insult anyone, as that wasn't my intention. My Packers have just as many problems as the Vikings do. :razz:

WBLVikeBabe
10-06-2005, 06:15 AM
Well thanks for the input but it's nothing we haven't already heard.

PackerPride
10-06-2005, 06:21 AM
Your probably right. :razz:

I would be more than willing to hear your takes on what the Pack needs to do to improve on their team. :smile:

Caine
10-06-2005, 06:21 AM
"PackerPride" wrote:

Me, being a Packer fan, I feel that these are the biggest problems I see with the Vikes thus far (and I'm not saying I know more than any educated Vikes fan would). The biggest and most obvious problem is your coach, atleast to this point. I read an article yesterday about Tice and his 80 minute team meeting. 3 players (who didn't want their names disclosed) said they felt that their coach gave up on the team. Several other players also thought the meeting sounded like he (Mike Tice) was going to resign. Those are 2 things a coach should never portray.

I think the Tice issue is overblown myself. I think it's more of a case of our FORMER owner not being willing to hire quality coaching at ANY level...which is why we have the OC and DC we do...neither of whom is an ideal candidate.

I also read where a number of Viking players were shocked that ANYONE thought Tice was giving up. In fact, one (I can't recall whom...maybe Birk?) stated something to the effect that the ones who had that opinion were likely a source of some of our true problems.

"PackerPride" wrote:

The second problem I see is Culpepper getting used to the offense without the best wide receiver in the game (I hated Moss as much as you guys hate Favre, but I still respected the hell out of him). Most great QBs had a great WR to work with (Montana & Rice, Manning & Harrison, ect). Whether DC can turn a WR into Pro Bowl type player is still anybody's guess.

Culpepper has been playing with a "Deer in headlights" look this season. If he's ever going to climb out of the shadow of randy Moss, he has to start producing...he has failed to do so thus far. He's made bad decisions repeatedly...and the numbers bear that out. Our receiver corps is pretty darn good...Daunte just isn't seeing the field.

"PackerPride" wrote:

The third real problem is team chemistry (or lack of gelling). I feel like you guys definately have the talent on defense, but for some reason they aren't clicking well together as of yet. Maybe the lack of scoring, or being put in too many bad situations by the offense makes them look worse than they have been.

Bad situations...well, maybe. I think our defensive woes lie more on the shoulders of Ted Cottrell. It's OBVIOUS that his guys don't know where they're supposed to be, and that indicates bad coaching. Bring in a quality DC and watch that unit tear it up.

"PackerPride" wrote:

Which brings me to the last thing I've noticed, the offensive line. They don't seem to be opening up many holes for the running game (no matter which back is in) and are doing even worse pass blocking (I think I counted 9 sacks on DC the last game). This could very well be the 2nd biggest problem, right behind Tice still being coach after his little meeting.

The O-line isn't as big of a problem as many are saying. Culpepper isn't seeing the field and taking too long in the pocket, and we aren't working our short game as hard as we should. But, it all comes back to Culpepper. He HAS to step up and make plays. he got a raise this year...it's time to earn it.

"PackerPride" wrote:

Well, that's the problems I've noticed being an outsider. If you could find a good head coach and a way to make the O-line play better, you guys would have a very solid team. I hope I didn't insult anyone, as that wasn't my intention. My Packers have just as many problems as the Vikings do. :razz:

No offense taken to your post. When you call it straight, it doesn't matter what color jersey you sport on Sunday.

Caine

Caine
10-06-2005, 06:25 AM
"PackerPride" wrote:

Your probably right. :razz:

I would be more than willing to hear your takes on what the Pack needs to do to improve on their team. :smile:

Fire Sherman.
Retire Favre.
Hit Free Agency.
Draft well.

None of which will happen until after this season (except mayber Sherman).

Your entire team needs a revamp. You have a handful of players to build on - mostly on Offense. But, Thompson isn't a big "FA" guy, so he'll probably try and rebuild throught the draft...and that means TIME. It's going to be awhile before the Packers are a power in the NFL again.

Caine

PackerPride
10-06-2005, 06:27 AM
Nice replay Caine. :smile:

natethegreat
10-06-2005, 06:30 AM
"Caine" wrote:

"PackerPride" wrote:

Your probably right. :razz:

I would be more than willing to hear your takes on what the Pack needs to do to improve on their team. :smile:

Fire Sherman.
Retire Favre.
Hit Free Agency.
Draft well.

None of which will happen until after this season (except mayber Sherman).

Your entire team needs a revamp. You have a handful of players to build on - mostly on Offense. But, Thompson isn't a big "FA" guy, so he'll probably try and rebuild throught the draft...and that means TIME. It's going to be awhile before the Packers are a power in the NFL again.

Caine

i agree with all of those things the pack needs to do, i sure hope they dont get "the president" reggie bush because i would hate to have to play against him twice a year

PackerPride
10-06-2005, 06:30 AM
I truly still feel that Favre has a few good years left in him. I agree with the rest of the reasons tho. The biggest problem is going to be getting talent around favre. Green hasn't done much this year yet either. Maybe time for a change at RB?

PackerPride
10-06-2005, 06:32 AM
Are you sure Bush isn't a product of Leinart tho? I've heard all the hype, but having the best player in the country as your QB can't hurt either.

gregair13
10-06-2005, 10:49 PM
we kow the problems. we dont need an 0-4 fan to come and tell us.

ultravikingfan
10-06-2005, 10:56 PM
"gregair13" wrote:

we kow the problems. we dont need an 0-4 fan to come and tell us.

He came in peace.

No need to smack him.

snowinapril
10-07-2005, 12:18 AM
"PackerPride" wrote:

I truly still feel that Favre has a few good years left in him. I agree with the rest of the reasons tho. The biggest problem is going to be getting talent around favre. Green hasn't done much this year yet either. Maybe time for a change at RB?

Do you want to start rebuilding now or in a few years?

It is tough to let a legend go, but sometime it has to happen.

Remember Montana, I wasn't even a Montana fan and it just didn't seem right.

They had Young to immediately replace Montana. If your young guy could mature, it might happen sooner than later.

Honestly, there isn't any other QBs out there that are available that can play better than Favre can at this time, so unless you are willing to let the youngster play while rebuilding, you keep Favre.

EJOlson9973
10-07-2005, 12:28 AM
Reggie Bush? are you serious? The guy is not that good. He has a great team. What about maroney? He has better numbers than Bush. That's a joke. Hahaha

snowinapril
10-07-2005, 12:42 AM
"EJOlson9973" wrote:

Reggie Bush? are you serious? The guy is not that good. He has a great team. What about maroney? He has better numbers than Bush. That's a joke. Hahaha

Shushshshshshsh!!!!!!

You don't want Maroney playing for the packers do you????

Keep that info on the Down Low!

CanadaViking
10-07-2005, 12:50 AM
"gregair13" wrote:

we kow the problems. we dont need an 0-4 fan to come and tell us.


Hey there gregair, why don't you give the guy a break, he came here to talk football, so cut him some slack. Also what is with your favorite player, Daunte Culpepper *rolling my eyes* thing? You seem to be the Canadian that will give the rest of us canadians a bad name around here. Pick your battles bro and leave the dudes alone that are just talking ball! And if you are rolling your eyes when saying D-Pep is your favorite baller, it doesn't make you sound like Vikings fan, however I may have mis-understood your favorite player thing, if so sorry! But lay off the harmless dudes and arm yourself for the Packer Pooh Heads that are coming to the site soon!!

Cheers!!

vikinggreg
10-07-2005, 01:01 AM
"Caine" wrote:



"PackerPride" wrote:

Which brings me to the last thing I've noticed, the offensive line. They don't seem to be opening up many holes for the running game (no matter which back is in) and are doing even worse pass blocking (I think I counted 9 sacks on DC the last game). This could very well be the 2nd biggest problem, right behind Tice still being coach after his little meeting.

The O-line isn't as big of a problem as many are saying. Culpepper isn't seeing the field and taking too long in the pocket, and we aren't working our short game as hard as we should. But, it all comes back to Culpepper. He HAS to step up and make plays. he got a raise this year...it's time to earn it.

Caine

Maybe Pep just needs a good pair of contacts or a pair of glasses like Rick "Wild Thing" Vaughn in Major League :cool:
The Hanson Bro look from Slapshot might be his new style

midgensa
10-07-2005, 02:02 AM
I think you hit fairly on the head here.
I think the Tice thing has definitely been blown out of proportion and I think the main problem with this team lies in defensive and offensive coordinator positions.
Cottrell obviously has everyone confused as to what is going on. I was at the Falcons game and there were times where the run blitz was on and the DB's clearly did not know or were unaware of where they were supposed to be botching good play calls with confusion. I think that comes down to making sure the players understand the scheme.
On offense, the line does not protect well and the WR dont get open, combined with C-Pep being indecive and not making correct reads, which leads to sacks, INT's and only short completions.
Hopefully the bye and the addition of outside help will help correct alot of this in time for the trip to Chicago.

EJOlson9973
10-07-2005, 02:11 AM
When I was talking about Maroney, I was just pointing out the fact that everyone is obsessed with R. Bush. I'm just sick of hearing about him. If Maroney was USC, then everyone would be obsessed with him, it's all about the band wagon.

Now I will Shush...

CanadaViking
10-07-2005, 04:22 AM
"midgensa" wrote:

I think you hit fairly on the head here.
I think the Tice thing has definitely been blown out of proportion and I think the main problem with this team lies in defensive and offensive coordinator positions.
Cottrell obviously has everyone confused as to what is going on. I was at the Falcons game and there were times where the run blitz was on and the DB's clearly did not know or were unaware of where they were supposed to be botching good play calls with confusion. I think that comes down to making sure the players understand the scheme.
On offense, the line does not protect well and the WR dont get open, combined with C-Pep being indecive and not making correct reads, which leads to sacks, INT's and only short completions.
Hopefully the bye and the addition of outside help will help correct alot of this in time for the trip to Chicago.



First of all you say that the Tice stuff has been blown out of proportion and that the blame is on Loney and Cottrell and you are right, they are definitely to blame for their part. The part that doesn't make sense to ME is that Tice hired these two bozos, ultimately the HC has to be held responsible. If I hired someone to work for me and they don't do as they are asked or they aren't doing their job properly, I have to fix it, however if I do not fix it, I have to start worrying about my job! That is where we are, sorry folks but the HC in the NFL is gonna love winning and there hate looking for a job after loses!

Cheers!