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View Full Version : future looks bright for vikings. even without moss



magicci
07-04-2005, 10:46 PM
read this...
http://profootballweekly.com/PFW/Commentary/Columns/2005/harkush2005.htm

Burley81
07-04-2005, 10:52 PM
Good read. This is Tice's year, I hope he can pull it off and won't make any stupid mistakes.

collegeguyjeff
07-04-2005, 10:56 PM
thats cool but i don't agree with dallas or kansas city. dallas drafted 4 drfensive ends which tells me they arn't sure who will be good or not, and kansas city didn't do much with thier defense. some people will say kansas city did a good job but they really didn't.

shockzilla
07-05-2005, 12:13 AM
Kinda makes you want to cross your fingers, doesn't it? :lol:

BigMoInAZ
07-05-2005, 12:44 AM
"collegeguyjeff" wrote:

some people will say kansas city did a good job but they really didn't.
I wouldn't call drafting Texas OLB Derrick Johnson a bad job of addressing their weak defense! He's gonna play with a passion belieng the Moss draft snub of 98!

Johnson is gonna prove some teams missed the boat on not selecting him earlier than the Chiefs with the 15th pick of the latest NFL Draft!

ejmat
07-05-2005, 12:48 AM
KC did do alot to upgrade their defense. You have Sammy Knight, Pat Surtain, and K. Bell. all of which have played big parts on great defenses. None of them are that old. I think that's a huge upgrade to last years defense.

RandyMoss8404
07-05-2005, 12:54 AM
And then you have Ashley Ambrose, who will make the no. 2 receiver of whoever he's playing look like a superstar.

midgensa
07-05-2005, 01:31 AM
Ambrose is no stud, but he is a more than capable No. 2 CB, and the additions of Bell, Surtain and Knight make this defense ten times more formidable. DJ can only help and will be a stud in this league at some point if not the season ... I think the Chiefs could very well represent the AFC, they have made very similar moves to us ... hell Knight is better than Sharper and Surtain is better than Smoot and Bell is a better risk than Cowart (both are coming off injuries and such). I mean they did not have Williams or Winfield in place like us so we are a better overall D, but they did get a lot better.

magicci
07-05-2005, 01:37 AM
who is better ambrose or williams?

ultravikingfan
07-05-2005, 04:32 AM
That was a great read! Thanks!

ejmat
07-05-2005, 05:07 AM
Good question Magicci. Ambrose or Williams? they play pretty similar. I would have to give the edge to Williams. Only because he is younger. Yes everyone read it right.....I gave Williams props.

VKG4LFE
07-07-2005, 06:22 PM
Are we jinxed now? I hope not!

VikemanX84
07-08-2005, 02:20 AM
I hope it's KC representing in the SuperBowl this season. It would be kind of sad getting revenge on them since Hank Stram died this year, but I would much rather see them than Oakland or New England. Which are the only two teams that scare me in the AFC against the vikes this year. However, if the Edge plays this season I still think it's going to be Vikings v Colts.

i_bleed_purple
07-08-2005, 07:47 AM
no one should worry about oakland

true moss and jordan will bring their defence up from marginal to good, but the loss of harris to their already craptacular defence will hurt real bad. as a football fan you should know that defence wins championships, offence sells tickets and jerseys. the raiders will have a 9-7 record at best and not make the playoffs you watch.

pats, well yah they scare me too.

muchluv4smoot
07-08-2005, 06:43 PM
"collegeguyjeff" wrote:

thats cool but i don't agree with dallas or kansas city. dallas drafted 4 drfensive ends which tells me they arn't sure who will be good or not, and kansas city didn't do much with thier defense. some people will say kansas city did a good job but they really didn't.


Dallas runs a 3-4, meaning college DE's will play both DE and OLB for dallas. Spears will be a DE and Ware will be an OLB. I like what dallas did at CB too, getting henry and glenn, to add with a very talented terrance newman. If they can fix that safety spot, next to roy, they could have a heck of a D. I don't like bledsoe though and don't see them as too much of a threat with him at QB. If they ride julious jones and their D is as good as I expect it to be, then bledsoe won't have to do much and I would say 10-11 wins is definitely a possibility. Not a super bowl contender with bledsoe though IMO, even if he doesn't have to do much.

I love what KC did to their D this offseason, getting bell, knight, surtain, ambrose, and drafting DJ. I also hear they are gonna make a push for ty law too, so their D could be significantly upgraded. They still have troubles at WR(especially with the team chemistry killer mitchell now there), and have a young and inconsistent kicker that they have to deal with. I am also not sold on their D-line either. 10 wins looks realistic for them and mabye a few more wins, if the breaks go their way, like they seemed to do 2 years ago.


I think it is obvious to everyone that the bigest question mark on our team is coaching. Tice, cotrell, and loney all have questions to answer this year.

muchluv4smoot
07-08-2005, 06:49 PM
"i_bleed_purple" wrote:

no one should worry about oakland

true moss and jordan will bring their defence up from marginal to good, but the loss of harris to their already craptacular defence will hurt real bad. as a football fan you should know that defence wins championships, offence sells tickets and jerseys. the raiders will have a 9-7 record at best and not make the playoffs you watch.

pats, well yah they scare me too.


The raiders also lost buchanon and will rely on an unproven CB now.

I think it is crazy that any vikes fan could fear the raiders this season. Are they not a replica of the vikes, of the past 5 years? We of all fans should know that even with the best offense in the league, you aren't going anywhere with one of the worst D's in the league. I think the raiders could push for worst D and best offense, and that would get them what 8 wins maybe. Plus if we traded moss because he hurt our team chemistry, that should be factored in at oakland too. I think 8 or 9 wins is about all oakland can hope for. Moss has to be frustrated, being here for 7 years and never having a D, then being shipped to oakland where they will have a crappy D, and seeing us immediately build a formidable D.

magicci
07-10-2005, 08:51 PM
yea i kinda feel for moss on that

MountainVike
07-13-2005, 01:10 AM
I agree. It sure wasn't Randy Moss' fault that we haven't had an average defense in years. Red could have spent that money anytime over the last 2-3 years to improve the defense, but chose not to. Our defense isn't better because of the Randy Moss trade (all we got on D was Harris)...it's better because of all the other moves we made. So, it's a shame that Randy won't be part of the revival.

DaunteHOF
07-13-2005, 05:51 PM
good read, only problem he seem to have was with the coaching, its on you Tice...

magicci
07-14-2005, 01:28 AM
what year did moss become the no.1 receiver for the vikings?

TroyWilliamson
07-14-2005, 01:41 AM
In 2000 or 2001 i'm quite sure it was 2001 though.

magicci
07-14-2005, 01:43 AM
what year did moss become like a superstar know ascross the NFL?

muchluv4smoot
07-14-2005, 02:13 AM
"MountainVike" wrote:

Our defense isn't better because of the Randy Moss trade (all we got on D was Harris)...it's better because of all the other moves we made.



More disrespect for napolean harris. :shock: I have seen tons of this guy(including his college games at northwestern) and he is better then a lot of people realize. He will be a key factor in the turnaround of our defense.

Also, with the trade of moss, we freed up the cap space in the future years, to allow us to sign all the D FA's we did this offseason. We had cap space to sign them this year, even if moss wasn't traded, but we wouldn't have the cap space after this season, for all the FA pickups we made, moss, and also we are gonna have to give burleson and kevin williams new deals after this year too. So the moss trade did help our D, not only by getting napo, but also by allowing us to spend like carzy in FA, without fear of cap problems next year and the year after, as well as allow us to give kevin williams a much deserved new long term contract next offseason too and avoid a possible holdout or trade demand.

It could also be said that with moss gone, we will have a more balanced, ball controlled offense. A ball control offense also helps a D, by giving them more of a rest between D series. Just look at what the jets and pitt's D did last year, after they returned to a more ball control offense, compared to their previous season.

I see the trade helping our D more then people realize.

muchluv4smoot
07-14-2005, 02:14 AM
"magicci" wrote:

what year did moss become the no.1 receiver for the vikings?


Even with moss' great #'s, I believe he wasn't the #1 receiver for the vikes, until carter left, which would have been 2001.

magicci
07-14-2005, 02:36 AM
man sometimes when i think of it, we were so lucky two see those 2 receivers share the field together i mean man that freakin awesome if u think about it

muchluv4smoot
07-14-2005, 03:34 AM
"magicci" wrote:

man sometimes when i think of it, we were so lucky two see those 2 receivers share the field together i mean man that freakin awesome if u think about it


It's extremely early and I am not making predictions, but we may be lucky enough to get to see 2 more great NFL WR's, in burleson and williamson. Burleson is similar to CC and wiliamson is similar to moss. Not saying they will have careers as good as CC or moss, but both are good young receivers with a lot of promise and in similar molds of CC and moss. We could be lucky again, in 2-3 years, when williamson and burleson are fully developed and in their primes.

Again i say, not saying they will be as good as moss or CC, but a great duo of WR's in similar molds.

RandyMoss8404
07-14-2005, 03:49 AM
Not sure how you figure that.

Nate Burleson doesn't have CC's hands, Williamson doesn't have Moss' height, speed or leaping ability...

muchluv4smoot
07-14-2005, 04:14 AM
"RandyMoss8404" wrote:

Not sure how you figure that.

Nate Burleson doesn't have CC's hands, Williamson doesn't have Moss' height, speed or leaping ability...


Burleson does have good hands(yes he dropped a few easy balls last year, whoopdy doo), and even CC didn't have CC's hands at Burleson's age. Work is what it takes, and burleson has CC's work ethic also. Willaimson does have good size, speed, and leaping ability combo. Not moss', but if you read what I said, i said they are in similar molds, not EXACT molds.

ultravikingfan
07-14-2005, 04:17 AM
"magicci" wrote:

man sometimes when i think of it, we were so lucky two see those 2 receivers share the field together i mean man that freakin awesome if u think about it

It sure was great, wasn't it!

magicci
07-14-2005, 06:40 AM
"RandyMoss8404" wrote:

Not sure how you figure that.

Nate Burleson doesn't have CC's hands, Williamson doesn't have Moss' height, speed or leaping ability...
dude why are you such a pessimist?

RandyMoss8404
07-14-2005, 08:09 AM
"magicci" wrote:

"RandyMoss8404" wrote:

Not sure how you figure that.

Nate Burleson doesn't have CC's hands, Williamson doesn't have Moss' height, speed or leaping ability...
dude why are you such a realist?

Dunno, life has taught me lessons I guess?

magicci
07-14-2005, 08:49 AM
i learned about realist in my english class

DefensivePlaymaker
07-14-2005, 10:27 AM
"midgensa" wrote:

Ambrose is no stud, but he is a more than capable No. 2 CB, and the additions of Bell, Surtain and Knight make this defense ten times more formidable. DJ can only help and will be a stud in this league at some point if not the season ... I think the Chiefs could very well represent the AFC, they have made very similar moves to us ... hell Knight is better than Sharper and Surtain is better than Smoot and Bell is a better risk than Cowart (both are coming off injuries and such). I mean they did not have Williams or Winfield in place like us so we are a better overall D, but they did get a lot better.

I agree they did get alot better. I also think we should have drafted D.J. instead of Troy Williamson. I guess we will see though,hopefully I'm wrong. If I'm right though, I should be making personnel decisions for an NFL team....time will tell.

toemaster6
07-14-2005, 12:27 PM
Heres my take, I'll bring up again that burelson has got hands (proved that in college as well as the pros) and will only continue to improve his skills. T-will is a rookie and will have a rookie season (ups and downs). Travis Taylor was an excellent aquisition. Robinson no slouch. Now that C-pep can more evenly distribute the ball because he doesn't have to keep moss happy all should be more right in the receiving core. No more I play when I want to play but I'm gonna play every down because the ball could be coming my way. True there are many plays designed for one player in a given situation but all these guys should have a good year. Look who's throwing to them.