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Deepthreat89
06-25-2005, 02:09 AM
QB- Culpepper MIN
RB- Michael Bennett ( U wait and see) MIN
FB- William Henderson GB
Flanker- Roy Williams DET
Split End- Javon Walker GB
Tight End- Jim Kleinsasser MIN
Left Tackle- Chad Clifton GB
Left Guard- Ruben Brown CHI
Center- Olin Kreutz CHI
Right Guard- Damien Woody DET
Right Tackle- Mark Thauscher GB

Left End- Alex Brown CHI
Defensive Tackle- Kevin Williams MIN
Defensive Tackle- Shaun Rogers DET
Right End- Kabeer GbajaBiamilla GB
Weakside Linebacker- Lance Briggs CHI
Middle Linebacker- Urlacher ( will change when EJ starts) CHI
Strong Side Linebacker- Napoleon Harris MIN
Strong Side Corner- Antoine Winfield MIN
Weakside Corner- Fred Smoot MIN
Strong Safety- Mike Brown CHI
Free Safety- Darren Sharper MIN

Kicker- Ryan Longwell GB
Punter- Brad Maynard CHI

Kick Returner- Eddie Drummond/Jerry Azumah DET CHI
Punt Returner- RW Mcquarters DET

This is what I really think and I beleive Im being pretty realistic

MIN 8 GB 6 DET 5 CHI 8

Deepthreat89
06-25-2005, 02:24 AM
I also beleive we are the fastest team in the nfl.

GreenBaySlackers
06-25-2005, 02:33 AM
Very good list!!

only thing i can see that i would like to change would be bennet switch with K. Jones and Smoot with bly

Deepthreat89
06-25-2005, 02:41 AM
nah bly isnt as good as smoot. He gets beat on jump balls by bigger receivers, guesses too often and gives up a lot of plays.
And Michael Has more talent than Kevin. The only thing kevin is better than bennett is at breaking tackles because Kevin Jones is really muscular.
But once Michael has a crease in the open, no one will catch him.

akvikefan89
06-25-2005, 03:05 AM
"Deepthreat89" wrote:

QB- Culpepper MIN
RB- Michael Bennett ( U wait and see) MIN
FB- William Henderson GB
Flanker- Roy Williams DET
Split End- Javon Walker GB
Tight End- Jim Kleinsasser MIN
Left Tackle- Chad Clifton GB
Left Guard- Ruben Brown CHI
Center- Olin Kreutz CHI
Right Guard- Damien Woody DET
Right Tackle- Mark Thauscher GB

Left End- Alex Brown CHI
Defensive Tackle- Kevin Williams MIN
Defensive Tackle- Shaun Rogers DET
Right End- Kabeer GbajaBiamilla GB
Weakside Linebacker- Lance Briggs CHI
Middle Linebacker- Urlacher ( will change when EJ starts) CHI
Strong Side Linebacker- Napoleon Harris MIN
Strong Side Corner- Antoine Winfield MIN
Weakside Corner- Fred Smoot MIN
Strong Safety- Mike Brown CHI
Free Safety- Darren Sharper MIN

Kicker- Ryan Longwell GB
Punter- Brad Maynard CHI

Kick Returner- Eddie Drummond/Jerry Azumah DET CHI
Punt Returner- RW Mcquarters DET

This is what I really think and I beleive Im being pretty realistic

MIN 8 GB 6 DET 5 CHI 8

Switch and make Sause a Fb and put Wiggins at TE, he is phenominal. And why would EJ be better than Urlacher???

akvikefan89
06-25-2005, 03:06 AM
"akvikefan89" wrote:

"Deepthreat89" wrote:

QB- Culpepper MIN
RB- Michael Bennett ( U wait and see) MIN
FB- William Henderson GB
Flanker- Roy Williams DET
Split End- Javon Walker GB
Tight End- Jim Kleinsasser MIN
Left Tackle- Chad Clifton GB
Left Guard- Ruben Brown CHI
Center- Olin Kreutz CHI
Right Guard- Damien Woody DET
Right Tackle- Mark Thauscher GB

Left End- Alex Brown CHI
Defensive Tackle- Kevin Williams MIN
Defensive Tackle- Shaun Rogers DET
Right End- Kabeer GbajaBiamilla GB
Weakside Linebacker- Lance Briggs CHI
Middle Linebacker- Urlacher ( will change when EJ starts) CHI
Strong Side Linebacker- Napoleon Harris MIN
Strong Side Corner- Antoine Winfield MIN
Weakside Corner- Fred Smoot MIN
Strong Safety- Mike Brown CHI
Free Safety- Darren Sharper MIN

Kicker- Ryan Longwell GB
Punter- Brad Maynard CHI

Kick Returner- Eddie Drummond/Jerry Azumah DET CHI
Punt Returner- RW Mcquarters DET

This is what I really think and I beleive Im being pretty realistic

MIN 8 GB 6 DET 5 CHI 8

Switch and make Sause a Fb and put Wiggins at TE, he is phenominal. And why would EJ be better than Urlacher???

Also think that Minnesota has some O-line that deserves to be on there.

DarrinNelsonguy
06-25-2005, 03:09 AM
That is pretty reasonable.

vikingdude82
06-25-2005, 03:12 AM
Sorry man but Bly has more experence and better stats, as much as I like Smoot, Blys is a bit better.

Smoot's stats- http://www.nfl.com/players/playerpage/235244

Bly's stats- http://www.nfl.com/players/playerpage/133227

Smoot will be better in a few years though.

Deepthreat89
06-25-2005, 03:15 AM
yeah we could put in Wiggins and Mckinnie and Birk

Deepthreat89
06-25-2005, 03:18 AM
Dude I beleive EJ can be a VERY VERY GOOD PLAYER once he gets his head out of his ass. If you saw the rarely GOOD Plays he made last year, you would see why. He is alot stronger and Meaner than Urlacher, but once Cowart and Cotrell install some brains inside him, he'll be fine.

akvikefan89
06-25-2005, 03:28 AM
"Deepthreat89" wrote:

Dude I beleive EJ can be a VERY VERY GOOD PLAYER once he gets his head out of his jiggly butt. If you saw the rarely GOOD Plays he made last year, you would see why. He is alot stronger and Meaner than Urlacher, but once Cowart and Cotrell install some brains inside him, he'll be fine.
I agree henderson could be a great linebacker. But as good as Urlacher??? ask anyone who they would rather have. I agree that although not as good as Urlacher E.J. could be really good though. :grin:

vikingdude82
06-25-2005, 04:03 AM
I'd take the whole Vikes D-line

bryonfos
06-25-2005, 04:39 AM
Birk has to be on there, and I would rather have Ahman Green then Bennett any day. Although he is the only Packer I would take, maybe Longwell.

GreenBaySlackers
06-25-2005, 04:47 AM
"vikingdude82" wrote:

I'd take the whole Vikes D-line nah, shaun rogers and KGB are pretty fricken good

michaelmazid
06-25-2005, 09:22 AM
"Deepthreat89" wrote:

QB- Culpepper MIN
RB- Michael Bennett ( U wait and see) MIN
FB- William Henderson GB
Flanker- Roy Williams DET
Split End- Javon Walker GB
Tight End- Jim Kleinsasser MIN
Left Tackle- Chad Clifton GB
Left Guard- Ruben Brown CHI
Center- Olin Kreutz CHI
Right Guard- Damien Woody DET
Right Tackle- Mark Thauscher GB

Left End- Alex Brown CHI
Defensive Tackle- Kevin Williams MIN
Defensive Tackle- Shaun Rogers DET
Right End- Kabeer GbajaBiamilla GB
Weakside Linebacker- Lance Briggs CHI
Middle Linebacker- Urlacher ( will change when EJ starts) CHI
Strong Side Linebacker- Napoleon Harris MIN
Strong Side Corner- Antoine Winfield MIN
Weakside Corner- Fred Smoot MIN
Strong Safety- Mike Brown CHI
Free Safety- Darren Sharper MIN

Kicker- Ryan Longwell GB
Punter- Brad Maynard CHI

Kick Returner- Eddie Drummond/Jerry Azumah DET CHI
Punt Returner- RW Mcquarters DET

This is what I really think and I beleive Im being pretty realistic

MIN 8 GB 6 DET 5 CHI 8

I am a huge viking fan but Michael Bennet couldn't hold Ahman Green's jock on his best day.

UTVikfan
06-25-2005, 10:20 AM
Of course Bennett couldn't hold A. Green's jock, he would automatically fumble it for some strange reason.

RandyMoss8404
06-25-2005, 03:54 PM
"Deepthreat89" wrote:

QB- Culpepper MIN
RB- Ahman Green, GB (Runner up: Mewelde Moore, MIN)
FB- William Henderson GB
Flanker- Roy Williams DET
Split End- Javon Walker GB
Tight End- Jermaine Wiggins MIN
Left Tackle- Bryant McKinnie Min
Left Guard- Ruben Brown CHI
Center- Olin Kreutz (Matt Birk?)CHI
Right Guard- Damien Woody DET
Right Tackle- Mark Thauscher GB

Left End- Alex Brown CHI
Defensive Tackle- Kevin Williams MIN
Defensive Tackle- Shaun Rogers DET
Right End- Kabeer GbajaBiamilla GB
Weakside Linebacker- Lance Briggs CHI
Middle Linebacker - Sam Cowart, MIN
Strong Side Linebacker- Forgot GB's SS linebacker, but he's good - GB
Strong Side Corner- Antoine Winfield MIN
Weakside Corner- Nathan Vasher CHI
Strong Safety- Mike Brown CHI
Free Safety- Darren Sharper MIN

Kicker- Ryan Longwell GB
Punter- Brad Maynard CHI

Kick Returner- Eddie Drummond/Jerry Azumah DET CHI
Punt Returner- RW Mcquarters DET

Deepthreat89
06-25-2005, 04:20 PM
Ahman is very overrated. He had the best offensive line to help him run and bennett is more explosive in the open field with possibly one of the worst offensive lines last year.

RandyMoss8404
06-25-2005, 04:38 PM
Uhm

Michael Bennett is a joke, because he can't find the open field.

Ahman is not overrated. He's a darn good back. Because though the offensive line yes, does create holes for him, he FINDS THEM, unlike Michael Bennett

We have the third or fourth best offensive line in this league out of 32 teams

GreenBaySlackers
06-25-2005, 04:41 PM
"RandyMoss8404" wrote:

QB- Culpepper MIN
RB- Ahman Green, GB (Runner up: Mewelde Moore, MIN)
FB- William Henderson GB
Flanker- Roy Williams DET
Split End- Javon Walker GB
Tight End- Jermaine Wiggins MIN
Left Tackle- Bryant McKinnie Min
Left Guard- Ruben Brown CHI
Center- Olin Kreutz (Matt Birk?)CHI
Right Guard- Damien Woody DET
Right Tackle- Mark Thauscher GB

Left End- Alex Brown CHI
Defensive Tackle- Kevin Williams MIN
Defensive Tackle- Shaun Rogers DET
Right End- Kabeer GbajaBiamilla GB
Weakside Linebacker- Lance Briggs CHI
Middle Linebacker - Sam Cowart, MIN
Strong Side Linebacker- Forgot GB's SS linebacker, but he's good - GB
Strong Side Corner- Antoine Winfield MIN
Weakside Corner- Nathan Vasher CHI
Strong Safety- Mike Brown CHI
Free Safety- Darren Sharper MIN

Kicker- Ryan Longwell GB
Punter- Brad Maynard CHI

Kick Returner- Eddie Drummond/Jerry Azumah DET CHI
Punt Returner- RW Mcquarters DET



Dre Bly really needs to be on this list, and URlacher is still one of the best MLBs in the game regardless of injurys, RB runner up would also have to be K. Jones

SamDawg84
06-25-2005, 05:26 PM
the line backer for green bay u guys forgot about is diggs

LosAngelis
06-25-2005, 06:01 PM
Great topic. I'm going to pass on it for right now, because theres too much flux right now for me to really make a statement...nothing I want to get into defending and debating.

For example, we could say guys like Darren Sharper and Fred Smoot are on the list, but we haven't seen them play yet. When Joe Johnson came to GB, we thought we had the best DT in the division, too, based on his play somewhere else. But, he didn't get it up to his old level of play.

I still think AHman is the best in the division at his position. After that, the only Packers I would really try to make a case for are Flanagan, Clifton, Walker, Barnett, Harris, and Longwell. I would give QB to Culpepper.

RandyMoss8404
06-25-2005, 06:15 PM
Harris as in Al Harris?

Not better than Antoine. But 2nd best? Probably.

LosAngelis
06-25-2005, 06:20 PM
Like I said, I'd make a case for them. I actually haven't looked at the other teams well enough to make a judgement.

RandyMoss8404
06-25-2005, 06:58 PM
(If you've read previous threads) I make a very strong case for Al Harris being a top 2 corner in the NFC North, based on his numbers and shutting down RMoss on Christmas Eve.

michaelmazid
06-25-2005, 07:12 PM
"Deepthreat89" wrote:

Ahman is very overrated. He had the best offensive line to help him run and bennett is more explosive in the open field with possibly one of the worst offensive lines last year.

We didn't have one of the worst O lines in the league last year. I wouldn't even consider M. Bennet in the top 20 running backs in the league. Helll, he is not even in the top 3 running backs on our team. M.Moore and Fiason will be the 1 and 2 punch by the end of this year.

vikingdude82
06-25-2005, 08:02 PM
"GreenBaySlackers" wrote:

"vikingdude82" wrote:

I'd take the whole Vikes D-line nah, shaun rogers and KGB are pretty fricken good

So your saying Shaun Rogers is better than Kevin Williams? or Pat Williams?

Udezes had a awesome rookie season, using pretty much one arm, think what he could do 100% healthy?? He might have been Defense rookie of the year.

Just give are young players time, thats all I gotta say.

bryonfos
06-25-2005, 10:02 PM
Udeze was below average last year. He couldn't get around the corner, couldn't contain, and couldn't fight through blocks. That is why he wasn't starting or finishing games later in the season. Pat Williams, though good, is not on that list. He is a one dimensional player, unlike Kevin Williams who is the complete package.

canadian_vikes_fan
06-25-2005, 10:11 PM
I don't think Pat Williams should be on that list - he's more of a role player - he for sure will not play every down, so I can't see him being the 2nd best DT in the division.

bryonfos
06-25-2005, 10:17 PM
QB C-Pep
RB Ahman-GB
FB Jimmy K
TE Wiggins
LT McKinnie
LG Rueben Brown-Chi
C Birk
RG Damien Woody-Det
RT John Tait-Chi
WR Walker-GB
WR Muhammad-Chi

LE Ogunleye-Chi
DT K Will
NT Wilkenson-Det
RE KGB-GB
LOLB Diggs-GB
MLB Urlacher-Chi
ROLB Bailey-Det
CB Winfield
CB Bly-Det
SS Chavous
FS Brown-Chi

PK Longwell-GB
P Maynard-Chi

KR Drummand-Det
PR RW McQuarters-Chi

vegasvike
06-25-2005, 11:01 PM
"UTVikfan" wrote:

Of course Bennett couldn't hold A. Green's jock, he would automatically fumble it for some strange reason.

haha that's right..... and Green has never had a problem with fumbles right? :roll:

GreenBaySlackers
06-25-2005, 11:11 PM
"vikingdude82" wrote:

"GreenBaySlackers" wrote:

"vikingdude82" wrote:

I'd take the whole Vikes D-line nah, shaun rogers and KGB are pretty fricken good

So your saying Shaun Rogers is better than Kevin Williams? or Pat Williams?

Udezes had a awesome rookie season, using pretty much one arm, think what he could do 100% healthy?? He might have been Defense rookie of the year.

Just give are young players time, thats all I gotta say.

Yup, shaun rogers is better than pat williams

Deepthreat89
06-26-2005, 05:14 AM
los angelis harris and flanigan dont deserve to be on the list.

And Ahman Green can be holding Michael Bennetts jock strap because that is what he will be doing next year.

Deepthreat89
06-26-2005, 05:15 AM
Dont be chaning my list. Bennet and Smoot are both here for a reason. and Napoleon Harris is better than Nail Diggs hands down

V4L
06-26-2005, 05:25 AM
QB- Daunte
RB- K Jones
FB- Kleinny
TE- Pollard
WR- Roy Williams, J-Walk, Burleson
LOT- McKinnie
LG- Brown
C- Birk
RG-Woody
RT- Tausher

RE- KGB
DT-K-will, Shaun
LE- Ogunleye
WLB- Briggs
MLB- Urlacher
SLB- Napo
CB- Winny, Bly
SS- Brown
FS- Sharper

K- Longwell
P- Maynard

RandyMoss8404
06-26-2005, 07:05 AM
"Deepthreat89" wrote:

Dont be chaning my list. Bennet and Smoot are both here for a reason. and Napoleon Harris is better than Nail Diggs hands down

You know - I'm just guessing - but I'm getting the impression that you might be a tool.

Please give details as to why Bennett is better than Ahman, Smoot is better than Al Harris/Charles Tillman, and why Napoleon Harris is better than Nail Diggs.

(Facts, not opinions)

magicci
06-26-2005, 07:26 AM
thats what this site is based on is opinions

vikingdude82
06-26-2005, 10:06 AM
QB- Culpepper-MIN
RB- MeMo-MIN
FB- Kleinsassar-MIN
TE- Wiggins-MIN
WR- Burleson-MIN Taylor-MIN Walker-GB
LOT- McKinnie-MIN
LG- Brown-CHI
C- Birk-MIN
RG- Johnson-MIN
RT- Tausher-GB

RE- KGB-GB
DT- K. Williams-MIN
DT- P. Williams-MIN
LE- Kampman-GB
WLB- Henderson-MIN
MLB- Urlacher-CHI
SLB- Harris-MIN
CB- Smoot-MIN
CB- Winfield-MIN
SS- Brown-CHI
FS- Sharper-MIN

K- Hanson-DET
P- Maynard-CHI

Deepthreat89
06-26-2005, 04:21 PM
Yeah I Guess you can have ur own opinions. But i can explain why Smoot is better than Harris and Tillman. Its simple, if you watched the redskins play last year, you could see the great coverage put on by Smoot and its better than Tillmans coverage. Al is good but not great. Napoleon is alot more athletic and more of a pass rusher than Diggs. If you saw his rookie year and his years at Northwestern (Im a Chicago Native Baby) you'll see what I mean about how good he can be. As for Michael Bennet, no one is more dangerous than him in the league on screen passes, and once he has an open hole(hopefully hell be better at finding it alot this year) he is gone. He is second to none in both categories.

Deepthreat89
06-26-2005, 04:24 PM
Guys, as much as you like Nate, he isnt as good as Javon Walker or Roy WIlliams and isnt even close to being the most athletic receiver in the division. I still expect him to gert a sold 90 catches for about 1,000 yards, but I beleive that Travis Taylor is our most talented receiver unless Marcus proves he can play to the elite level he did in 1999 with the bears. Taylor is big, strong, and fast and has a good vertical. I can see him getting about 80 catches for 1,300 yards and about 8 touchdown passes.

vikingdude82
06-26-2005, 06:52 PM
"Deepthreat89" wrote:

Yeah I Guess you can have ur own opinions. But i can explain why Smoot is better than Harris and Tillman. Its simple, if you watched the redskins play last year, you could see the great coverage put on by Smoot and its better than Tillmans coverage. Al is good but not great. Napoleon is alot more athletic and more of a pass rusher than Diggs. If you saw his rookie year and his years at Northwestern (Im a Chicago Native Baby) you'll see what I mean about how good he can be. As for Michael Bennet, no one is more dangerous than him in the league on screen passes, and once he has an open hole(hopefully hell be better at finding it alot this year) he is gone. He is second to none in both categories.

Smoot is better than Harris because he doesn't get burn on every other play, like Harris.

Natedogg
06-26-2005, 07:49 PM
"vikingdude82" wrote:

Sorry man but Bly has more experence and better stats, as much as I like Smoot, Blys is a bit better.

Smoot's stats- http://www.nfl.com/players/playerpage/235244

Bly's stats- http://www.nfl.com/players/playerpage/133227

Smoot will be better in a few years though.


Bly's stats are only better because he's been in the league two years longer. Bly's tackles are not up to Smoots, and Bly isnt as consistent either.

audioghost
06-26-2005, 08:18 PM
"Vikez4Lyfe" wrote:

QB- Daunte
RB- K Jones
FB- Kleinny
TE- Pollard
WR- Roy Williams, J-Walk, Burleson
LOT- McKinnie
LG- Brown
C- Birk
RG-Woody
RT- Tausher

RE- KGB
DT-K-will, Shaun
LE- Ogunleye
WLB- Briggs
MLB- Urlacher
SLB- Napo
CB- Winny, Bly
SS- Brown
FS- Sharper

K- Longwell
P- Maynard

Perfecto! Oh, one change....Ahman Green at RB, I hate him, but I can't deny that he is the best RB in the division...

vikingdude82
06-26-2005, 09:47 PM
"Natedogg" wrote:

"vikingdude82" wrote:

Sorry man but Bly has more experence and better stats, as much as I like Smoot, Blys is a bit better.

Smoot's stats- http://www.nfl.com/players/playerpage/235244

Bly's stats- http://www.nfl.com/players/playerpage/133227

Smoot will be better in a few years though.


Bly's stats are only better because he's been in the league two years longer. Bly's tackles are not up to Smoots, and Bly isnt as consistent either.

Read what I said, and because he has more experence he'll have better stats, and read the tackles, Bly has 222 and Smoot has 182. I believe 222 is greater than 182.

V4L
06-26-2005, 11:41 PM
"audioghost" wrote:

"Vikez4Lyfe" wrote:

QB- Daunte
RB- K Jones
FB- Kleinny
TE- Pollard
WR- Roy Williams, J-Walk, Burleson
LOT- McKinnie
LG- Brown
C- Birk
RG-Woody
RT- Tausher

RE- KGB
DT-K-will, Shaun
LE- Ogunleye
WLB- Briggs
MLB- Urlacher
SLB- Napo
CB- Winny, Bly
SS- Brown
FS- Sharper

K- Longwell
P- Maynard

Perfecto! Oh, one change....Ahman Green at RB, I hate him, but I can't deny that he is the best RB in the division...


thanks.. Yah that was the one that got me the most.. I couldn't decide.. Jones had the best second half of the year of any back.. But Ahman has just been a beast.. So yah another opinion for Ahman I guess it would be Ahman

RandyMoss8404
06-27-2005, 03:42 AM
"vikingdude82" wrote:

"Deepthreat89" wrote:

Yeah I Guess you can have ur own opinions. But i can explain why Smoot is better than Harris and Tillman. Its simple, if you watched the redskins play last year, you could see the great coverage put on by Smoot and its better than Tillmans coverage. Al is good but not great. Napoleon is alot more athletic and more of a pass rusher than Diggs. If you saw his rookie year and his years at Northwestern (Im a Chicago Native Baby) you'll see what I mean about how good he can be. As for Michael Bennet, no one is more dangerous than him in the league on screen passes, and once he has an open hole(hopefully hell be better at finding it alot this year) he is gone. He is second to none in both categories.

Smoot is better than Harris because he doesn't get burn on every other play, like Harris.

You're both wrong, and here are the facts.

Fred Smoot:
2004 Washington Redskins 15 59 53.0 6 0 3 17 5.7 17 0 10

Al Harris:
2004 Green Bay Packers 16 62 56.0 6 0 1 29 29.0 29 0 19

Lets look at these numbers objectively. Fred Smoot had 3 picks - of which none were returned for touchdowns. Al Harris had 1, which sealed a game vs. Washington.

Al Harris got his hands on a total of 20 balls, shut Randy Moss down on Christmas eve, and generally locked down his side of the field. He also tackled solidly.

Fred Smoot did uh..uhm...uh...wait..uhm..yeah. He had a performance against the Bears that I'll remember because he played with a hurt shoulder, but he's a body tackler, and doesn't wrap up like Al Harris does. Also, espn.com (http://sports.espn.go.com/nfl/draft05/columns/story?columnist=clayton_john&id=2037937) says that "Fred Smoot of the Redskins [was] among the 12 most burned defenders in pro football." Why? Because Fred Smoot goes for the pick instead of batting the ball down like Al Harris. He gets challenged because quarterbacks know he'll bite on the pump and is overly aggressive.

And that's why Harris is a better corner.

Deepthreat89
06-27-2005, 05:49 AM
Harris shut down a very weak moss, in which infact looked like he wasnt even trying the whole game, but in the wildcard game, Harris looked like an f ing retard covering Moss because he couldnt cover him even with a grandma like limping ankle. Smoot on the other hand is alot faster and can be more of an impact at 25 than Al Harris at 31. Besides, if you heard the offseason news, the only thing Al Harris is aggressive at is trying to assault exotic dancers.

Dont get me wrong, Smoot gets burned alot, but he definitely comes back and makes up for it. If you say that taking chances and getting burned make a corner not as good as others, than you are saying Champ Bailey, Charles Woodson and DeAngelo Hall arent good players. All three of these guys have an advantage over Harris.

Mr. Purple
06-27-2005, 05:59 AM
ok lets stop dissin our defense, fu(k the numbers....FRED SMOOT FOR PRESIDENT!

Mr. Purple
06-27-2005, 06:03 AM
Fred smoot may not rack up the bill gates numbers, but i'll be damned if anyone will rate a packer defender over him!!!!! IMO hes the best CB in the nfl, now call me crazy cuz IDC but i have confidence in my team, and I beleive we are the best, I except no other attitudes! now someone will respond and tell me theres a differnce between confidence and reality...but i dont give a what! VIKES NUMBER 1 DEFENSE! hands down good nite

RandyMoss8404
06-27-2005, 06:06 AM
"Deepthreat89" wrote:

Harris shut down a very weak moss, in which infact looked like he wasnt even trying the whole game, but in the wildcard game, Harris looked like an f ing retard covering Moss because he couldnt cover him even with a grandma like limping ankle. Smoot on the other hand is alot faster and can be more of an impact at 25 than Al Harris at 31. Besides, if you heard the offseason news, the only thing Al Harris is aggressive at is trying to assault exotic dancers.

Dont get me wrong, Smoot gets burned alot, but he definitely comes back and makes up for it. If you say that taking chances and getting burned make a corner not as good as others, than you are saying Champ Bailey, Charles Woodson and DeAngelo Hall arent good players. All three of these guys have an advantage over Harris.

This thread isn't about the NFL, it's about the NFC North.

Also, Randy Moss is still Randy Moss. Shutting him down once is still a feat. You didn't answer any of the points in my argument, either.

edit: I've also said I personally judge true shutdown corners by how often they get burned. Want to know who makes my list?

Antoine Winfield
Asante Samuel
Al Harris

Why? No, they're not going to make the acrobatic one finger interception. And no, you won't hear their names on ESPN. Why? Because they're not flashy. They blanket their man and bat the ball down.

edit: Wow Will, your 'devotion' is cute, but I'd watch that word accept :P

Mr. Purple
06-27-2005, 06:35 AM
except accept same thing in my book

akvikefan89
06-27-2005, 06:36 AM
"WilliamsonOfTroy" wrote:

except accept same thing in my book
dito

RandyMoss8404
06-27-2005, 06:49 AM
"WilliamsonOfTroy" wrote:

except accept same thing in my book

I wasn't correcting your grammar bro, you missed my point ;)

vikingdude82
06-27-2005, 06:50 AM
Al Harris and Fred Smoot are in the NFC North, and also the NFC North is in the NFL, if you don't want us talking about the NFL how would we be talking about this??

RandyMoss8404
06-27-2005, 02:51 PM
"vikingdude82" wrote:

Al Harris and Fred Smoot are in the NFC North, and also the NFC North is in the NFL, if you don't want us talking about the NFL how would we be talking about this??

Sigh. That's obviously not what I meant. What anyone but someone trying ot argue the pettiest of points would have taken from that would be 'not the entire NFL.' But I'll choose my words more carefully

Del Rio
06-27-2005, 03:09 PM
"RandyMoss8404" wrote:

"vikingdude82" wrote:

"Deepthreat89" wrote:

Yeah I Guess you can have ur own opinions. But i can explain why Smoot is better than Harris and Tillman. Its simple, if you watched the redskins play last year, you could see the great coverage put on by Smoot and its better than Tillmans coverage. Al is good but not great. Napoleon is alot more athletic and more of a pass rusher than Diggs. If you saw his rookie year and his years at Northwestern (Im a Chicago Native Baby) you'll see what I mean about how good he can be. As for Michael Bennet, no one is more dangerous than him in the league on screen passes, and once he has an open hole(hopefully hell be better at finding it alot this year) he is gone. He is second to none in both categories.

Smoot is better than Harris because he doesn't get burn on every other play, like Harris.

You're both wrong, and here are the facts.

Fred Smoot:
2004 Washington Redskins 15 59 53.0 6 0 3 17 5.7 17 0 10

Al Harris:
2004 Green Bay Packers 16 62 56.0 6 0 1 29 29.0 29 0 19

Lets look at these numbers objectively. Fred Smoot had 3 picks - of which none were returned for touchdowns. Al Harris had 1, which sealed a game vs. Washington.

Al Harris got his hands on a total of 20 balls, shut Randy Moss down on Christmas eve, and generally locked down his side of the field. He also tackled solidly.

Fred Smoot did uh..uhm...uh...wait..uhm..yeah. He had a performance against the Bears that I'll remember because he played with a hurt shoulder, but he's a body tackler, and doesn't wrap up like Al Harris does. Also, espn.com (http://sports.espn.go.com/nfl/draft05/columns/story?columnist=clayton_john&id=2037937) says that "Fred Smoot of the Redskins [was] among the 12 most burned defenders in pro football." Why? Because Fred Smoot goes for the pick instead of batting the ball down like Al Harris. He gets challenged because quarterbacks know he'll bite on the pump and is overly aggressive.

And that's why Harris is a better corner.

Why not go back a few years? 2001-2004 then compare the stats? Because Harris next to Smoot from 2001-2004 isn't impressive at all. I think you are calling for facts but your foundation for claiming Harris to be better is based on your opinion because you watched him shut Moss down a few plays.

The only thing I think Harris has going for him is he never missess a game. As far as his tackles and interceptions go he doesn't hold a candle to Smoot. What's even more sad is Smoot has missed a few games and his stats are still better. That's about 60 plays difference for each game.

I don't put much stock into the list at all. Urlacher should be on there, Pat Williams should definately not be, I would take Shaun Rodgers over any Dl besides K-Will. Bennett shouldn't be on there. But if your just listing your favorite players then what's the point of discussing it.

JDogg926
06-27-2005, 04:17 PM
If you guys are talking about one game wonders (i.e. Al Harris shutting down Moss), do you remember Scottie Graham. One week he's filling prescriptions in a pharmacy, the next he's rushing for 100 yds on MNF. Could you say he was better than say...Ernest Byner (just trying to think of someone who was good during that time, that wasn't an obvious hall-of-famer)

That's similar to using Al Harris's one great game to compare him to Smoot.

Deepthreat89
06-27-2005, 05:15 PM
It doesnt matter what happened last year.

All that matters is that we are gonna be atleast 15 spots better on defense.

Smoot will play to a supreme level and he will already be crowned the number 2 corner in the north, about number 10 in the league.

And as for Urlacher, EJ Henderson, The EJ Henderson I know, from the Maryland Terps will overcome ignorance and make the name Urlacher forgotten.

Del Rio
06-27-2005, 05:22 PM
Urlacher was better then EJ in college to lol.

Who cares though it's your list, and you will never see that on a football field as the same team anyway.


http://img.photobucket.com/albums/v311/beaver-believer6/fabulous.jpg

Lotza
06-27-2005, 07:12 PM
ej = sucking

Deepthreat89
06-27-2005, 07:27 PM
EJ was better than Brian in College. Was Urlacher a Dick Butkus award winner? Urlacher was never an intimidating "mike" middle linebacker. Just a sissy who ran around the blocks to make the tackle. U watch and see because EJ will be the best mlb in the north next year.

RandyMoss8404
06-27-2005, 10:53 PM
"Del Rio" wrote:

"RandyMoss8404" wrote:

"vikingdude82" wrote:

"Deepthreat89" wrote:

Yeah I Guess you can have ur own opinions. But i can explain why Smoot is better than Harris and Tillman. Its simple, if you watched the redskins play last year, you could see the great coverage put on by Smoot and its better than Tillmans coverage. Al is good but not great. Napoleon is alot more athletic and more of a pass rusher than Diggs. If you saw his rookie year and his years at Northwestern (Im a Chicago Native Baby) you'll see what I mean about how good he can be. As for Michael Bennet, no one is more dangerous than him in the league on screen passes, and once he has an open hole(hopefully hell be better at finding it alot this year) he is gone. He is second to none in both categories.

Smoot is better than Harris because he doesn't get burn on every other play, like Harris.

You're both wrong, and here are the facts.

Fred Smoot:
2004 Washington Redskins 15 59 53.0 6 0 3 17 5.7 17 0 10

Al Harris:
2004 Green Bay Packers 16 62 56.0 6 0 1 29 29.0 29 0 19

Lets look at these numbers objectively. Fred Smoot had 3 picks - of which none were returned for touchdowns. Al Harris had 1, which sealed a game vs. Washington.

Al Harris got his hands on a total of 20 balls, shut Randy Moss down on Christmas eve, and generally locked down his side of the field. He also tackled solidly.

Fred Smoot did uh..uhm...uh...wait..uhm..yeah. He had a performance against the Bears that I'll remember because he played with a hurt shoulder, but he's a body tackler, and doesn't wrap up like Al Harris does. Also, espn.com (http://sports.espn.go.com/nfl/draft05/columns/story?columnist=clayton_john&id=2037937) says that "Fred Smoot of the Redskins [was] among the 12 most burned defenders in pro football." Why? Because Fred Smoot goes for the pick instead of batting the ball down like Al Harris. He gets challenged because quarterbacks know he'll bite on the pump and is overly aggressive.

And that's why Harris is a better corner.

Why not go back a few years? 2001-2004 then compare the stats? Because Harris next to Smoot from 2001-2004 isn't impressive at all. I think you are calling for facts but your foundation for claiming Harris to be better is based on your opinion because you watched him shut Moss down a few plays.

The only thing I think Harris has going for him is he never missess a game. As far as his tackles and interceptions go he doesn't hold a candle to Smoot. What's even more sad is Smoot has missed a few games and his stats are still better. That's about 60 plays difference for each game.

I don't put much stock into the list at all. Urlacher should be on there, Pat Williams should definately not be, I would take Shaun Rodgers over any Dl besides K-Will. Bennett shouldn't be on there. But if your just listing your favorite players then what's the point of discussing it.

The foundation of my claim for Al Harris being better is not shutting down Moss, that's just a highlight. It's that only two receivers torched him all year - Jimmy Smith (a perennial pro bowler) and TO (need I say more?).

And note that Smoot was always a co no1 corner - Al Harris was the firm #2 for years.

And for God's sake, Winfield has less interceptions than Smoot and Harris. You're telling me both (or heck, that even ONE) is a better corner?

Del Rio
06-27-2005, 10:55 PM
"Al Harris got his hands on a total of 20 balls"


That right there is enough to keep him off my list lol.

akvikefan89
06-27-2005, 10:56 PM
No matter how many numbers people throw my way I will never believe that Al Harris is a better corner than Smoot. Also, comparing last years numbers isn't a fair way to decide who's better because Smoot was injured last year and missed some games.

canadian_vikes_fan
06-27-2005, 10:59 PM
"Deepthreat89" wrote:

EJ was better than Brian in College. Was Urlacher a Dick Butkus award winner? Urlacher was never an intimidating "mike" middle linebacker. Just a sissy who ran around the blocks to make the tackle. U watch and see because EJ will be the best mlb in the north next year.

Just cuz EJ was better in college doesn't mean he's a better player. I mean, Akili Smith did better than Daunte in college, but I think the Bengals wish they saw something in Pep. Lots of players that are good in college can't make the adjustment to the pros. I'm not willing to write off EJ just yet, but he hasn't really shown me much yet to make me believe that he's gonna be the best mlb in the NFC North. Apparently he hasn't impressed the coaches much either, cuz otherwise we wouldn't have demoted him. I'm still hopin EJ turns out alright and I like his attitude, but I think that EJ being the best mlb is a REALLY big strech. I'd be surprised if he was the best mlb on the team at the end of the year.

Del Rio
06-27-2005, 11:01 PM
I personally think EJ is going to do some great things for us this year, I also think it wont be at middle line backer. I am just waiting to see if Cottrell has the balls to make the move.

But I know that he is not even comparable to Urlacher.....no way no how.

ultravikingfan
06-27-2005, 11:42 PM
How many people here knew much about Smoot before he was a Vike, really?

I'll admit that I did not know much about him and had to resort to stats and other members.

I did not make it a point to watch the skins play.

JWalkRulz84
06-28-2005, 12:32 AM
QB - Daunte Culpepper MIN
RB - Ahman Green GB
FB - William Henderson GB
WR - Javon Walker GB
TE - Jermaine Wiggins MIN
LT - Chad Clifton GB
LG - Reuben Brown CHI
C - Matt Birk MIN
RG - Damien Woody DET
RT - Mark Tauscher GB

LE - Adewale Ogunleye CHI
DT - Kevin Williams MIN
DT - Shaun Rogers DET
RE - Kabeer Gbaja Biamilla GB
WLB - Lance Briggs CHI
MLB - Brian Urlacher CHI
SLB - Na'il Diggs GB
CB - Antoine Winfield MIN
CB - Dre Bly DET
FS - Corey Chavous MIN
SS - Mike Brown CHI

Vikes - 6
Pack - 7
Lions - 3
Bears - 5

By no means is this a measure of who the best team in the division is.

canadian_vikes_fan
06-28-2005, 12:37 AM
"ultravikingfan" wrote:

How many people here knew much about Smoot before he was a Vike, really?

I'll admit that I did not know much about him and had to resort to stats and other members.

I did not make it a point to watch the skins play.

Actually, one of my buddies at school is a huge Redskins fan, and every week I heard a lot about how great Fred Smoot had played - he was my friend's favourite (that's right with a u) player. Although I didn't really watch many of the games, everything my friend told me about Smoot was always positive - he gambles a lot, and usually wins, but sometimes he gets burned. I'll take him any day - when free agency opened, he was the #1 corner I wanted the Vikes to get - IMO ahead of Law, Rolle, or anyone else.

RandyMoss8404
06-28-2005, 01:39 AM
"Del Rio" wrote:

"Al Harris got his hands on a total of 20 balls"


That right there is enough to keep him off my list lol.

Haha, ok, I'll give ya that one

You homophobic cowboy :-P

vikingdude82
06-28-2005, 01:47 AM
"ultravikingfan" wrote:

How many people here knew much about Smoot before he was a Vike, really?

I'll admit that I did not know much about him and had to resort to stats and other members.

I did not make it a point to watch the skins play.

I actually watched a few games with him, the main one was in his rookie season or 2nd year, a monday night game agaisnt Denver when he got a couple picks,

RandyMoss8404
06-28-2005, 02:01 AM
Man JWalk I love you

But I hope Teddy has Antoine shadow Javon Walker all game next time so you'll get off his jock, hehe

Deepthreat89
06-28-2005, 04:58 AM
Jwalker, i would think that over if i was you.

Kleinsasser better than Henderson.
John Tait is better than Mark Thauscher
Nail Diggs better than Boss Bailey and Napoleon Harris? LMFAO

Ahman is on the top for now but we'll see whose the best. (Benett)
Ill also give you kabeer and Javon Walker.

Chad Clfton= inbred hick nobody- I'd take Fred Miller and Mckinnie has more promise

RandyMoss8404
06-28-2005, 05:14 AM
"Deepthreat89" wrote:

Jwalker, i would think that over if i was you.

Kleinsasser better than Henderson.
John Tait is better than Mark Thauscher
Nail Diggs better than Boss Bailey and Napoleon Harris? LMFAO

Ahman is on the top for now but we'll see whose the best. (Benett)
Ill also give you kabeer and Javon Walker.

Chad Clfton= inbred hick nobody- I'd take Fred Miller and Mckinnie has more promise

You are absolutely ridiculous man...

Deepthreat89
06-28-2005, 05:15 AM
how am i ridiculous. I just felt like packer bashing.

No harm done.

Deepthreat89
06-28-2005, 05:16 AM
what part of chicago are u from RandyMoss8404

and what high school did u go to/currently attend?

RandyMoss8404
06-28-2005, 05:16 AM
I'm from the western suburbs

I went to Saint Joseph High School

Deepthreat89
06-28-2005, 05:19 AM
what suburb downers grove?

Deepthreat89
06-28-2005, 05:21 AM
hey where is los?

purplepat
07-05-2005, 05:36 PM
QB- Daunte Culpepper MIN
RB- Ahman Green GB
FB- William Henderson GB
Flanker- Nate Burleson MIN
Split End- Javon Walker GB
Tight End- Bubba Franks GB
Left Tackle- Chad Clifton GB
Left Guard- Ruben Brown CHI
Center- Olin Kreutz CHI
Right Guard- Damien Woody DET
Right Tackle- Mark Tauscher GB

Left End- Adewale Ogunleye CHI
Defensive Tackle- Kevin Williams MIN
Defensive Tackle- Shaun Rogers DET
Right End- Kabeer Gbaja-Biamilla GB
Weakside Linebacker- Lance Briggs CHI
Middle Linebacker- Brian Urlacher CHI
Strong Side Linebacker- Teddy Lehman DET
Strong Side Corner- Antoine Winfield MIN
Weakside Corner- Dre Bly DET
Strong Safety- Mike Green CHI
Free Safety- Darren Sharper MIN

Kicker- Ryan Longwell GB
Punter- Brad Maynard CHI

Kick Returner- Eddie Drummond DET
Punt Returner- Eddie Drummond DET

This is all strictly my opinion, many of the positions are very, very close. I may not have all the positions exactly right (NFL.com lists Briggs and Lehman at the same LB spot, for instance).

cajunvike
07-05-2005, 05:46 PM
"purplepat" wrote:

QB- Culpepper MIN
RB- Ahman Green GB
FB- William Henderson GB
Flanker- Nate Burleson MIN
Split End- Javon Walker GB
Tight End- Bubba Franks GB
Left Tackle- Chad Clifton GB
Left Guard- Ruben Brown CHI
Center- Olin Kreutz CHI
Right Guard- Damien Woody DET
Right Tackle- Mark Tauscher GB

Left End- Adewale Oguleye CHI
Defensive Tackle- Kevin Williams MIN
Defensive Tackle- Shaun Rogers DET
Right End- Kabeer Gbaja-Biamilla GB
Weakside Linebacker- Lance Briggs CHI
Middle Linebacker- Brian Urlacher CHI
Strong Side Linebacker- Teddy Lehman DET
Strong Side Corner- Antoine Winfield MIN
Weakside Corner- Dre Bly DET
Strong Safety- Mike Green CHI
Free Safety- Darren Sharper MIN

Kicker- Ryan Longwell GB
Punter- Brad Maynard CHI

Kick Returner- Eddie Drummond DET
Punt Returner- Eddie Drummond DET

This is all strictly my opinion, many of the positions are very, very close. I may not have all the positions exactly right (NFL.com lists Briggs and Lehman at the same LB spot, for instance).

Kleinsasser will be better than Henderson this year!!!

cajunvike
07-05-2005, 05:47 PM
Or Franks for that matter!

i_bleed_purple
07-05-2005, 06:02 PM
QB- Culpepper MIN
RB- this ones close between green GB and bennett MIN
FB- (Kleinsasser if he's used as a FB but if not then) William Henderson GB
Flanker- Mushin Muhammid CHI
Split End- Travis Taylor (i have seen good things in training camps) MIN
Tight End- Jim Kleinsasser MIN
Left Tackle- Chad Clifton GB
Left Guard- Ruben Brown CHI
Center- Matt BIrk MIN
Right Guard- Damien Woody DET
Right Tackle- Mark Thauscher GB

Left End- Alex Brown CHI
Defensive Tackle- Kevin Williams MIN
Defensive Tackle- Pat Williams MIN
Right End- Kabeer Gbaja Biamilla GB
Weakside Linebacker- Lance Briggs CHI
Middle Linebacker- EJ Henderson MIN
Strong Side Linebacker- Napoleon Harris MIN
Strong Side Corner- Antoine Winfield MIN
Weakside Corner- Fred Smoot MIN
Strong Safety- Mike Brown CHI
Free Safety- Darren Sharper MIN

Kicker- Ryan Longwell GB
Punter- Brad Maynard CHI

Kick Returner- whoever that really good guy from DET was who got 2 td's for each type of return who also got injured (forgot his name) DET
Punt Returner- RW Mcquarters DET


MIN 11.5 GB 5.5 DET 5 CHI 3

i_bleed_purple
07-05-2005, 06:05 PM
QB- Culpepper MIN
RB- this ones close between green GB and bennett MIN
FB- (Kleinsasser if he's used as a FB but if not then) William Henderson GB
Flanker- Mushin Muhammid CHI
Split End- Travis Taylor (i have seen good things in training camps) MIN
Tight End- Jim Kleinsasser MIN
Left Tackle- Chad Clifton GB
Left Guard- Ruben Brown CHI
Center- Matt BIrk MIN
Right Guard- Damien Woody DET
Right Tackle- Mark Thauscher GB

Left End- Alex Brown CHI
Defensive Tackle- Kevin Williams MIN
Defensive Tackle- Pat Williams MIN
Right End- Kabeer Gbaja Biamilla GB
Weakside Linebacker- Lance Briggs CHI
Middle Linebacker- EJ Henderson MIN
Strong Side Linebacker- Napoleon Harris MIN
Strong Side Corner- Antoine Winfield MIN
Weakside Corner- Fred Smoot MIN
Strong Safety- Mike Brown CHI
Free Safety- Darren Sharper MIN

Kicker- Ryan Longwell GB
Punter- Brad Maynard CHI

Kick Returner- whoever that really good guy from DET was who got 2 td's for each type of return who also got injured (forgot his name) DET
Punt Returner- RW Mcquarters DET


MIN 11.5 GB 5.5 DET 5 CHI 3

vikes09
07-05-2005, 06:18 PM
id take roy williams over muhammid and TT any day. that guy was amazing to see play, especially his 4 years at UT. whoever took the snaps had to just lob it up there. it was crazy.

ShiFtY
07-07-2005, 02:52 AM
you guys are being WAY to bias

youre practically putting the whole viking team on the team..

be real

BBQ Platypus
07-07-2005, 02:58 AM
"i_bleed_purple" wrote:


Kick Returner- whoever that really good guy from DET was who got 2 td's for each type of return who also got injured (forgot his name) DET


You mean Eddie Drummond?

http://www.detroitlions.com/photos/Drummond_Body_0919.jpg

http://www.thelionsfanatics.com/eddie_large.jpg

www.detnews.com/pix/ 2002/12/16/d08note1.jpg

I wish he was on the Vikings...he is CRAZY...

nextvikingsstar
07-07-2005, 03:01 AM
maybe a little but defensivly after last leason if u knew the players that are in the north now were gonna be in the north but u didnt know where they were gonna be theyd all be on the list no matter what team on defense i mean idk about taylor being the best wr or even a vikes wr but we will see

VKG4LFE
07-07-2005, 05:00 PM
I would put Birk in at center, he's much better than Kruetz!

i_bleed_purple
07-07-2005, 06:49 PM
you guys are being WAY to bias


which vikings do you not think should be on the list?? you could argue the recievers.

mlb? urlacher is way overrated and he hasn't had a decent tackle since his old spice commercial so i pick EJ over him.

GB has no o line so therefore poorer running game

i_bleed_purple
07-07-2005, 06:50 PM
and yah i mean eddie drummond

that guys an amazing kick returner

V4L
07-07-2005, 06:52 PM
"i_bleed_purple" wrote:


you guys are being WAY to bias


which vikings do you not think should be on the list?? you could argue the recievers.

mlb? urlacher is way overrated and he hasn't had a decent tackle since his old spice commercial so i pick EJ over him.

GB has no o line so therefore poorer running game


Dude U did not just say EJ is better then Urlacher! When Urlacher was hurt thier team hurt even more then it is hurt.. He is what makes that D go.. EJ on the other hand doesn't know where he is.. I wouldn't doubt he is drunk and stoned everygame.. Just looks that way.. And Ahman is wayyyyyyyyyyyyyyyyyyyyy better then Bennett.. Besides the fumbles..

RandyMoss8404
07-07-2005, 06:54 PM
"i_bleed_purple" wrote:


you guys are being WAY to bias


which vikings do you not think should be on the list?? you could argue the recievers.

mlb? urlacher is way overrated and he hasn't had a decent tackle since his old spice commercial so i pick EJ over him.

GB has no o line so therefore poorer running game

Uhm

EJ isn't even going to start. Travis Taylor hasn't proven anything, and Burleson has proven it only once. Michael Bennett is a joke, and GB lost their GUARDS. If you notice, Green Bay kills people with the sweep play - and that relies on the tackles. Plus, Guards aren't that difficult to coach.

Don't be delusional.

Del Rio
07-07-2005, 06:55 PM
I think it has allready been established that these best of lists are written from la la land.

PAvikesfan
07-07-2005, 07:34 PM
by oompa loompas in the chocolate factory...


hahaha

cajunvike
07-07-2005, 08:00 PM
"Vikez4Lyfe" wrote:

"i_bleed_purple" wrote:


you guys are being WAY to bias


which vikings do you not think should be on the list?? you could argue the recievers.

mlb? urlacher is way overrated and he hasn't had a decent tackle since his old spice commercial so i pick EJ over him.

GB has no o line so therefore poorer running game


Dude U did not just say EJ is better then Urlacher! When Urlacher was hurt thier team hurt even more then it is hurt.. He is what makes that D go.. EJ on the other hand doesn't know where he is.. I wouldn't doubt he is drunk and stoned everygame.. Just looks that way.. And Ahman is wayyyyyyyyyyyyyyyyyyyyy better then Bennett.. Besides the fumbles..

The REAL question is whether Urlacher got to tackle Paris Hilton a couple of years ago...now that would definitely put him at the top of the list!!!

DaunteHOF
07-13-2005, 04:39 PM
Bennet wouldn't start at RB, and my man Jermaine Wiggins will get the TE spot