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View Full Version : How to settle your feelings on the Moss trade



akvikefan89
04-21-2005, 08:55 AM
Alright... I have heard people say everything between "We should have just cut Moss" to "Lets trade all our picks and try to get him back" I must say I have mixed feelings in the trade but think that letting him go was a wise decision in the end. Here is how I decided if Moss was worth keeping...

Rate his "skill level" than rate his "attitude level"
subtract the latter from the former look at the numbers.
How to rate players.
scale 1 to 100. 1 being less skilled than your Grandma and 100 being flawless. Now be honest nobody is a 100 or ever will be. That would be never making a mistake. Attitude rating is this. 100 being the biggest jerk ever. 1 being the greatest team plyer ever in football. Please reply with your "skill" and "attitude" rankings for Moss. Please be honest. we will move on once I get a few replies.

akvikefan89
04-21-2005, 09:16 AM
alright. i'm going to bed now. please post your "Moss ratings" and I'll reply tommorrow.

hawaiianvike21
04-21-2005, 11:11 AM
Well on espn2k5 and madden, there are a few players that are rated at a 100 despite making some mistakes. :lol: I dont know how ogden of the ravens got on there though. :shock:


Anywayz.

SKill-96 He can flat out play and change the gameplan for each new defensive coordinatoor he plays. He woulda got higher if he always played hard.

See philly game. However he usually plays hard but at times i question his ability and toughness.


attitude, id give him a 50. SOmetimes he has great attitude, sometimes he has piss poor 7 year old attitude. Id sure like to see what went on in that lockeroom when he was the leader and all.



On a side note anyone see moss fall down right in front of ray lewis when we played the ravens. I was like wtf, that aint moss. :grin: He got scared S***less. At times i question his toughness.

V4L
04-21-2005, 06:16 PM
Skill- 100.. best start to a career at WR EVERRRRRRRRR! better then rice and carter

Attitude- 60.. he was somewhat of a leader.. but thought he could do what he wanted when he wanted

i saw him lay down.. and if i was a WR running across the middle into ray lewis id lay down also.. i was glad he did.. didnt wanna see our star WR miss alot of time

happy camper
04-21-2005, 06:24 PM
i just keep thinking back to that play he had, where he sort of leaped (barely) into the air and stretched his arm out halfaway and half assed trying to catch a pass, but it landed in the opposing teams hands.

anyone know what im talking about? it was awhile ago..

skill- 99
attitude-99

moss was a big ZERO.

V4L
04-21-2005, 06:27 PM
99's are good man... u mean 1 and 1? and about that pass.. im not sure what one u are talking about.. but it was 1 play.. so his skill drops cuz of that?

Prophet
04-21-2005, 06:37 PM
It's kinda confusing how you inverted the scales. 1-100 for skill with 100 being the best and 1-100 for attitude with 1 being the best. For what it's worth I'll play.

Skill: 90
Attitude: 75

There's no arguing that Moss is an elite receiver. I have never been a fan of his attitude and am glad he is gone.

happy camper
04-21-2005, 06:41 PM
"Vikez4Lyfe" wrote:

99's are good man... u mean 1 and 1? and about that pass.. im not sure what one u are talking about.. but it was 1 play.. so his skill drops cuz of that?

no one has ever denied his skill. anyone who has tried to deny his skill is a fool.

its all the baggage he brought with him.

at the beginning of two seasons ago, when everyone jumped on the "randy is mature now" bandwagon.. i was cool with randy. then at the end of last season.. his true colors came through once again. everyone thought he changed, but he didnt.

SKOL
04-21-2005, 06:46 PM
Using that formula I came up with:

Randy Moss = 60
Shaun Hill = 60

Something doesn't add up. :scratch:

jellovike
04-21-2005, 07:23 PM
Haha. Good one SKOL :lol:

akvikefan89
04-21-2005, 09:22 PM
This is'nt a way to decide which players are better. This is a way to see how much positive and how much negative your bringing to your team. If Moss's attitude comes anywhere near his skill level there was a HUGE problem.

akvikefan89
04-21-2005, 09:26 PM
"hawaiianvike21" wrote:

Well on espn2k5 and madden, there are a few players that are rated at a 100 despite making some mistakes. :lol: I dont know how ogden of the ravens got on there though. :shock:


Anywayz.

SKill-96 He can flat out play and change the gameplan for each new defensive coordinatoor he plays. He woulda got higher if he always played hard.

See philly game. However he usually plays hard but at times i question his ability and toughness.




attitude, id give him a 50. SOmetimes he has great attitude, sometimes he has piss poor 7 year old attitude. Id sure like to see what went on in that lockeroom when he was the leader and all.



On a side note anyone see moss fall down right in front of ray lewis when we played the ravens. I was like wtf, that aint moss. :grin: He got scared S***less. At times i question his toughness.

Moss was a softey. Anyway... you think Moss's attitude was about half his skill. Well with Moss's skill that means ALOT of attitude. He did not want to play for the Vikes any more anyways, Imagin what he would have done this year. His heart is'nt in football like it used to be. He is too caught up in his own self image.

RandyMoss8404
04-21-2005, 09:34 PM
"akvikefan89" wrote:

"hawaiianvike21" wrote:

Well on espn2k5 and madden, there are a few players that are rated at a 100 despite making some mistakes. :lol: I dont know how ogden of the ravens got on there though. :shock:


Anywayz.

SKill-96 He can flat out play and change the gameplan for each new defensive coordinatoor he plays. He woulda got higher if he always played hard.

See philly game. However he usually plays hard but at times i question his ability and toughness.




attitude, id give him a 50. SOmetimes he has great attitude, sometimes he has piss poor 7 year old attitude. Id sure like to see what went on in that lockeroom when he was the leader and all.



On a side note anyone see moss fall down right in front of ray lewis when we played the ravens. I was like wtf, that aint moss. :grin: He got scared S***less. At times i question his toughness.

Moss was a softey. Anyway... you think Moss's attitude was about half his skill. Well with Moss's skill that means ALOT of attitude. He did not want to play for the Vikes any more anyways, Imagin what he would have done this year. His heart is'nt in football like it used to be. He is too caught up in his own self image.

Yeah, Moss never took hits.




































:lol: You guys are pathetic. We trade him and you turn on him. It won't be as funny when he hurdles 'toine or Smoot in his return to the dome in 2007.

chilifoot
04-21-2005, 10:09 PM
"RandyMoss8404" wrote:

:lol: You guys are pathetic. We trade him and you turn on him. It won't be as funny when he hurdles 'toine or Smoot in his return to the dome in 2007.

we're pathetic?

you're the one with your mouth firmly planted on Moss's ass.... he's not even on the team anymore... and you're kissing his arse like he's your boss and you're in line for a promotion... that's pathetic

schwartz24
04-21-2005, 10:13 PM
moss was the best reciever to play in minnesota ! he was the best play make we had and will ever see as vikings fan. hes a freak of nature and is the best to play wide out ever. moss fan for life... thanks mccombs for giving him away for nothing!

ultravikingfan
04-21-2005, 10:47 PM
"schwartz24" wrote:

moss was the best reciever to play in minnesota ! he was the best play make we had and will ever see as vikings fan. hes a freak of nature and is the best to play wide out ever. moss fan for life... thanks mccombs for giving him away for nothing!

He was? What about this guy? Ever heard of him?

http://img.photobucket.com/albums/v482/ultravikingfan/BuilttoLast.jpg

cc21
04-21-2005, 10:48 PM
skill=98
attitude=60

ultravikingfan
04-21-2005, 10:49 PM
"RandyMoss8404" wrote:

:lol: You guys are pathetic. We trade him and you turn on him. It won't be as funny when he hurdles 'toine or Smoot in his return to the dome in 2007.

Always a supporter. Nothing wrong with that.
But, answer one question for me: Who do you cheer for first, the player or the team?

cc21
04-21-2005, 11:00 PM
"ultravikingfan" wrote:

"RandyMoss8404" wrote:

:lol: You guys are pathetic. We trade him and you turn on him. It won't be as funny when he hurdles 'toine or Smoot in his return to the dome in 2007.

Always a supporter. Nothing wrong with that.
But, answer one question for me: Who do you cheer for first, the player or the team?i would have to say team. i still love randy, he is still one of my favorite players. When we play the raiders though, i gotta cheer for the vikes.

Caine
04-21-2005, 11:19 PM
"chilifoot" wrote:

"RandyMoss8404" wrote:

:lol: You guys are pathetic. We trade him and you turn on him. It won't be as funny when he hurdles 'toine or Smoot in his return to the dome in 2007.

we're pathetic?

you're the one with your mouth firmly planted on Moss's butt.... he's not even on the team anymore... and you're kissing his arse like he's your boss and you're in line for a promotion... that's pathetic

Actually, I sort of agree with 8404. It amazes me how many people have completely reversed direction on Moss now that he's gone. And, Chilifoot, instead of disproving 8404's statement with your reply, you actually sort of supported it. After all, when your FIRST response is name calling, it typically means that you haven't got anything factual to support your stance.

I've said it before, I'll say it again, I don't blame Randy for the things that happened, I blame Red *screws squirrels* McCombs. His refusal to put a Defense on the field (evidenced by the 38 million in cap room) created an impossible situation for our Offense. No matter how many points we scored, they would too...usually.

Randy didn't do anything EVER that was as bad as the Media made it out to be. He just got hammered more for it. Don't believe me? Pick ANY "Moss Incident" and I'll prove it.

And, in answer to Ultra's question, I ALWAYS support the TEAM first. But, I see no reason to bash Moss because our dumbshit owner created a negative situation, then tried to pass the buck off on Moss by trading him and buying a Defense.

Caine

ultravikingfan
04-21-2005, 11:46 PM
Good write Caine. I don't hate Moss at all either. Was I happy to see him go? No. But, I do look ahead and Randy is in the past. Could we have done it with him? Most definately yes. His tenure here was great. I never paid much attention to a lot of the incidents, unless they involved the team.

But, it seems (no fingers being pointed) that a lot of folks seem to cherrish Moss as an individual over the team as a whole. I guess everybody has different like and dislikes. I go with the team all the way.

Mr Anderson
04-22-2005, 12:08 AM
"schwartz24" wrote:

moss was the best reciever to play in minnesota ! he was the best play make we had and will ever see as vikings fan. hes a freak of nature and is the best to play wide out ever. moss fan for life... thanks mccombs for giving him away for nothing!


Cris Carter is the best HANDS down. haha

He had the best hands the world has ever seen and is the one of the best things to ever happen to this organization.

Moss is unbelievably talented, but football is not a one man show.

And unlike you im a team fan not a player fan. So I couldnt care less for your Moss loving opinion. Go Vikes! Moss, I dont care I hope his career is well but now that he is gone I am not that excited about him.

BigMoInAZ
04-22-2005, 04:11 AM
"Caine" wrote:

"chilifoot" wrote:

"RandyMoss8404" wrote:

:lol: You guys are pathetic. We trade him and you turn on him. It won't be as funny when he hurdles 'toine or Smoot in his return to the dome in 2007.

we're pathetic?

you're the one with your mouth firmly planted on Moss's butt.... he's not even on the team anymore... and you're kissing his arse like he's your boss and you're in line for a promotion... that's pathetic

Actually, I sort of agree with 8404. It amazes me how many people have completely reversed direction on Moss now that he's gone. And, Chilifoot, instead of disproving 8404's statement with your reply, you actually sort of supported it. After all, when your FIRST response is name calling, it typically means that you haven't got anything factual to support your stance.

I've said it before, I'll say it again, I don't blame Randy for the things that happened, I blame Red *screws squirrels* McCombs. His refusal to put a Defense on the field (evidenced by the 38 million in cap room) created an impossible situation for our Offense. No matter how many points we scored, they would too...usually.

Randy didn't do anything EVER that was as bad as the Media made it out to be. He just got hammered more for it. Don't believe me? Pick ANY "Moss Incident" and I'll prove it.

And, in answer to Ultra's question, I ALWAYS support the TEAM first. But, I see no reason to bash Moss because our dumbshit owner created a negative situation, then tried to pass the buck off on Moss by trading him and buying a Defense.

Caine
Dammnnn! Another old fart that thinks alot like me! Too cool! Ditto to your response Caine, and to all you MOSS HATERS! GFY!

dauntefan
04-22-2005, 05:11 AM
I love Moss and always will, and I hope he does well in Oakland. I hope he kicks New Englands ass on opening day. I think it should have been Tice leaving instead of Moss. So there's no hate for Moss from me, just as long as our new kick ass secondary shut his ass down when he plays us. : )

SKOL
04-22-2005, 05:23 AM
"akvikefan89" wrote:

This is'nt a way to decide which players are better. This is a way to see how much positive and how much negative your bringing to your team.

I knew what you meant akvike..., I's just messing with ya. :lol:

tattattict
04-22-2005, 05:48 AM
Im just gonna say that Moss is a stud and there might not ever be a player like him. But I also think that there is no one player above his team or the game and at times he acts like he is. I wish him luck , but I am a Vikes fan and I support my team and in the end I believe we will be a better team with out him!

Guruzen
04-22-2005, 06:28 AM
"akvikefan89" wrote:

Alright... I have heard people say everything between "We should have just cut Moss" to "Lets trade all our picks and try to get him back" I must say I have mixed feelings in the trade but think that letting him go was a wise decision in the end. Here is how I decided if Moss was worth keeping...

Rate his "skill level" than rate his "attitude level"
subtract the latter from the former look at the numbers.
How to rate players.
scale 1 to 100. 1 being less skilled than your Grandma and 100 being flawless. Now be honest nobody is a 100 or ever will be. That would be never making a mistake. Attitude rating is this. 100 being the biggest jerk ever. 1 being the greatest team plyer ever in football. Please reply with your "skill" and "attitude" rankings for Moss. Please be honest. we will move on once I get a few replies.

So you're saying my Grandma who's an ultimate unselfish team player is just as good as a selfish Moss?

GO GRANDMAMA!!!!

akvikefan89
04-22-2005, 07:10 AM
"Caine" wrote:

"chilifoot" wrote:

"RandyMoss8404" wrote:

:lol: You guys are pathetic. We trade him and you turn on him. It won't be as funny when he hurdles 'toine or Smoot in his return to the dome in 2007.

we're pathetic?

you're the one with your mouth firmly planted on Moss's butt.... he's not even on the team anymore... and you're kissing his arse like he's your boss and you're in line for a promotion... that's pathetic

Actually, I sort of agree with 8404. It amazes me how many people have completely reversed direction on Moss now that he's gone. And, Chilifoot, instead of disproving 8404's statement with your reply, you actually sort of supported it. After all, when your FIRST response is name calling, it typically means that you haven't got anything factual to support your stance.

I've said it before, I'll say it again, I don't blame Randy for the things that happened, I blame Red *screws squirrels* McCombs. His refusal to put a Defense on the field (evidenced by the 38 million in cap room) created an impossible situation for our Offense. No matter how many points we scored, they would too...usually.

Randy didn't do anything EVER that was as bad as the Media made it out to be. He just got hammered more for it. Don't believe me? Pick ANY "Moss Incident" and I'll prove it.

And, in answer to Ultra's question, I ALWAYS support the TEAM first. But, I see no reason to bash Moss because our dumbshit owner created a negative situation, then tried to pass the buck off on Moss by trading him and buying a Defense.

Caine
Um. actually. I turned on Moss starting when he left the field with 2 ticks left. From then on things went from bad to worse.

akvikefan89
04-22-2005, 07:42 AM
"Guruzen" wrote:

"akvikefan89" wrote:

Alright... I have heard people say everything between "We should have just cut Moss" to "Lets trade all our picks and try to get him back" I must say I have mixed feelings in the trade but think that letting him go was a wise decision in the end. Here is how I decided if Moss was worth keeping...

Rate his "skill level" than rate his "attitude level"
subtract the latter from the former look at the numbers.
How to rate players.
scale 1 to 100. 1 being less skilled than your Grandma and 100 being flawless. Now be honest nobody is a 100 or ever will be. That would be never making a mistake. Attitude rating is this. 100 being the biggest jerk ever. 1 being the greatest team plyer ever in football. Please reply with your "skill" and "attitude" rankings for Moss. Please be honest. we will move on once I get a few replies.

So you're saying my Grandma who's an ultimate unselfish team player is just as good as a selfish Moss?

GO GRANDMAMA!!!!
May I repeat... THIS IS NOT A SKILL RATING. okay, now my finger hurts from holding down the shift key for 27 digits. Anyway, I'm just saying that if your attitude rating comes close to your skill rating there is a major problem.

ultravikingfan
04-22-2005, 12:49 PM
"akvikefan89" wrote:

May I repeat... THIS IS NOT A SKILL RATING. okay, now my finger hurts from holding down the shift key for 27 digits. Anyway, I'm just saying that if your attitude rating comes close to your skill rating there is a major problem.

Use the "Caps Lock" then.

tattattict
04-22-2005, 03:28 PM
I have not changed my oppinion on Moss at all I have always thought he was a "freak " with all his talent and I do think we have lost probably the most talented wide out in the league maybe even the history of the game. But that does not mean I have to like the guy....I can't stand Brett Favre but I'm not gonna say he aint a good Quaterback. If ya get my drift?

Ltrey33
04-22-2005, 03:30 PM
"Vikes" wrote:

"Caine" wrote:

"chilifoot" wrote:

"RandyMoss8404" wrote:

:lol: You guys are pathetic. We trade him and you turn on him. It won't be as funny when he hurdles 'toine or Smoot in his return to the dome in 2007.

we're pathetic?

you're the one with your mouth firmly planted on Moss's butt.... he's not even on the team anymore... and you're kissing his arse like he's your boss and you're in line for a promotion... that's pathetic

Actually, I sort of agree with 8404. It amazes me how many people have completely reversed direction on Moss now that he's gone. And, Chilifoot, instead of disproving 8404's statement with your reply, you actually sort of supported it. After all, when your FIRST response is name calling, it typically means that you haven't got anything factual to support your stance.


Caine

Some people turned on him the moment he left. But just because we rooted for him every Sunday, then displayed our displeasure with him and how unhappy we were with him after he was traded doesn't necessarily mean we turned on him, it means we rooted for him every Sunday and loved him cuz he was a Vike, but once he was gone, he as no longer a Viking, so it was ok to say how we felt. There were a lot more people unhappy with him than you'd think...myself included

happy camper
04-22-2005, 07:25 PM
i turned on moss a long time before he left..

Caine
04-22-2005, 08:00 PM
Only one person took up the gauntlet and actually gave a specific reason for disliking Moss.

akvikefan89 turned when Moss left with 2 seconds on the clock. Ok, that's fine. But, was it REALLY the huge issue that the media made it into?

Sure, it was immature. Sure, I wish he hadn't. Sure, I'm glad that the team stepped up and said, "Randy, don't do that". And THAT is where it should stop.

Jimmy Johnson flying in to interview Randy and saying, "Randy...you know you were wrong" and all the other BS that allowed the Fox Pre-Game crew to bash Randy all the more was simply a pathetic attempt by them to be "relevant". Randy got more bad press from that incident than Ray Lewis did for "allegedly" killing someone.

Further, based upon the specifics of the incident alone, when Favre walked off the field (Metrodome, 11/17/02) with THIRTY SIX seconds on the clock, no one even blinked...isn't that worse than what Randy did? In fact, isn't that EIGHTEEN TIMES worse? Not according to the media.

So, while I didn't LIKE what Randy did, neither am I going to start hating him for doing something that the Golden Icon of the NFL Media Knobslobologists already established as being "OK" to do. The hypocrasy of the media overshadowed - for me - the incident itself.

Anyone else?

caine

happy camper
04-22-2005, 08:50 PM
if you'll look earlier in the thread, i explained some of my disdain for moss with the incident when he half assed trying to catch and pass, he basically let the defender intercept it.

other reasons:

"i play when i want to play"

squirting the ref in a playoff game

last year, when we were in a hurry up offense, moss WALKED back to the line of scrimmage. this didnt happen every time, so dont go look at one time and say "i didnt see it" but it did happen 2-3 times. there was one time we got a penalty called on us because he walked back and he wasnt in his stance before the play was called.

walking off the field early. hmm. what is one thing that makes sports great? great comeback plays. think back to some of the greatest comeback plays in football. what if doug flutie said "ya know, im gonna pack my bags, a hail mary is impossible" what if the players who were involvodin the river city miracle (is that what its called) just caught the ball and jogged. plus, think about if you were at work, and the person who makes the most money, who is the best worker, clocks out when you really needed them. it happened at my work and it caused ALOT of problems.

there is no need to defend moss by comparing him to other people (ray lewis, favre, TO) because i dont care what they did and how the media handled it differently than what they would have with those other players.

when moss walked off the field, matt birk told moss how he felt. moss, in an interview later said "i wasnt listening" i dont want a high profile player such as moss saying he doesnt care what matt birk says. especailly since i beleive birk to be a leader of our football team.

no doubt about it, when moss was on fire.. he was on fire. nobody could touch him. and i am happy i have memories of him playing here. espcially the wildcard game against the packers.

its just, for me, the bad outweighed the good.

akvikefan89
04-22-2005, 08:57 PM
"Caine" wrote:

Only one person took up the gauntlet and actually gave a specific reason for disliking Moss.

akvikefan89 turned when Moss left with 2 seconds on the clock. Ok, that's fine. But, was it REALLY the huge issue that the media made it into?

Sure, it was immature. Sure, I wish he hadn't. Sure, I'm glad that the team stepped up and said, "Randy, don't do that". And THAT is where it should stop.

Jimmy Johnson flying in to interview Randy and saying, "Randy...you know you were wrong" and all the other BS that allowed the Fox Pre-Game crew to bash Randy all the more was simply a pathetic attempt by them to be "relevant". Randy got more bad press from that incident than Ray Lewis did for "allegedly" killing someone.

Further, based upon the specifics of the incident alone, when Favre walked off the field (Metrodome, 11/17/02) with THIRTY SIX seconds on the clock, no one even blinked...isn't that worse than what Randy did? In fact, isn't that EIGHTEEN TIMES worse? Not according to the media.

So, while I didn't LIKE what Randy did, neither am I going to start hating him for doing something that the Golden Icon of the NFL Media Knobslobologists already established as being "OK" to do. The hypocrasy of the media overshadowed - for me - the incident itself.

Anyone else?

caine

Caine.... It was'nt just the walking off the field. I was a supporter of Moss and tryed to defend things he did when my friends badmouthed him.
But the dropping balls when he would get hit,the hasseling Peppy on the sideline saying things like
"Just throw up the ball man! I can outjump "21"(Brian Dawkins)" he is such a selfish player. His attitude dragged down the team and when he left with two seconds left he pulled the trigger and the media jumped all over him. He did it to himself. Squirting refs with a water bottle,bumping into police officers with his car,"mooning" the crowd. All these things took his teammates mind off football. I wish that we could have just gone back to the day when Randall Cunningham threw up hail mary's and Moss watched the ball sail down on the jumbotron and we beat teams
42-21 and Moss was a team player and a hero. But now is now, Moss's heart is'nt in football but in himself.Maybe he'll have one or two good seasons with the Raiders and play hard again just to show up the Vikings for trading him. But Napolean Harris will probablly be making us big plays when Moss is watching the game in jail five years from now.

akvikefan89
04-22-2005, 08:59 PM
"happy camper" wrote:

if you'll look earlier in the thread, i explained some of my disdain for moss with the incident when he half assed trying to catch and pass, he basically let the defender intercept it.

other reasons:

"i play when i want to play"

squirting the ref in a playoff game

last year, when we were in a hurry up offense, moss WALKED back to the line of scrimmage. this didnt happen every time, so dont go look at one time and say "i didnt see it" but it did happen 2-3 times. there was one time we got a penalty called on us because he walked back and he wasnt in his stance before the play was called.

walking off the field early. hmm. what is one thing that makes sports great? great comeback plays. think back to some of the greatest comeback plays in football. what if doug flutie said "ya know, im gonna pack my bags, a hail mary is impossible" what if the players who were involvodin the river city miracle (is that what its called) just caught the ball and jogged. plus, think about if you were at work, and the person who makes the most money, who is the best worker, clocks out when you really needed them. it happened at my work and it caused ALOT of problems.

there is no need to defend moss by comparing him to other people (ray lewis, favre, TO) because i dont care what they did and how the media handled it differently than what they would have with those other players.

when moss walked off the field, matt birk told moss how he felt. moss, in an interview later said "i wasnt listening" i dont want a high profile player such as moss saying he doesnt care what matt birk says. especailly since i beleive birk to be a leader of our football team.

no doubt about it, when moss was on fire.. he was on fire. nobody could touch him. and i am happy i have memories of him playing here. espcially the wildcard game against the packers.

its just, for me, the bad outweighed the good.

You bring up very good points happy camper.

chilifoot
04-22-2005, 10:08 PM
"Caine" wrote:

"chilifoot" wrote:

"RandyMoss8404" wrote:

:lol: You guys are pathetic. We trade him and you turn on him. It won't be as funny when he hurdles 'toine or Smoot in his return to the dome in 2007.

we're pathetic?

you're the one with your mouth firmly planted on Moss's butt.... he's not even on the team anymore... and you're kissing his arse like he's your boss and you're in line for a promotion... that's pathetic

Actually, I sort of agree with 8404. It amazes me how many people have completely reversed direction on Moss now that he's gone. And, Chilifoot, instead of disproving 8404's statement with your reply, you actually sort of supported it. After all, when your FIRST response is name calling, it typically means that you haven't got anything factual to support your stance.

I've said it before, I'll say it again, I don't blame Randy for the things that happened, I blame Red *screws squirrels* McCombs. His refusal to put a Defense on the field (evidenced by the 38 million in cap room) created an impossible situation for our Offense. No matter how many points we scored, they would too...usually.

Randy didn't do anything EVER that was as bad as the Media made it out to be. He just got hammered more for it. Don't believe me? Pick ANY "Moss Incident" and I'll prove it.

And, in answer to Ultra's question, I ALWAYS support the TEAM first. But, I see no reason to bash Moss because our dumbshit owner created a negative situation, then tried to pass the buck off on Moss by trading him and buying a Defense.

Cainewow, never have i seen so much bullshit in one post before... please point out to me, where exactly i resorted to name calling... he accused everyone of being pathetic... meanwhile, proving himself to be pathetic... sorry... just like Moss... a spade is a spade...

now stop being a Moss fan and try being a Vikings fan

Caine
04-22-2005, 10:46 PM
"chilifoot" wrote:

"Caine" wrote:

"chilifoot" wrote:

"RandyMoss8404" wrote:

:lol: You guys are pathetic. We trade him and you turn on him. It won't be as funny when he hurdles 'toine or Smoot in his return to the dome in 2007.

we're pathetic?

you're the one with your mouth firmly planted on Moss's butt.... he's not even on the team anymore... and you're kissing his arse like he's your boss and you're in line for a promotion... that's pathetic

Actually, I sort of agree with 8404. It amazes me how many people have completely reversed direction on Moss now that he's gone. And, Chilifoot, instead of disproving 8404's statement with your reply, you actually sort of supported it. After all, when your FIRST response is name calling, it typically means that you haven't got anything factual to support your stance.

I've said it before, I'll say it again, I don't blame Randy for the things that happened, I blame Red *screws squirrels* McCombs. His refusal to put a Defense on the field (evidenced by the 38 million in cap room) created an impossible situation for our Offense. No matter how many points we scored, they would too...usually.

Randy didn't do anything EVER that was as bad as the Media made it out to be. He just got hammered more for it. Don't believe me? Pick ANY "Moss Incident" and I'll prove it.

And, in answer to Ultra's question, I ALWAYS support the TEAM first. But, I see no reason to bash Moss because our dumbshit owner created a negative situation, then tried to pass the buck off on Moss by trading him and buying a Defense.

Cainewow, never have i seen so much kaka del toro in one post before... please point out to me, where exactly i resorted to name calling... he accused everyone of being pathetic... meanwhile, proving himself to be pathetic... sorry... just like Moss... a spade is a spade...

now stop being a Moss fan and try being a Vikings fan

Chili...bold above is the example - which you requoted - of you name-calling. To paraphrase, you essentially are calling him an arse-kisser. Spin it any which way, your comment was intended to draw a specific - derogatory - response from 8404, in a manner completely devoid of anything other than inflamatory content.

Further, please enlighten me as to how he "proved himself to be pathetic"? I don't see it. He expressed outrage at a general turning of Viking fans against Moss for no other reason than he was traded. You copuntered with inflamatory and degrading content. Sorry, if that's the best you got, I'm taking 8404's side of it...at least he put in some substance.

Oh, and if this somehow makes me not a Viking fan in your eyes, all I can say is (I've also said this before here), "There are 5 people in the entire world whose opinions I care about...you aren't on that list".

As for the others who have now stepped up to "play"...game on.

1: Moss ran over a cop: No, in fact it was a Meter Maid (Albeit with an overglorified, "Politically Correct" title). She exceeded her authority by blocking his progress, and when he rolled forward at an idle, she refused to move away. That's why he was only issued a TICKET.

2: He squirted a Referee. Geez, I've wanted to do worse. Sure, it was immature, foolish, and didn't help the team one bit...but it was also quite awhile ago, and he NEVER did it again.

3: "I play when I want to play": Not the brightest thing he ever said, that I'll grant you. When he said it -3 years ago - even I wanted him traded. I didn't care how talanted he was, it wasn't doing us any good if he wouldn't use it.

4: Response from akvikefan89: Most of your post deals with intangibles. His "attitude", he "dragged down the team", and his being "Selfish". If that is true, why aren't current Vikings comming forward and airing that out? Why is that they are all saying that Randy was a great team mate? Could it be that what you perceive as bad is actually what the Media implanted there with their incessant jabber about Randy's attitude?

5: Response from Happy Camper:

there is no need to defend moss by comparing him to other people (ray lewis, favre, TO) because i dont care what they did and how the media handled it differently than what they would have with those other players.

Really? And what benchmark are you holding him to, and who established it? You do realize, I hope, that the standard you set for him was established by other players. I never said Moss was a saint, I said he wasn't "as bad as the Media made him out to be". The MEDIA crucified Randy for "issues" they ignored from other players...repeatedly. Moss was held to a standard no one else was held to. He was doomed to fail in the media's eyes regardless of what he did.


walking off the field early. hmm. what is one thing that makes sports great? great comeback plays. think back to some of the greatest comeback plays in football. what if doug flutie said "ya know, im gonna pack my bags, a hail mary is impossible" what if the players who were involvodin the river city miracle (is that what its called) just caught the ball and jogged. plus, think about if you were at work, and the person who makes the most money, who is the best worker, clocks out when you really needed them. it happened at my work and it caused ALOT of problems.

First off, I work in a Union plant. That means - for those who don't - that the lazy and incompetant make just as much as I do for doing virtually nothing. So, the bottom half of your arguement falls flat for every Union employee out there (Ask me sometime about Unions...I hate them).

Now, the NFL is paid based - loosely - upon ability. Randy's ability WON more games than it ever lost, that's why he got the big bucks. Also, above I stated that I don't approve of the walk-off, but the TEAM handled it - as they should - and the rest (Johnson sticking his face in, Irvin and Sanders offering to "council" Randy, etc) was all headline generating BS. Plus, the Favre walk-off didn't cause so much as a ripple. Why was Randy singled out?

6: The overall picture: Love Moss, hate Moss, I don't really care. I will always remember the feeling that we could score at any given point in time when Moss was on the field. I will always remember the excitement that Randy generated. Sure, it's tempered with a bit of regret for some of his poor decisions, but the overall picture was very good. We wouldn't have come as far as fast without him. He gave Daunte time to mature. He was out emergency relief valve in more games than I can count.

Some will choose to look only at the handful of negatives (Most of which occurred at least 3 years or more ago), and fail to see what I saw...a guy who wanted desperately to win, but was torpedoed by a selfish, greedy OWNER.

And, worst of all, I loathe the Media and the exaggerations they spewed forth in order to sell papers/garner viewers. THEY forced that trade. Not the players, not the management, it was the MEDIA.

Caine

akvikefan89
04-22-2005, 11:16 PM
We are all entitled to our opinions but I still disagree with you Caine. GOOD RIDDENS MOSS

PurplePackerEater
04-22-2005, 11:36 PM
"ultravikingfan" wrote:

"RandyMoss8404" wrote:

:lol: You guys are pathetic. We trade him and you turn on him. It won't be as funny when he hurdles 'toine or Smoot in his return to the dome in 2007.

Always a supporter. Nothing wrong with that.
But, answer one question for me: Who do you cheer for first, the player or the team?

HEY ULTRA. WHAT DO YOU CHEER FOR FIRST? WHAT'S GOOD FOR THE OWNER OR WHAT'S GOOD FOR THE TEAM???

GET OFF REDS SACK. :oops:

PurplePackerEater
04-22-2005, 11:57 PM
"chilifoot" wrote:

"Caine" wrote:

"chilifoot" wrote:

"RandyMoss8404" wrote:

:lol: You guys are pathetic. We trade him and you turn on him. It won't be as funny when he hurdles 'toine or Smoot in his return to the dome in 2007.

we're pathetic?

you're the one with your mouth firmly planted on Moss's butt.... he's not even on the team anymore... and you're kissing his arse like he's your boss and you're in line for a promotion... that's pathetic

Actually, I sort of agree with 8404. It amazes me how many people have completely reversed direction on Moss now that he's gone. And, Chilifoot, instead of disproving 8404's statement with your reply, you actually sort of supported it. After all, when your FIRST response is name calling, it typically means that you haven't got anything factual to support your stance.

I've said it before, I'll say it again, I don't blame Randy for the things that happened, I blame Red *screws squirrels* McCombs. His refusal to put a Defense on the field (evidenced by the 38 million in cap room) created an impossible situation for our Offense. No matter how many points we scored, they would too...usually.

Randy didn't do anything EVER that was as bad as the Media made it out to be. He just got hammered more for it. Don't believe me? Pick ANY "Moss Incident" and I'll prove it.

And, in answer to Ultra's question, I ALWAYS support the TEAM first. But, I see no reason to bash Moss because our dumbshit owner created a negative situation, then tried to pass the buck off on Moss by trading him and buying a Defense.

Cainewow, never have i seen so much kaka del toro in one post before... please point out to me, where exactly i resorted to name calling... he accused everyone of being pathetic... meanwhile, proving himself to be pathetic... sorry... just like Moss... a spade is a spade...

now stop being a Moss fan and try being a Vikings fan

You too, Chili. Stop being a McCombs fan and try being a Vikings Fan.

Most of you don't understand that any one of these owners would move this team in a minute if they could. Pouting because of not making as much money as other franchise owners. Now tell me - Who's more childish, selfish, greedy, and cruel? Red or Moss?

:withstupid:

brandsp
04-22-2005, 11:58 PM
The reason for the Moss trade is two fold. #1 is that the coaching staff wanted this to be Culpepper's team and as long as Moss was here that not going to happen. #2 with Linehan leaving and Loney taking over we are going to run the ball 15 % more this year, which means less passes to Moss, which leads to an even unhappier Moss. Which translates to more disruption within the team.

Plus my third which is more of a stretch- many players gave up when they'd see Moss give up, since he and Pep were the leaders. We all know that on any team there are a few leaders and as they go the rest of the team goes.

To close: I wish Randy all the best in Oakland, will still try to get him on my Fant Football team, and thank him for making Vikes games more exciting to watch these past 7 years.

ultravikingfan
04-23-2005, 03:17 AM
"PurplePackerEater" wrote:

"ultravikingfan" wrote:

"RandyMoss8404" wrote:

:lol: You guys are pathetic. We trade him and you turn on him. It won't be as funny when he hurdles 'toine or Smoot in his return to the dome in 2007.

Always a supporter. Nothing wrong with that.
But, answer one question for me: Who do you cheer for first, the player or the team?

HEY ULTRA. WHAT DO YOU CHEER FOR FIRST? WHAT'S GOOD FOR THE OWNER OR WHAT'S GOOD FOR THE TEAM???

GET OFF REDS SACK. :oops:

Are you kidding me? Where is my comment geared towards Red? I was saying (if you had a hard time figuring it out) who do you cheer for first (as in Moss) or the team.

What a F'ken insult! Of course I cheer for whats good for the team! Where do you see in my comment whats good for the owner?

Its impossible to say anything about Moss here without some of the members going nuts! :roll:

realmeandogg
04-23-2005, 03:27 AM
Talent in 1998-2000 100
Talent from 2000-present 80 (I play when I want)

Attitude 1998-presnt 89 1/2

By By moss

BigK
04-23-2005, 03:42 AM
The only way my feelings are going to be settled is if we draft Derrick Johnson :grin: . Napolean turns into a QB nightmare and for some reason Al Davis releases Moss and we sign him back. :wink:

chilifoot
04-23-2005, 04:02 AM
wow, i've never seen someone get so worked up about a little internet feud... ego problems much?

you are soooo cool though man.... yeah, the coolest internet guy around... congrats Caine

Chilifoot :roll:

Caine
04-23-2005, 04:56 AM
"PurplePackerEater" wrote:

"ultravikingfan" wrote:

"RandyMoss8404" wrote:

:lol: You guys are pathetic. We trade him and you turn on him. It won't be as funny when he hurdles 'toine or Smoot in his return to the dome in 2007.

Always a supporter. Nothing wrong with that.
But, answer one question for me: Who do you cheer for first, the player or the team?

HEY ULTRA. WHAT DO YOU CHEER FOR FIRST? WHAT'S GOOD FOR THE OWNER OR WHAT'S GOOD FOR THE TEAM???

GET OFF REDS SACK. :oops:

Whoa, there cowboy. Ultra's comment wasn't pro-Red. It was legitimate in light of the current topic. Who comes first, player or team? I know plenty of Micheal Vick fans who aren't Falcon fans, but follow them because of Vick. Same holds true of Moss and the Vikings. Stars draw fans just like teams do.

as for this:


"Chilifoot" wrote:

wow, i've never seen someone get so worked up about a little internet feud... ego problems much?

you are soooo cool though man.... yeah, the coolest internet guy around... congrats Caine

Chilifoot

"Your Honor, the prosecution rests".

Caine

PS: News Flash, it isn't about being "cool". It's about being able to substantiate what you say. As for your opinion...I believe I already addressed that (Remember...5 people...you aren't one of 'em).

Have a nice day.

PurplePackerEater
04-23-2005, 04:27 PM
My comment to Ultra goes beyond this post(we butt heads all the time over Moss).

And Ultra, I read some of your old post on the other thread that came to "life" yesterday, you were one of the first to post in faver of NOT trading Moss. (you're like a military guys that can't think for himself - management tells you what to do and think)


Why couldn't Red have just sold the team with Moss - per the Buyer's request? The guy is evil, I swear.

happy camper
04-23-2005, 05:51 PM
Really? And what benchmark are you holding him to, and who established it? You do realize, I hope, that the standard you set for him was established by other players. I never said Moss was a saint, I said he wasn't "as bad as the Media made him out to be". The MEDIA crucified Randy for "issues" they ignored from other players...repeatedly. Moss was held to a standard no one else was held to. He was doomed to fail in the media's eyes regardless of what he did.

you cannot defend someone based on other people.

thats like when you're a kid, and you want a video game and you say "but mom, jimmys mom bought it for him"

the media did treat moss unfairly. but the truth is.. he did it to himself. with the things he did, he really brought it on himself. it really seemed for awhile like he learned. it seemed moss was matured. but he showed, at the end of last season, that he didnt.

ultravikingfan
04-23-2005, 05:55 PM
"PurplePackerEater" wrote:

My comment to Ultra goes beyond this post(we butt heads all the time over Moss).

And Ultra, I read some of your old post on the other thread that came to "life" yesterday, you were one of the first to post in faver of NOT trading Moss. (you're like a military guys that can't think for himself - management tells you what to do and think)


Why couldn't Red have just sold the team with Moss - per the Buyer's request? The guy is evil, I swear.

No kidding! Yes, I did not want to trade him. I am not going to sit here and lament on the fact we traded him. But, what does that have to do with what I said in this thread? I was just saying, cheer for the team, not the player!

Don't even go stereotying military folk, not cool. I consider that a personal attack on me and others who have served!

"PurplePackerEater" wrote:

My comment to Ultra goes beyond this post...

Stick to the facts of what is being posted.

Caine
04-23-2005, 08:05 PM
"happy camper" wrote:


Really? And what benchmark are you holding him to, and who established it? You do realize, I hope, that the standard you set for him was established by other players. I never said Moss was a saint, I said he wasn't "as bad as the Media made him out to be". The MEDIA crucified Randy for "issues" they ignored from other players...repeatedly. Moss was held to a standard no one else was held to. He was doomed to fail in the media's eyes regardless of what he did.

you cannot defend someone based on other people.

thats like when you're a kid, and you want a video game and you say "but mom, jimmys mom bought it for him"

the media did treat moss unfairly. but the truth is.. he did it to himself. with the things he did, he really brought it on himself. it really seemed for awhile like he learned. it seemed moss was matured. but he showed, at the end of last season, that he didnt.

I absolutely CAN defend someone based upon what others have done - it's called "Past Precedent". In legal situations, they use case law (Examples derived from PAST cases) all the time.

Moss did mature - over the past 2 seasons, the ONLY thing he did wrong was the walk-off. The moon wasn't an issue, never should have been.

Even so, the SIZE of the stink created - again - by the media was disproportionately large when held up to other actions by other players.

Look, don't misunderstand me here. I'm not - never have - endorsing the walk off. I'm not saying Randy did nothing wrong ever. What I am saying is that the totality of the circumstances does not warrant the type of response received. It was blown WAY out of proportion, and used as the means to dredge up every other flaw Randy had - real or imagined.

By the way, your kid analogy is cute, but doesn't really apply. It would be more accurate had you said, "But Mom, why can't I have that. You bought one for my twin brother". Randy was/is being judged by the SAME people who pass judgement on every other NFL player - the press and the fans. They are not answering to seperate authority figures in the larger picture.

So, since the same people are passing judgement, my question is, why are the standards for Randy so much HIGHER than the standards for everyone else? Why is it ok for Favre to walk off, but Randy gets hung? Why is it ok for Lewis to "allegedly" kill people, but Randy can't idle into an authority-exceeding meter maid? Why can TO dance on the Dallas star, cheer with the cheerleaders, and pull out a sharpie, but Moss can't FAKE a moon?

Standards, by definition, should apply equally to all - they don't.

Caine

happy camper
04-24-2005, 12:04 AM
judging people in terms of legal precidents is fine. because thats a court of law and theres a judge and a jury.

doesnt matter to me anyways. i dont care what everyone else has done. i judge moss harshly because he was a vikings. i judge him harshly because hes on my favorite team, and i deem him negative for the team.

Caine
04-24-2005, 03:23 AM
"happy camper" wrote:

judging people in terms of legal precidents is fine. because thats a court of law and theres a judge and a jury.

doesnt matter to me anyways. i dont care what everyone else has done. i judge moss harshly because he was a vikings. i judge him harshly because hes on my favorite team, and i deem him negative for the team.

What I'm railing against - and citing legal examples for - is the treatment Moss received from the Media. THEY were the judges, we - the fans - became the jury...unfortunately, too many took the judges words at face value.

You are entitled to your opinion - I simply disagree with it and have cited my reasons for doing so. At the end of the day, does it matter? Not really. Moss isn't a Viking, I'm never going to be a Raiders fan, and Green Bay still sucks.

I suppose, in a nut shell, what I was trying to do was to get people to examine the opinions they form, and who influences them. I don't buy into media hype, nor am I swayed by media condemnation. I base my opinions on as much information as I can gather (in a reasonable amount of time). I hope others do the same.

But, at the end of the day, we don't really need to worry about it. We have new Vikings to cheer for, a new season looming on the horizon, and Packer fans to castrate.

Life is good.

Caine

happy camper
04-24-2005, 04:09 AM
done.

BigMoInAZ
04-24-2005, 07:12 AM
"Caine" wrote:

"happy camper" wrote:

judging people in terms of legal precidents is fine. because thats a court of law and theres a judge and a jury.

doesnt matter to me anyways. i dont care what everyone else has done. i judge moss harshly because he was a vikings. i judge him harshly because hes on my favorite team, and i deem him negative for the team.

What I'm railing against - and citing legal examples for - is the treatment Moss received from the Media. THEY were the judges, we - the fans - became the jury...unfortunately, too many took the judges words at face value.

You are entitled to your opinion - I simply disagree with it and have cited my reasons for doing so. At the end of the day, does it matter? Not really. Moss isn't a Viking, I'm never going to be a Raiders fan, and Green Bay still sucks.

I suppose, in a nut shell, what I was trying to do was to get people to examine the opinions they form, and who influences them. I don't buy into media hype, nor am I swayed by media condemnation. I base my opinions on as much information as I can gather (in a reasonable amount of time). I hope others do the same.

But, at the end of the day, we don't really need to worry about it. We have new Vikings to cheer for, a new season looming on the horizon, and Packer fans to castrate.

Life is good.

Caine
Dammmmnnn partner! You speak from the heart! Wish I had your demeanor! Rep to you old timer!
:cheers: :salute:

collegeguyjeff
04-25-2005, 06:13 PM
why do people always talk about moss's attitude, what about terrell owens he thinks he is the receiver god?

VKG4LFE
04-25-2005, 06:16 PM
I agree, I didn't mind Moss' attitude that much. Oh well, he's no longer with us time to move on (I can't believe I'm saying that!)

ultravikingfan
04-25-2005, 10:36 PM
"collegeguyjeff" wrote:

why do people always talk about moss's attitude, what about terrell owens he thinks he is the receiver god?

We hate TO retarded butt more than anything!!!

happy camper
04-25-2005, 11:55 PM
"collegeguyjeff" wrote:

why do people always talk about moss's attitude, what about terrell owens he thinks he is the receiver god?

again, you cannot defend moss by placing guilt on another person.

ultravikingfan
04-26-2005, 02:18 AM
The title of the thread is, "How to Settle Your Feelings on the Moss Trade".

I think for a lot of you, this will only be settled once we start winning a lot of games next year! :wink:

Caine
04-26-2005, 05:02 AM
"happy camper" wrote:

"collegeguyjeff" wrote:

why do people always talk about moss's attitude, what about terrell owens he thinks he is the receiver god?

again, you cannot defend moss by placing guilt on another person.

Let's not go there again.

Caine