PDA

View Full Version : who will be tha nxt franchise QB



313zoe
03-30-2014, 04:53 PM
I think no matter which QB they draft if it's Bridgewater,Manziel,Garoppolo,or Mettenberger, i think they will be in good hands wit Norv Turner and I'm pretty sure if Turner feels he has wat it take to make it in da league then they will draft him. He helped develop Troy Aikman in Dallas, worked out Drew Brees when the Chargers drafted him and was San Diego's head coach during Philip Rivers' formative seasons

purpleblood32
03-30-2014, 05:35 PM
the more i see of this kid METTENBERGER i think he makes the most sense. at LSU HE MADE PLAYS DOWN FIELD AND IS 6'4'' 225 .HURT HIS ACL BUT I THINK HE PASSES MEDICAL WE GRAB HIM .LETS HOPE HE DOESNT GET DRAFTED IN THE EARLY 2ROUND ..IF CARR AND BRIDGEWATER DONT GET DRAFTED IN THE FIRTS TEN OR 8 ...LOOK TO SEE THEM DROP LIKE A ROCK BECAUSE LACK OF NEED AND A DEEP DRAFT ...

tarkenton10
03-31-2014, 07:29 AM
the more i see of this kid METTENBERGER i think he makes the most sense. at LSU HE MADE PLAYS DOWN FIELD AND IS 6'4'' 225 .HURT HIS ACL BUT I THINK HE PASSES MEDICAL WE GRAB HIM .LETS HOPE HE DOESNT GET DRAFTED IN THE EARLY 2ROUND ..IF CARR AND BRIDGEWATER DONT GET DRAFTED IN THE FIRTS TEN OR 8 ...LOOK TO SEE THEM DROP LIKE A ROCK BECAUSE LACK OF NEED AND A DEEP DRAFT ...

I agree he is a bargain if we can get him in the third or even McCarron in the fourth. I don't like McCarron as much but he has faced top talent in the SEC and I think he could be good if coached up. I think he all the intangibles.

Brewtal
04-03-2014, 11:42 PM
Bridgewater is not a first round pick, if they can take him in the second I could live with it. I would rather they went with Carr over Bridgewater. That being said would don't even want a qb with the #1 Pick, would rather take what is available later or even wait for next year.

drewlovs
04-05-2014, 01:40 AM
Of all the QBs, only Manziel shows that (he *MIGHT* be a superstar) wow talent. The rest look from competent to "I'm will to be lt in him due to the price"; as such, if Manziel is gone, I deep down really REALLY don't want to get a QB in the first round. I see Mechenberger as big a risk as Bortles. The only difference is Zachary blew he ACL, Bortles didn't.

I only see Manziel as a possible franchise QB, and even he has question marks. I still would bet on him though. A #8 is about the same as. #12, and all of us have NO problem with the amount of time given to Ponder nor the decision to move beyond him. I see Manziel in much the same light.

I think there WILL be a superstar QB in this draft, but if it's not Manziel, it's a crap shoot. Well, a BIGGER crap shoot.

purplepat
04-09-2014, 04:23 PM
Of all the QBs, only Manziel shows that (he *MIGHT* be a superstar) wow talent. The rest look from competent to "I'm will to be lt in him due to the price"; as such, if Manziel is gone, I deep down really REALLY don't want to get a QB in the first round. I see Mechenberger as big a risk as Bortles. The only difference is Zachary blew he ACL, Bortles didn't.

I only see Manziel as a possible franchise QB, and even he has question marks. I still would bet on him though. A #8 is about the same as. #12, and all of us have NO problem with the amount of time given to Ponder nor the decision to move beyond him. I see Manziel in much the same light.

I think there WILL be a superstar QB in this draft, but if it's not Manziel, it's a crap shoot. Well, a BIGGER crap shoot.

That's your opinion. I think Manziel has the biggest bust potential of any of the "big name" QBs in this draft. I'd bet a lot of the stuff he got away with in college won't work in the pros where everyone is bigger, stronger, faster. Many more of those balls he throws up for grabs will be picked off or knocked down, unless he's throwing to a Calvin Johnson or Brandon Marshall (which he likely won't be). I've ready many draft reports that say that Bridgewater is the star of this class and has ALL the tools to be a multiple Pro Bowl QB. I read one scouting report this morning that Manziel projects to be a 3rd round pick.

thorshammer
04-09-2014, 07:35 PM
How about the kid from Pitt .... getting a lot of buzz lately. Big kid with a pretty big arm. Drop back passer.

tarkenton10
04-10-2014, 08:25 AM
That's your opinion. I think Manziel has the biggest bust potential of any of the "big name" QBs in this draft. I'd bet a lot of the stuff he got away with in college won't work in the pros where everyone is bigger, stronger, faster. Many more of those balls he throws up for grabs will be picked off or knocked down, unless he's throwing to a Calvin Johnson or Brandon Marshall (which he likely won't be). I've ready many draft reports that say that Bridgewater is the star of this class and has ALL the tools to be a multiple Pro Bowl QB. I read one scouting report this morning that Manziel projects to be a 3rd round pick.

While that is true, he also has the highest ceiling. Does his game translate to the NFL? Some think so, some not but his talent and his scrambling is going to be fun to watch. I see him as a Tarkenton or even a Wilson.

I have read a lot of articles and I haven't heard any of them talking about Bridgewater and multiple pro bowls, which articles were they? They say he is the most NFL ready and he could be a good pro but pro bowls, I haven't heard that.

midgensa
04-10-2014, 09:12 AM
That's your opinion. I think Manziel has the biggest bust potential of any of the "big name" QBs in this draft. I'd bet a lot of the stuff he got away with in college won't work in the pros where everyone is bigger, stronger, faster. Many more of those balls he throws up for grabs will be picked off or knocked down, unless he's throwing to a Calvin Johnson or Brandon Marshall (which he likely won't be). I've ready many draft reports that say that Bridgewater is the star of this class and has ALL the tools to be a multiple Pro Bowl QB. I read one scouting report this morning that Manziel projects to be a 3rd round pick.

Well you should stop reading scouting reports that are old as shit.

Manziel is CERTAINLY going to be drafted in the first round. So, anyone projecting him to be picked in the 3rd round is not worth taking any time to read. Now, if they say they would not take him until the third round ... fine, but then they certainly will not get him.

I also have not seen ANYWHERE calling Bridgewater a multiple Pro Bowl QB. He is falling fast and since his atrocious Pro Day clearly more and more are looking at him as a nice QB at best.

JM clearly has the biggest boom possibility and very few are arguing with that. They also know that he has the biggest bust possibility. I have seen a few that think Bortles or even Carr could blossom into something special ... but almost every account I have read says we know exactly what we have in Bridgewater already. Which is a solid starter ... nothing more.

tarkenton10
04-10-2014, 09:57 AM
Well you should stop reading scouting reports that are old as shit.

Manziel is CERTAINLY going to be drafted in the first round. So, anyone projecting him to be picked in the 3rd round is not worth taking any time to read. Now, if they say they would not take him until the third round ... fine, but then they certainly will not get him.

I also have not seen ANYWHERE calling Bridgewater a multiple Pro Bowl QB. He is falling fast and since his atrocious Pro Day clearly more and more are looking at him as a nice QB at best.

JM clearly has the biggest boom possibility and very few are arguing with that. They also know that he has the biggest bust possibility. I have seen a few that think Bortles or even Carr could blossom into something special ... but almost every account I have read says we know exactly what we have in Bridgewater already. Which is a solid starter ... nothing more.

A+ post

drewlovs
04-10-2014, 12:43 PM
A+ post

Agreed.

It is amazing how some people can say the same thing I'm trying to say, and make me look like a struggling baboon with a keyboard.:p

tarkenton10
04-10-2014, 12:51 PM
Agreed.

It is amazing how some people can say the same thing I'm trying to say, and make me look like a struggling baboon with a keyboard.:p

LOL A+ post

Ranger
04-10-2014, 04:05 PM
the more i see of this kid METTENBERGER i think he makes the most sense. at LSU HE MADE PLAYS DOWN FIELD AND IS 6'4'' 225 .HURT HIS ACL BUT I THINK HE PASSES MEDICAL WE GRAB HIM .LETS HOPE HE DOESNT GET DRAFTED IN THE EARLY 2ROUND ..IF CARR AND BRIDGEWATER DONT GET DRAFTED IN THE FIRTS TEN OR 8 ...LOOK TO SEE THEM DROP LIKE A ROCK BECAUSE LACK OF NEED AND A DEEP DRAFT ...

Anybody that watched the 'Ole Miss game will be pretty skeptical with regards to Mettenberger. Didn't he get snatched up for a sex crime after getting beaten out of a job in Texas?

midgensa
04-10-2014, 06:56 PM
Anybody that watched the 'Ole Miss game will be pretty skeptical with regards to Mettenberger. Didn't he get snatched up for a sex crime after getting beaten out of a job in Texas?

Mettenberger definitely has some "issues" that should be flagged and discussed.

But as for the one Ole Miss game ... it happens ... to the best of them.

Mettenberger has ALL the tools that an average scout looks for. If it was not for his ACL injury he would be a first round lock and likely would be competing with the "Big 3" for a spot among the top 10 or so.

The knee injury is significant and the off field issues are significant and should be discussed. But he could end up being a total steal in the third round for someone if he falls that far.

midgensa
04-10-2014, 06:57 PM
Agreed.

It is amazing how some people can say the same thing I'm trying to say, and make me look like a struggling baboon with a keyboard.:p

Aw shucks ... thanks guys.

I never intend to make folks look like baboons ... but when I do ... I am glad its you and not me. :D

tarkenton10
04-11-2014, 08:24 AM
Aw shucks ... thanks guys.

I never intend to make folks look like baboons ... but when I do ... I am glad its you and not me. :D

I am Glad it's him and not me!! :rofl:

NodakPaul
04-11-2014, 08:55 AM
Well you should stop reading scouting reports that are old as shit.

Manziel is CERTAINLY going to be drafted in the first round. So, anyone projecting him to be picked in the 3rd round is not worth taking any time to read. Now, if they say they would not take him until the third round ... fine, but then they certainly will not get him.

I also have not seen ANYWHERE calling Bridgewater a multiple Pro Bowl QB. He is falling fast and since his atrocious Pro Day clearly more and more are looking at him as a nice QB at best.

JM clearly has the biggest boom possibility and very few are arguing with that. They also know that he has the biggest bust possibility. I have seen a few that think Bortles or even Carr could blossom into something special ... but almost every account I have read says we know exactly what we have in Bridgewater already. Which is a solid starter ... nothing more.

What I wouldn't do to have a solid starter at QB for the Vikings again though... Can't say I would be disappointed if Teddy was there at 8 (which I think he will be) and we take him (although I don't think we will).

midgensa
04-11-2014, 09:21 AM
What I wouldn't do to have a solid starter at QB for the Vikings again though... Can't say I would be disappointed if Teddy was there at 8 (which I think he will be) and we take him (although I don't think we will).

Oh ... I agree completely. I would think we would be hard pressed not to take him if Bortles and Manziel are off the board when we pick at No. 8. And the scouts are sometimes wrong. I was just commenting on the thread as it regards the common thought process on the two.

I would prefer Manziel. I like his swagger. I think he wants to prove the world wrong ... and I like that. But if we end up with Bridgewater and he ends up a solid starter for 10 years ... I am good with that. Though "solid starters" sometimes find their way into one Super Bowl (see Joe Flacco) they rarely find themselves in multiple. Though ... at this point ... one Super Bowl would feel like fifty.

tarkenton10
04-11-2014, 10:05 AM
Oh ... I agree completely. I would think we would be hard pressed not to take him if Bortles and Manziel are off the board when we pick at No. 8. And the scouts are sometimes wrong. I was just commenting on the thread as it regards the common thought process on the two.

I would prefer Manziel. I like his swagger. I think he wants to prove the world wrong ... and I like that. But if we end up with Bridgewater and he ends up a solid starter for 10 years ... I am good with that. Though "solid starters" sometimes find their way into one Super Bowl (see Joe Flacco) they rarely find themselves in multiple. Though ... at this point ... one Super Bowl would feel like fifty.

My only question would be if you are happy with a solid starter why would you waste the # 8 pick. The next level of QBs all seem to be solid starters on paper. Carr, Mettenberger, McCarron why not get them in the third and fourth rounds if you are looking for a solid starter. If we pick a QB at #8 I want the p[ick to be a very good starter that is why I have been saying I would draft Bortles or Manziel with the #8 pick and that is it at QB. If you want Bridgewater trade back and get a few picks.

C Mac D
04-11-2014, 10:09 AM
Vikes are conducting a private workout today for Jimmy Garoppolo (per Adam Schefter (https://twitter.com/AdamSchefter)).

Look for us to go defense first round, QB second or third. Feel like we're gonna end up with either Garoppolo or AJ McCarren.

purplehelmut
04-11-2014, 11:17 AM
NONE of these QBs are franchise QBs and NONE of them are worthy of top ten picks or first round for that matter. The only reason it's going to happen that way is the desperation many teams have at the position. I'm with the draft the best defensive guy we can get and pick up one of the QBs in the second or third round crowd. The line between the QBs is pretty fine anyway, as in none of them are going to step in and change a franchise, at least for the better. Maybe for the worse! I've said it before, until our defense stops giving up 30 points a game it won't matter who QBs this team.

C Mac D
04-11-2014, 12:25 PM
Now it's sounding like Mettenberger is the favorite...


Zach Mettenberger - College Player - 2014 Player Profile - Rotoworld.com (http://www.rotoworld.com/player/nfl/9379/zach-mettenberger)

LSU QB Zach Mettenberger dined with four Vikings officials following his Wednesday Pro Day.

rockymtdan
04-11-2014, 03:10 PM
Now it's sounding like Mettenberger is the favorite...

I dont know much about these young guys coming out in the draft, but what I know about Norv makes this look way more likely then Johnny Football ( or Tarkenton 2.0 ).
I would be in support of JF if they went that way and I would bite my tongue if he was a bust. On the other side if they draft Mettenberger and he ends up being Ponder 2.0. I will chim in early and often.
I do like the direction this club is going and I am more excited about Viking Football. Even if it take 2yrs to be competitive (as in SB contenders)

Lippythelion69
04-11-2014, 03:31 PM
None are worth a first round pick

MaxVike
04-11-2014, 08:45 PM
Now it's sounding like Mettenberger is the favorite...

agreed…I wrote this awhile back.

A Ponder-esque Dilemma
I would love to go to Happy Hour at a bar in Minny with a few of y'all and Zimm, Norv, and (yes) Spielman, and just watch/listen to some of us PP.Oers debate our points with true pros.

Regardless of the points, many valid, the likelihood that Bortles, Bridgewater, Manziel, Mettenberger, McCarron, Carr, Fales, or Garropolo all succeed, or most, is unlikely. The odds that two, possibly three, succeed, is more likely. Of course, the definition of "succeed" is widely varied, and depends on your lens. Did Tommy Kramer succeed? Wade Wilson? Rich Gannon?

Arguments can be made for drafting each and everyone of them, depending on strategy and scenario.

By the way, I've seen mention to the "watch film on 'him'," as a challenge to some points. Kevon, are you watching the same film as Zimm, Norv, Spielman, etc.? If so, cool. If not, stop.

Yes, I have opinions too... I think if any of the "top 3" QBs are available at #8, the trigger will be pulled. If not, Mettenberger is the target.
Last edited by MaxVike; 03-20-2014 at 06:06 AM.

purpleblood32
04-12-2014, 08:35 AM
i can see spielman given up our second and third pick to jump into the bottom of the first. to get a qb that might get picked a head of them in the second

Brewtal
04-12-2014, 11:52 AM
Bridgewater is a disaster waiting to happen. He is the next Travaras Jackson, he will not be able to handle the pressure and you will be able to see his knee's shaking under pressure. I would not take him even in the 3rd or 4th round.

Rage4Order
04-12-2014, 02:57 PM
Id be willing to bet it wont be Manziel that we draft. I would almost say its certain that they wont. All you need to know to verify this fact is look at Norv Turners history with QBs. IN actuality I think Cassel will flourish under Norvs system. There are a few of these qbs that I do like, Carr, Mettenberger, Matthews, Savage to name a few.

Rage4Order
04-12-2014, 03:40 PM
Im also tired of hearing about look at the competition that Manziel has faced in the SEC. How many championships did he win? His game will transfer to the NFL as good as Tebows did. Tebow was a much better team leader than manziel ever thought of being. On the argument of competition faced how many starting qbs in NFl are from SEC schools. The Mannings and Cutler are all I can come up with off top of head. Oh wait forgot Cam Newton.

mountainviking
04-12-2014, 06:47 PM
Now it's sounding like Mettenberger is the favorite...


One NFC team picking in the 20s told us that they expect the Minnesota Vikings to take Carr with the eighth-overall pick, unless he is selected by the Raiders at No. 5 overall.

A year ago, most of the attention on the quarterback prospects was focused on Geno Smith and Matt Barkley. Many pundits were surprised when E.J. Manuel was selected first. Once again, teams in the top 10 aren't following the consensus signal-caller rankings. At least three feel that Carr is the second-best quarterback prospect in the draft.


WalterFootball.com: NFL Draft Rumor Mill (http://walterfootball.com/nfldraftrumormill.php)

D'oh!! I hope the Raiders take him, Carr's about the only one I don't want at 8...that or moving up for one of the other guys. I just don't like how he reacts to pressure in his face, as shown in his bowl game, terribly. Same problem his brother had, makes me way too nervous for a top ten pick.

I hope we can move back, land a defensive difference maker like Mosley or Gilbert or Dennard, and then perhaps move back up around Denver's spot at 31 to grab our target QB before the round 2 QB rush gets rolling.

singersp
04-13-2014, 09:06 AM
Bridgewater struggling in private workouts

Bridgewater struggling in private workouts | ProFootballTalk (http://profootballtalk.nbcsports.com/2014/04/12/bridgewater-struggling-in-private-workouts/)

purplepat
04-13-2014, 09:52 AM
[/B] A year ago, most of the attention on the quarterback prospects was focused on Geno Smith and Matt Barkley. Many pundits were surprised when E.J. Manuel was selected first. Once again, teams in the top 10 aren't following the consensus signal-caller rankings. At least three feel that Carr is the second-best quarterback prospect in the draft.


And for all the pimping they received, Smith dropped into the 2nd round and Barkley dropped into the 4th (and looked horrid when he was forced in to play).

Ted Dibiase
04-14-2014, 09:08 AM
Of course we all know to take pre-draft chatter with a grain of salt. If Bridgewater's private workouts really were shaky, what would be the benefit of getting that word out? Odds are, people want him to slide for some reason. I'm not saying the guy is Andrew Luck, but it is amazing just how much his stock has dropped since his last game, in which he looked every bit of the #1 QB in this draft. I am still hoping we get him at #8.

drewlovs
04-14-2014, 01:10 PM
Of course we all know to take pre-draft chatter with a grain of salt. If Bridgewater's private workouts really were shaky, what would be the benefit of getting that word out? Odds are, people want him to slide for some reason. I'm not saying the guy is Andrew Luck, but it is amazing just how much his stock has dropped since his last game, in which he looked every bit of the #1 QB in this draft. I am still hoping we get him at #8.

If we take him, I hope you are right, and there are as many reasons to believe you are as there are ones stating the exact opposite.

The real problem is college QB excellence does not translate to NFL excellence; otherwise, we would have a wealth of GREAT NFL QBs! There is a big jump mainly because in every college team, the defense has a "hole", aka one or 2 players that just aren't as good as the rest of the team. A decent QB can identify and hit those holes, looking awesome in the process.

In the NFL, the worst players on opposing defenses are some of the "elite" talent they avoided in college!! It is only then that we know whether a guy's college talent translates to NFL talent, and of course, that is after we have drafted him.

I saw some tape on Norv Turner when he worked with Aikman at Dallas, and the one thing I now think Turner is looking for in the draft in a QB above all else is accuracy. That was the one intangible Aikman had in excessive amounts, and Turner used it to create a balanced attack (with Emmitt Smith) to win 3 Super Bowls.

NOW!! Who is the most accurate QB in this year's draft?

tarkenton10
04-14-2014, 01:31 PM
If we take him, I hope you are right, and there are as many reasons to believe you are as there are ones stating the exact opposite.

The real problem is college QB excellence does not translate to NFL excellence; otherwise, we would have a wealth of GREAT NFL QBs! There is a big jump mainly because in every college team, the defense has a "hole", aka one or 2 players that just aren't as good as the rest of the team. A decent QB can identify and hit those holes, looking awesome in the process.

In the NFL, the worst players on opposing defenses are some of the "elite" talent they avoided in college!! It is only then that we know whether a guy's college talent translates to NFL talent, and of course, that is after we have drafted him.

I saw some tape on Norv Turner when he worked with Aikman at Dallas, and the one thing I now think Turner is looking for in the draft in a QB above all else is accuracy. That was the one intangible Aikman had in excessive amounts, and Turner used it to create a balanced attack (with Emmitt Smith) to win 3 Super Bowls.

NOW!! Who is the most accurate QB in this year's draft?

I agree with you and Turner to a certain extent, intelligence trumps everything for me. You have to have some talent in the other fields, obviously but if someone is accurate and intelligent like Joe Montana I will take him, I would almost say they should go hand in hand.

tastywaves
04-14-2014, 01:55 PM
I agree with you and Turner to a certain extent, intelligence trumps everything for me. You have to have some talent in the other fields, obviously but if someone is accurate and intelligent like Joe Montana I will take him, I would almost say they should go hand in hand.

Not so much intelligence as mental makeup. Strong minds that are uber competitive, drive themselves to constantly improve and elevate their game when it matters the most. Smarts not so much a factor IMO.

A lot of good arms fail in the NFL because they can't adjust to the speed and the pressure of the game.

Same can be said for reverse as well. That is, guys with great mental makeup fail in the NFL because their arm isn't capable of making the throws.

You need a certain level of both mental and physical, but one can help overcome deficiencies in the other.

The physical is fairly easy to evaluate, the mental not so much.

mountainviking
04-14-2014, 02:36 PM
WalterFootball.com: 2014 NFL Trade Mock (http://walterfootball.com/draft2014trades.php)

Wow! Really!?? Ouch on the picks...I'd almost rather give up just next year's first to move up and keep this years picks in a deep draft for our other needs! They better really love them some Bortles!! ;)


*** Trade 1: Minnesota trades a 2014 second-round pick, 2014 third-round pick and 2015 second-round pick for the No. 2 overall selection. ***

The Vikings want Blake Bortles, but they're out of position to draft him. They'll have to trade up; possibly to No. 2 to leap the Jaguars and Browns if the Texans end up taking Jadeveon Clowney. There's no chance Bortles makes it to No. 8, so Minnesota will probably have to settle for a linebacker (Anthony Barr) and then Zach Mettenberger in Round 2, as Tony Pauline reported.


WalterFootball.com: NFL Draft Rumor Mill (http://walterfootball.com/nfldraftrumormill.php)


One team that is a prime contender to move up with St. Louis is the Minnesota Vikings. Sources have told us that the Vikings are a real contender to move up for Central Florida quarterback Blake Bortles.

That trade was documented in two recent mock drafts on WalterFootball.com in Walt's trade mock and my mock . His good work ethic meshes well with the new coaching staff, and sources say that Bortles is the Vikings' top-rated quarterback with Derek Carr as their No. 2 quarterback.

jargomcfargo
04-14-2014, 05:23 PM
WalterFootball.com: 2014 NFL Trade Mock (http://walterfootball.com/draft2014trades.php)

Wow! Really!?? Ouch on the picks...I'd almost rather give up just next year's first to move up and keep this years picks in a deep draft for our other needs! They better really love them some Bortles!! ;)



WalterFootball.com: NFL Draft Rumor Mill (http://walterfootball.com/nfldraftrumormill.php)
Last week the Vikings were targeting Mettenberger. It is rare for the truth to leak out to the press this time of year. If I could spell the word, I would call it subterfuge! Hype the players you would like to see get picked before your pick and ignore, or act negative towards those you covet.
I would not be surprised if they have an interest in Bortles. I would be shocked if they moved up to get him.

Brewtal
04-15-2014, 01:17 AM
Bridgewater is a questionable 2nd round pick. Do not think any of the qb a worthy of a #8 pick and only can see it acceptable to pull one in the 1st round if they trade back. I remember watching an interview of a defensive player who faced Bridgewater and he said that he takes a few hits and gets shaken up. The last thing the Vikings need is anther qb who's knees shake as soon as he gets under pressure.

mountainviking
04-15-2014, 09:37 AM
Yeah, smoke and mirrors showing more smoke...specially with an extra two weeks of BS before the draft!

So far I've read rumors about The Vikings being interested in Garappolo (way early) Mettenberger (after boosting defense in the first,) Carr, and now, possibly moving up for Bortles. On the other hand, the only one they said anything negative about was Johny F'n Football...

So, the conclusion is? We'll dance to the podium with JFM on the card if he's still on the board!? ;)

thorshammer
04-15-2014, 10:27 AM
Looks like we are taking a serious look at Bridgewater .....
http://sports.yahoo.com/news/vikings-extend-bridgewater-visit-151407757--nfl.html

drewlovs
04-15-2014, 01:47 PM
I don't believe ANYTHING reporters "discover" when it comes to what any of the 32 teams are going to do in the draft. It is a disaster to have those types of trades being discussed only to find out that everyone knows that is what you plan to do.

I DO think they are not above floating ideas to see the league's reaction, however. I still expect them to either draft a player they are willing to give the #8 to, or trade back if all those players they feel are worth #8 are gone.

tastywaves
04-15-2014, 02:39 PM
I don't believe ANYTHING reporters "discover" when it comes to what any of the 32 teams are going to do in the draft. It is a disaster to have those types of trades being discussed only to find out that everyone knows that is what you plan to do.

I DO think they are not above floating ideas to see the league's reaction, however. I still expect them to either draft a player they are willing to give the #8 to, or trade back if all those players they feel are worth #8 are gone.

The report says he came in on Saturday and stayed until Monday. No reason to believe this is not the case. The title is actually not misleading for a change.

What you want to make of that information is up to each individual.

My take is that the Vikings do have interest and are making sure they do adequate homework on the guy so they hopefully make the right choice in terms of if/when to draft him. I would hope that all top candidates are given similar treatment if the talent evaluators feels it is needed to complete their grading.

Another way to look at it is the Vikings staff isn't in agreement in where Bridgewater should project and want to spend more time with him to help get more clarity. Other top athletes they may feel more confident in the current data compiled and don't feel they warrant further looks.

Does it lend our hand to another team? Maybe, but probably not much. Picking at #8, there are a ton of scenarios that can play out and how much time we spend with an individual athlete doing evaluations is just another piece of data to digest.

I don't think they would spend this much time with him if there was no interest.

VikesfaninWis
04-15-2014, 03:09 PM
Read today that the insiders are hearing that many of the teams in the top 10 of the draft that need a QB may pass on a QB. They didn't specifically mention the Vikings, but they did mention the Texans, Jaguars, Browns, and Tampa as all being teams that need a QB but may pass on one. If Manziel is there at #8, I think the Vikings will have a hard time passing on him. I would rather have a LB like Barr or Mack at #8 and draft a QB in rd 2

drewlovs
04-15-2014, 05:34 PM
The report says he came in on Saturday and stayed until Monday. No reason to believe this is not the case. The title is actually not misleading for a change.

What you want to make of that information is up to each individual.

My take is that the Vikings do have interest and are making sure they do adequate homework on the guy so they hopefully make the right choice in terms of if/when to draft him. I would hope that all top candidates are given similar treatment if the talent evaluators feels it is needed to complete their grading.

Another way to look at it is the Vikings staff isn't in agreement in where Bridgewater should project and want to spend more time with him to help get more clarity. Other top athletes they may feel more confident in the current data compiled and don't feel they warrant further looks.

Does it lend our hand to another team? Maybe, but probably not much. Picking at #8, there are a ton of scenarios that can play out and how much time we spend with an individual athlete doing evaluations is just another piece of data to digest.

I don't think they would spend this much time with him if there was no interest.

I should have been specific, I was referring to the trade talk on the previous page.

Sorry.

singersp
04-16-2014, 06:43 AM
Of course we all know to take pre-draft chatter with a grain of salt. If Bridgewater's private workouts really were shaky, what would be the benefit of getting that word out? Odds are, people want him to slide for some reason. I'm not saying the guy is Andrew Luck, but it is amazing just how much his stock has dropped since his last game, in which he looked every bit of the #1 QB in this draft. I am still hoping we get him at #8.

I'm not interested in how he looked in his last game only, I'm interested in how he looked in his entire body of work.

He didn't even look good in his "scripted" workout.

singersp
04-16-2014, 06:44 AM
Johnny Manziel Not Target, Mike Zimmer Seeks Draft Trade Down After Norv Turner Favors Zach Mettenberger, AJ McCarron at Quarterback

Minnesota Vikings Rumors: Johnny Manziel Not Target, Mike Zimmer Seeks Draft Trade Down After Norv Turner Favors Zach Mettenberger, AJ McCarron at Quarterback : US : Sports World Report (http://www.sportsworldreport.com/articles/29189/20140415/minnesota-vikings-rumors-johnny-manziel-target-mike-zimmer-seeks-draft-trade-norv-turner-zach-mettenberger-aj-mccarron-quarterback.htm)

singersp
04-16-2014, 06:45 AM
Are The Minnesota Vikings About To Gamble On Blake Bortles?

Are The Minnesota Vikings About To Gamble On Blake Bortles? - iSports Times (http://www.isportstimes.com/articles/11339/20140415/minnesota-vikings-gamble-blake-bortles.htm)

Ted Dibiase
04-16-2014, 07:18 AM
I'm not interested in how he looked in his last game only, I'm interested in how he looked in his entire body of work.

He didn't even look good in his "scripted" workout.
I'm not saying I'm ONLY interested in his last game. I just give it a lot more weight than anything that's happened since then because he hasn't played in a game since then. And his entire body of work is great. I suppose where we disagree is the relevance of the scripted workout. Some say he can't handle pressure because of it. I say it's a different kind of pressure. It's not irrelevant, but making throws in a quiet environment is different than having four or five huge people coming at you and you have to keep your eyes off of them and down the field to find a receiver. He's done pretty darn well with that kind of pressure up to this point. In the workout he has a handful of people who he knows are nitpicking about mechanics and footwork and ball flight. In a game he has to read a defense (big strength) and locate the best receiver while stuff is quickly breaking down.

drewlovs
04-16-2014, 11:20 AM
NFLAM talked a lot about how teams deal with the draft and showing their hands before the draft in depth yesterday, and some of the things they said surprised me. Did you know LT (the RB, not the HoF Giant) was never worked out, or even TALKED to by the Chargers before they drafted him? They had example after example of teams showing interest in a player ONLY to make other teams misunderstand who they would eventually draft.

The one thing I took from the show is, until the last week before the draft, ignore the mocks and news reports, because they are FULL of subterfuge. As such, I believe we will trade up as much as I believe we will trade down or even draft Manziel.

jargomcfargo
04-16-2014, 11:55 AM
Are The Minnesota Vikings About To Gamble On Blake Bortles?

Are The Minnesota Vikings About To Gamble On Blake Bortles? - iSports Times (http://www.isportstimes.com/articles/11339/20140415/minnesota-vikings-gamble-blake-bortles.htm)
The guy who wrote this article has Bortles going to the Texans with the first pick in his mock draft.
The tweet he is using, to say the Vikings have Bortles as number one on their QB list, comes from a writer who covers the Pacers for the most part.
Pretty obscure sources for insider info on the Vikings.
Bortles at 8 is a reach for a developmental QB. Moving up and giving up next years first rounder and more seems unlikely.

thorshammer
04-16-2014, 06:06 PM
Let's go defense and get this guy later.... Tom Savage
http://sports.yahoo.com/blogs/nfl-shutdown-corner/nfl-draft-under-the-microscope--pittsburgh-qb-tom-savage-234107710.html

Rage4Order
04-16-2014, 06:52 PM
Will any of you who think we will draft Johnny football, explain to me where in anyway shape or form he fits what Norv does from an offensive standpoint. He does nothing well that Norv wants from his QBs. He can not stand in pocket and make good reads and accurate throws. Not to mention read the defense and make quick decisions. Mark my words he would not succeed in a Norv ran structured offense.

Rage4Order
04-16-2014, 07:02 PM
All these top 3 Qbs are project QB, since when is it all right to use pick 8 in first round on a project. That is supposed to be a help me now spot to draft from.

singersp
04-17-2014, 06:09 AM
I'm not saying I'm ONLY interested in his last game. I just give it a lot more weight than anything that's happened since then because he hasn't played in a game since then. And his entire body of work is great. I suppose where we disagree is the relevance of the scripted workout. Some say he can't handle pressure because of it. I say it's a different kind of pressure. It's not irrelevant, but making throws in a quiet environment is different than having four or five huge people coming at you and you have to keep your eyes off of them and down the field to find a receiver. He's done pretty darn well with that kind of pressure up to this point. In the workout he has a handful of people who he knows are nitpicking about mechanics and footwork and ball flight. In a game he has to read a defense (big strength) and locate the best receiver while stuff is quickly breaking down.

My point is, if he can't complete passes in a "quiet environment" that's scripted with no defenders coming at him or defending his receivers, how is he going to do it on game day when he has all those pressures & defenders?

singersp
04-17-2014, 06:11 AM
All these top 3 Qbs are project QB, since when is it all right to use pick 8 in first round on a project. That is supposed to be a help me now spot to draft from.

Supply & demand. (See Ponder, 2011)

Ted Dibiase
04-17-2014, 10:35 AM
My point is, if he can't complete passes in a "quiet environment" that's scripted with no defenders coming at him or defending his receivers, how is he going to do it on game day when he has all those pressures & defenders?
I suppose the same way he did it in college. Different defenses in the NFL but that same uncertainty goes with any QB.

Rage4Order
04-17-2014, 10:57 AM
Supply & demand. (See Ponder, 2011)

And we saw how that worked out...

singersp
04-20-2014, 08:55 AM
A case for Bortles or Bridgewater at No. 8 to the Vikings

Craig: A case for Bortles or Bridgewater at No. 8 to the Vikings | Star Tribune (http://www.startribune.com/sports/vikings/255885421.html)

drewlovs
04-23-2014, 02:20 PM
Will any of you who think we will draft Johnny football, explain to me where in anyway shape or form he fits what Norv does from an offensive standpoint. He does nothing well that Norv wants from his QBs. He can not stand in pocket and make good reads and accurate throws. Not to mention read the defense and make quick decisions. Mark my words he would not succeed in a Norv ran structured offense.

To accept this premise is to accept neither Manziel NOR Turner can succeed if they have to deviate from what they have done in the past. I have seen games with Manziel where he stayed in the pocket and picked the defense apart the whole game... it wasn't one of his "showy" games, and as such, isn't played over and over again on Sportscenter. But has done it, and he is young enough to develop those skills if it is required.

Turner has always liked to emphasize the run game, and allow that to open up the passing for his QB. As such, a QB who takes a lot of chances doesn't really "fit"; but a QB who sits in the pocket then gets sacked because he can't do anything else doesn't "fit" with ANYONE'S offensive scheme. It's a given that Manziel needs to lean on his OL, go through he progressions, and work on throwing properly ALL the time, not just in spurts. But saying he cannot is just as presumptuous as saying he will flourish in Turner's system.

In the end, Turner and Zimmer themselves will decide if the kids will work; if they DO, then I respect their decision. If they don't, I'll pout a little bit and then root for whoever they decide on.

Rage4Order
04-23-2014, 07:08 PM
To accept this premise is to accept neither Manziel NOR Turner can succeed if they have to deviate from what they have done in the past. I have seen games with Manziel where he stayed in the pocket and picked the defense apart the whole game... it wasn't one of his "showy" games, and as such, isn't played over and over again on Sportscenter. But has done it, and he is young enough to develop those skills if it is required.

Turner has always liked to emphasize the run game, and allow that to open up the passing for his QB. As such, a QB who takes a lot of chances doesn't really "fit"; but a QB who sits in the pocket then gets sacked because he can't do anything else doesn't "fit" with ANYONE'S offensive scheme. It's a given that Manziel needs to lean on his OL, go through he progressions, and work on throwing properly ALL the time, not just in spurts. But saying he cannot is just as presumptuous as saying he will flourish in Turner's system.

In the end, Turner and Zimmer themselves will decide if the kids will work; if they DO, then I respect their decision. If they don't, I'll pout a little bit and then root for whoever they decide on.

Your missing the point. Before we hired Norv we already knew about Manziel. So here is my point. Why in gods green earth would you hire a OC who has a 20+ year track record of building an offense and mind you very successfully. Running a certain offense with certain traits he likes in QBs and then draft him a qb who doesn't fit what he does, and tell him to change for some rookie who in reality shouldn't even be in convo for a pick at 8. None of these QBs are worth it. As others have stated on here Zimmer is defensive minded do you think he wants to put the faith of his first draft in such a risky pick. I don't argue Manziel was an amazing college football player. I just don't see his skills translating to NFL offenses.

Rage4Order
04-23-2014, 07:22 PM
Not to mention a lot of people on here are really down on Derek Carr because of his bowl game. Fresno State vs USC, his offensive line was horrible. He lit it up during senior bowl practices and game. Trust me this is in no way me saying he will be a good QB. Just making a point. I have not just watched sportscenter, for highlight reels. Ive watched hours of videos on a good number of these qbs. Ive seen Manziel in the pocket but almost always he even thinks someone might come free hes ready to take off. Straight up his strength is improvisation. Not pocket presence and reading the defense in front of him.

313zoe
04-23-2014, 09:00 PM
None of these QB's are going to cum in and start and make an impact so why draft somebody that high that wont start thats why they need to focus on defense wit tha first two picks a LB and CB and Boyd wouldn't be bad for a late draft pick

drewlovs
04-24-2014, 11:58 AM
Not to mention a lot of people on here are really down on Derek Carr because of his bowl game. Fresno State vs USC, his offensive line was horrible. He lit it up during senior bowl practices and game. Trust me this is in no way me saying he will be a good QB. Just making a point. I have not just watched sportscenter, for highlight reels. Ive watched hours of videos on a good number of these qbs. Ive seen Manziel in the pocket but almost always he even thinks someone might come free hes ready to take off. Straight up his strength is improvisation. Not pocket presence and reading the defense in front of him.

I did get your point, which was why I said there is limited proof that Manziel can do well in a pocket QB style offense. The Vanderbilt game is a good example, where he obviously was not afraid of the Vanderbilt defense getting to him; he stayed in the pocket and picked them apart. But overall, he obviously had trust issues with part of his OL in college... how will he react to having a very good one?

I think Turner has the ability to work in JFM's innate abilities to escape pocket collapses IF Manziel is willing to do most of his throwing from the pocket. In other words, if Zimmer and Turner think they can turn Manziel into more of a Steve Young, he WILL work in Turner's offense. I lived in the Bay Area for 15 years and saw just about every 49er game (it was the only frikkin game on), and Young preferred (when he matured) staying in the pocket and only using his feet when he had to. If Manziel can learn to do that, or more importantly, Turner and Zimmer think they can TEACH him that, they will pick him.

If not, they won't. Turner will not create a completely new offense for Johnny, with this I agree.

Rage4Order
04-24-2014, 02:42 PM
I did get your point, which was why I said there is limited proof that Manziel can do well in a pocket QB style offense. The Vanderbilt game is a good example, where he obviously was not afraid of the Vanderbilt defense getting to him; he stayed in the pocket and picked them apart. But overall, he obviously had trust issues with part of his OL in college... how will he react to having a very good one?

I think Turner has the ability to work in JFM's innate abilities to escape pocket collapses IF Manziel is willing to do most of his throwing from the pocket. In other words, if Zimmer and Turner think they can turn Manziel into more of a Steve Young, he WILL work in Turner's offense. I lived in the Bay Area for 15 years and saw just about every 49er game (it was the only frikkin game on), and Young preferred (when he matured) staying in the pocket and only using his feet when he had to. If Manziel can learn to do that, or more importantly, Turner and Zimmer think they can TEACH him that, they will pick him.

If not, they won't. Turner will not create a completely new offense for Johnny, with this I agree.

Your statements alone tell me we will not draft him. Manziel will only succeed in NFL if he goes to a team that will design a certain offense for him to play in, even that is questionable. Picking apart a Vanderbilt offense from the pocket is not saying much. NFL defenses will eat him up with all that running around and just throwing the ball up for grabs. I could care less what he is doing off the field as long as he is not a criminal. Going to bars, getting money for autographs, should never even be mentioned its menial means nothing. I myself like Manziel as a football player I liked Tebow alot as well. They are both extremely fun to watch play football. Im just a fan of the game of football and of course our Vikings.
I just have a firm belief that none of these qbs are worth a pick at 8. I do believe that Carr, Mettenberger would be successful with Norv. But not at 8. Carr will be gone by end of first, I wouldn't be surprised if he even gets drafted before one or two of the supposed big 3. I just see too many defensive needs in this draft, LBs in particular to take a qb at 8. Don't wanna see pick 8 used on a qb we will have to wait and see for 3 more years to see if he pans out.

tastywaves
04-24-2014, 02:59 PM
I did get your point, which was why I said there is limited proof that Manziel can do well in a pocket QB style offense. The Vanderbilt game is a good example, where he obviously was not afraid of the Vanderbilt defense getting to him; he stayed in the pocket and picked them apart. But overall, he obviously had trust issues with part of his OL in college... how will he react to having a very good one?

I think Turner has the ability to work in JFM's innate abilities to escape pocket collapses IF Manziel is willing to do most of his throwing from the pocket. In other words, if Zimmer and Turner think they can turn Manziel into more of a Steve Young, he WILL work in Turner's offense. I lived in the Bay Area for 15 years and saw just about every 49er game (it was the only frikkin game on), and Young preferred (when he matured) staying in the pocket and only using his feet when he had to. If Manziel can learn to do that, or more importantly, Turner and Zimmer think they can TEACH him that, they will pick him.

If not, they won't. Turner will not create a completely new offense for Johnny, with this I agree.

It doesn't get much better than A&M's offensive line. If Johnny has trust issues with them, it will be much worse in the NFL.

Personally, I don't think it was so much trust, it was just that he had a lot of success in scrambling and improvising so he just kept doing it. Added bonus that he gets to make more highlight reels that way. A&M doesn't care about preparing Manziel for the NFL, so why force him into it if he is succeeding playing Johnny ball.

Rage4Order
04-24-2014, 03:14 PM
It doesn't get much better than A&M's offensive line. If Johnny has trust issues with them, it will be much worse in the NFL.

Personally, I don't think it was so much trust, it was just that he had a lot of success in scrambling and improvising so he just kept doing it. Added bonus that he gets to make more highlight reels that way. A&M doesn't care about preparing Manziel for the NFL, so why force him into it if he is succeeding playing Johnny ball.

+1

drewlovs
04-24-2014, 03:38 PM
It doesn't get much better than A&M's offensive line. If Johnny has trust issues with them, it will be much worse in the NFL.

Personally, I don't think it was so much trust, it was just that he had a lot of success in scrambling and improvising so he just kept doing it. Added bonus that he gets to make more highlight reels that way. A&M doesn't care about preparing Manziel for the NFL, so why force him into it if he is succeeding playing Johnny ball.

An OL is only as good as its weakest link; if one of the guards or tackles is getting beat consistently, I really don't think it matter how good they are on paper. Last year the Vikings had one of the best OLs in the NFL on paper at the beginning of the season, as per the NFL Network... a lot of good that did us.

Look, the one thing everyone agrees on is Manziel has a large hill to climb to be successful in the NFL. We tend to focus on his scrambling... why? Because its frikkin exciting, and makes great film bites for our consumption. But I really could give a crap about it, to tell the truth. Pryor in Oakland was also very good at scrambling, but it didn't do too much for the team in the end, did it?

All these QBs are about possibilities; none of them will be superstars in 2014 (unless a Cleveland drafts one and shoves him in at the beginning of the season, and that player has all my sympathy). I like what he brings to the table, and the possibilities of a Manziel are a huge amount of fun to think on for our team. In the end, it really doesn't matter what we think, does it?

He will either mature into a superstar, or blow up spectacularly, with all the hoopla the NFL can provide. One draft pick in any draft, barring a Sapp, Lawrence Taylor or Andrew Luck sitting there to be taken, will not be remembered. But PASSING on a guy like that WILL. If Clowney or Mack is there at 8, I expect this whole conversation to be a mote point.

PackSux!
04-24-2014, 06:47 PM
My guess is Derek Carr.

I predicted in another thread that we would draft BPA other than a quarterback with pick number eight. Then trade back into the first round with Cinci at 24 and snag Carr before Cleveland in case they are thinking they can get him at 26.

QFFL
04-24-2014, 07:00 PM
My guess is Derek Carr.

I predicted in another thread that we would draft BPA other than a quarterback with pick number eight. Then trade back into the first round with Cinci at 24 and snag Carr before Cleveland in case they are thinking they can get him at 26.

Even though I like your idea better. But the team probably will use the 8th pick to draft a QB. With the sliding QB stock, I can only hope they get the right one.

jargomcfargo
04-24-2014, 11:03 PM
If he lacks accuracy, poise under pressure, and the ability to read defenses, he will bust. Who in this draft has those attributes ?
If the answer is nobody then it would be foolish to waste an early pick on a QB.

drewlovs
04-25-2014, 11:18 AM
NFL Network is abuzz with the fact that there are not enough QBs available to all the teams who need to get QBs to develop. Couple that with the top QBs having both good and bad traits, with none being a Luck or RGIII, you have a potentially ugly QB draft. Most of these guys should be going in the 3rd round or later, but if you wait that long, there might not be any left.

As an example, Savage should NOT go earlier than the 5th round due to the question marks, but most analysts think, at this time, he will be drafted by someone in the SECOND.

If a GM and coach think a QB is a year away from being a stud, they had better get that guy in the first or early second, or chance are they will be shit out of luck.

Of course, this all might change tomorrow. This draft will be FULL of surprises.

tastywaves
04-25-2014, 03:52 PM
I think there are plenty of QB's to go around. Just not many organizations that can identify or put them in a position to succeed.

The rare QB will succeed no matter what circumstance they are put in, but the majority of successful QB's were put in an environment that allowed them success.

mountainviking
04-26-2014, 03:57 PM
I think there are plenty of QB's to go around. Just not many organizations that can identify or put them in a position to succeed.

The rare QB will succeed no matter what circumstance they are put in, but the majority of successful QB's were put in an environment that allowed them success.

Nice post! Spot on.

313zoe
04-26-2014, 06:34 PM
Seen a lot of clips of David Fales he wouldn't be bad for a 3rd round pick

Paul Simpson
04-27-2014, 08:36 AM
My friend has a system, based on imperfect science that qbs will play like their name, Luck will be just fine but Ponder will be ponderous...based on this terrible science we should not pick David Fales

purpleblood32
04-27-2014, 07:22 PM
if speilman waste a high draft pick on a qb he is a bigger IDIOT THE CHILLY .CASSELL WILL BE FINE .DRAFT A GUY IN THE LATER ROUNDS AND D E V E L O P E HIM .COACH HIM UP...CASSELL IS A SAVY VET A GOOD MENTOR ..BORTLE BRIDGEWATER CARR ...I WOULD BE SURPRISE IF WE DRAFT ONE OF THESE GUYS AT 8 ...BUT IF YOU DO HE SHOULD BE UR STARTER ...AND IM NOT SURE THEY CAN DO THAT .

drewlovs
04-28-2014, 01:32 PM
My friend has a system, based on imperfect science that qbs will play like their name, Luck will be just fine but Ponder will be ponderous...based on this terrible science we should not pick David Fales

Lol.

TeamSoftware
04-29-2014, 09:48 AM
My friend has a system, based on imperfect science that qbs will play like their name, Luck will be just fine but Ponder will be ponderous...based on this terrible science we should not pick David Fales

Of course we have "Turner" so perhaps "Fales" would be a positive instead of a negative.

--Scott

purpleblood32
05-03-2014, 05:21 PM
i said mettenberger before and still think ,he is spielman man ...strong arm ...has the size you like and played top competion...spielman like grabbing guys that drop in draft because of injury questions too ...i think if he makes past 40..and most teams grab their qb in the top of the second ..we will wait til 3rd and take him..

kevoncox
05-03-2014, 10:43 PM
i said mettenberger before and still think ,he is spielman man ...strong arm ...has the size you like and played top competion...spielman like grabbing guys that drop in draft because of injury questions too ...i think if he makes past 40..and most teams grab their qb in the top of the second ..we will wait til 3rd and take him..

Only issue is his speed and the fact that he falls apart when blitzed... yikes

drewlovs
05-04-2014, 10:25 PM
If we do not take Bortles, Manziel or Bridgewater, I REALLY hope we just get the other necessary parts we are missing and get a project QB for the future.

Which one? Pick one, at this point, your guess will be as good as theirs...

Brewtal
05-04-2014, 11:11 PM
Bridgewater will end any hope for a superbowl for the next 5 years.