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Tad7
10-12-2010, 06:16 PM
Not Time to Panic
Written by Tarvaris Jackson / October 12, 2010

I want you fans to know that were off to a slow start at 1-3, but its a long football season and anything can happen. I feel like we have too many leaders, too many proven winners to let this team go downhill and end up being a losing team.

continued here: http://tarvarisjackson7.com/blog.html

idahovikefan7
10-12-2010, 06:40 PM
Awesome! just hope he's not referring to himself as one of the proven "leader/winners".....

NodakPaul
10-12-2010, 06:45 PM
idahovikefan7 wrote:

Awesome! just hope he's not referring to himself as one of the proven "leader/winners".....

It is a fairly mature blog. If TJack shows this kind of confidence in the locker room and huddle, then he could very well be evolving into a leader.

jmcdon00
10-12-2010, 06:55 PM
Good stuff there. I'd rather struggle early in the season than late. No time to panic.

Last year we won our first 6 games and lost our 3 of our last 4. This year we have lost 3 of our first 4 hopefully we can win our final 6.

midgensa
10-12-2010, 07:01 PM
NodakPaul wrote:

idahovikefan7 wrote:

Awesome! just hope he's not referring to himself as one of the proven "leader/winners".....

It is a fairly mature blog. If TJack shows this kind of confidence in the locker room and huddle, then he could very well be evolving into a leader.

Could be ... but won't know til he hits the field and it is MUCH more difficult to walk the walk then.

I am shocked Tad jumped in to post anything ... I thought he was not a Vikings fan when Favre was a member of the roster?

Purple Floyd
10-12-2010, 07:13 PM
Tarvaris Jackson: "It's not time to panic"

Was that sentence followed by: "There are no plans to start me yet"?

idahovikefan7
10-12-2010, 07:14 PM
NodakPaul wrote:

idahovikefan7 wrote:

Awesome! just hope he's not referring to himself as one of the proven "leader/winners".....

It is a fairly mature blog. If TJack shows this kind of confidence in the locker room and huddle, then he could very well be evolving into a leader.

Yep, once I see it on the field I will believe it. Until then, hope to see favre make improvements.

Mr Anderson
10-12-2010, 07:32 PM
NodakPaul wrote:

idahovikefan7 wrote:

Awesome! just hope he's not referring to himself as one of the proven "leader/winners".....

It is a fairly mature blog. If TJack shows this kind of confidence in the locker room and huddle, then he could very well be evolving into a leader.
For sure.

I'm impressed by him, I always have been impressed by his behavior and composure off the field. The way he's handled the whole Favre situation, the way he handled being benched in 07/08. Hopefully his football mind has caught up with his personality.

He has the physical tools, the attitude, now all he needs is the complete mental grasp and composure and we're looking at a hell of a player.

Like I said, I hope those things have caught up, cause Favre is looking pretty beat up.


And to be on topic: He's right. We shouldn't panic. The team shouldn't panic. It's not unrealistic to win 2 of our next 4, 3 of our next 5. That makes us 5-5 at week 10.

Marrdro
10-13-2010, 09:33 AM
Mr Anderson wrote:

NodakPaul wrote:

idahovikefan7 wrote:

Awesome! just hope he's not referring to himself as one of the proven "leader/winners".....

It is a fairly mature blog. If TJack shows this kind of confidence in the locker room and huddle, then he could very well be evolving into a leader.
For sure.

I'm impressed by him, I always have been impressed by his behavior and composure off the field. The way he's handled the whole Favre situation, the way he handled being benched in 07/08. Hopefully his football mind has caught up with his personality.

He has the physical tools, the attitude, now all he needs is the complete mental grasp and composure and we're looking at a hell of a player.

Like I said, I hope those things have caught up, cause Favre is looking pretty beat up.


And to be on topic: He's right. We shouldn't panic. The team shouldn't panic. It's not unrealistic to win 2 of our next 4, 3 of our next 5. That makes us 5-5 at week 10.
I know some on here don't believe it, however, I believe we have a real NFL organization that is pretty good about getting and putting quality players on the field.

Going on the premise that they are a real NFL organization and can really judge talent, they have kept TJ around for a reason.

For me, its because he is ready.

Did he struggle early in his career? Sure, but hell, look around the league, all of them do. Its the nature of the game.

My guess, we will see ole TJ for a rep or two (actually predicting 5) against the Cowgirls this weekend. ;)

jrjohn
10-13-2010, 09:57 AM
jmcdon00 wrote:

Good stuff there. I'd rather struggle early in the season than late. No time to panic.

Last year we won our first 6 games and lost our 3 of our last 4. This year we have lost 3 of our first 4 hopefully we can win our final 6.

I think the late season fade had a lot to do with Bretts age. I don't see him getting stronger as the season go's on. I think he'll be out with an injury before long. I think he's already injured, but the problem is he won't concede to injury, and for the sake of his records he will stay in the game only to hurt the team like he did in NY.
Sad.... So unless Chilly pulls him, he's not leaving.

12purplepride28
10-13-2010, 09:58 AM
guys... calm down. don't worry about our season, we can make the Super Bowl. Tavaris Jackson says so.... :/

Mr Anderson
10-13-2010, 10:00 AM
Marrdro wrote:

Mr Anderson wrote:

NodakPaul wrote:

idahovikefan7 wrote:

Awesome! just hope he's not referring to himself as one of the proven "leader/winners".....

It is a fairly mature blog. If TJack shows this kind of confidence in the locker room and huddle, then he could very well be evolving into a leader.
For sure.

I'm impressed by him, I always have been impressed by his behavior and composure off the field. The way he's handled the whole Favre situation, the way he handled being benched in 07/08. Hopefully his football mind has caught up with his personality.

He has the physical tools, the attitude, now all he needs is the complete mental grasp and composure and we're looking at a hell of a player.

Like I said, I hope those things have caught up, cause Favre is looking pretty beat up.


And to be on topic: He's right. We shouldn't panic. The team shouldn't panic. It's not unrealistic to win 2 of our next 4, 3 of our next 5. That makes us 5-5 at week 10.
I know some on here don't believe it, however, I believe we have a real NFL organization that is pretty good about getting and putting quality players on the field.

Going on the premise that they are a real NFL organization and can really judge talent, they have kept TJ around for a reason.

For me, its because he is ready.

Did he struggle early in his career? Sure, but hell, look around the league, all of them do. Its the nature of the game.

My guess, we will see ole TJ for a rep or two (actually predicting 5) against the Cowgirls this weekend. ;)
I'm by no means sold on him as a QB, because of the things I said he was lacking, but I am impressed with him as a person. Most NFL players would not have handled his situation the way he has.

Marrdro
10-13-2010, 10:16 AM
Mr Anderson wrote:

Marrdro wrote:

Mr Anderson wrote:

NodakPaul wrote:

idahovikefan7 wrote:

Awesome! just hope he's not referring to himself as one of the proven "leader/winners".....

It is a fairly mature blog. If TJack shows this kind of confidence in the locker room and huddle, then he could very well be evolving into a leader.
For sure.

I'm impressed by him, I always have been impressed by his behavior and composure off the field. The way he's handled the whole Favre situation, the way he handled being benched in 07/08. Hopefully his football mind has caught up with his personality.

He has the physical tools, the attitude, now all he needs is the complete mental grasp and composure and we're looking at a hell of a player.

Like I said, I hope those things have caught up, cause Favre is looking pretty beat up.


And to be on topic: He's right. We shouldn't panic. The team shouldn't panic. It's not unrealistic to win 2 of our next 4, 3 of our next 5. That makes us 5-5 at week 10.
I know some on here don't believe it, however, I believe we have a real NFL organization that is pretty good about getting and putting quality players on the field.

Going on the premise that they are a real NFL organization and can really judge talent, they have kept TJ around for a reason.

For me, its because he is ready.

Did he struggle early in his career? Sure, but hell, look around the league, all of them do. Its the nature of the game.

My guess, we will see ole TJ for a rep or two (actually predicting 5) against the Cowgirls this weekend. ;)
I'm by no means sold on him as a QB, because of the things I said he was lacking, but I am impressed with him as a person. Most NFL players would not have handled his situation the way he has.
Again, I agree.

I just think he is ready enough to get the job done, mostly because of the team around him.

He is still developing and will make mistakes. He just needs to limit those mistakes (ala Sanchez) and let the team win around him.

El Vikingo
10-13-2010, 11:01 AM
If T-Jack says so I am now much more confident.

STCLOUDSAYSGOVIKES
10-13-2010, 11:36 AM
jrjohn wrote:

I think the late season fade had a lot to do with Bretts age. I don't see him getting stronger as the season go's on. I think he'll be out with an injury before long. I think he's already injured, but the problem is he won't concede to injury, and for the sake of his records he will stay in the game only to hurt the team like he did in NY.
Sad.... So unless Chilly pulls him, he's not leaving.[/quote]

I don't think you could be farther off, as far as the streak goes. No professional athlete in a TEAM sport would put an individual record above the teams success.

As for his age, it's just a number. If you have the skills and the mental make up to still get the job done at a high level, keep playing as long as a team will have you.

Every player faces injury during the year, at that point it comes down to pain tolerance.

Keep this in mind, and it's by no stretch an excuse. Former QB Matt Hasselbeck contacted several QB's regarding the cancer awareness footballs currently being used. The biggest complaint was they were too slick, and hard to handle. That may have contributed to favres' handling problems monday night, along with the rain and his tender elbow.

NordicNed
10-13-2010, 12:59 PM
I can't get the link to work, but from reading what others have written, reads to me like TJ is and has been, nothing more than a team player. Cudo's to TJ for being so.
Now for my little bomb, I just pray that Brett can follow suit and do the same. Be a team player, that meens, if your arm is hurt to the point that it is effecting your decisions mentaly, and effecting your passing physicaly, then it's time to suck it up and step aside for those who may be ready to step in and contribute. I've always believed that a player who tries to play hurt, can be more of a bad apple to the bunch, than a contributing factor. Right now, I'm questioning the fact, is Favre's physical state hurting this team? I'm very sure it's not helping right now. It may very well be, time for Brett to take a break and step aside, let the young healthy player in there, and see what we do as a team then...
Yes, I'm all for TJ starting, if Brett is not able to perform at 100%, in health and mind...

Caine
10-13-2010, 01:06 PM
Marrdro wrote:


I know some on here don't believe it, however, I believe we have a real NFL organization that is pretty good about getting and putting quality players on the field.

Going on the premise that they are a real NFL organization and can really judge talent, they have kept TJ around for a reason.

Because he was CHEAP.

Marrdro wrote:

For me, its because he is ready.

And your proof of that would be.....

Marrdro wrote:

Did he struggle early in his career? Sure, but hell, look around the league, all of them do. Its the nature of the game.

He struggled all through his career...not just "early". And we've already discussed this ad nauseum.

What has Jackson SHOWN - other than the ability not to say stupid things to the media - that makes you believe he's ready to start? What has he DONE to refute all of the poor play of the past? Where is the PROOF?

Fact is, there isn't any. There's a lot of wishful thinking, a lot of conjecture based upon a lot of "what if" scenarios...but there is nothing tangible to refute all of the CRAP we saw in his first 3 years.

And, until there is...

Marrdro wrote:

My guess, we will see ole TJ for a rep or two (actually predicting 5) against the Cowgirls this weekend. ;)

Only if it's a blow out - either way.

Caine

V4L
10-13-2010, 03:22 PM
I like the kid.. Keep your head on straight and you'll get another chance.. Hopefully he can make the best out of it

Would love to see him throw with Moss, Sid, Harvin and Shank

Would love to see him give it his all.. Not just try to manage a game.. Cut him loose and see what he has

First, I wanna see Brett pull this thing back for us

Lotta babbling sorry.. Go Jackson.. Proud of ya!

BloodyHorns82
10-13-2010, 03:28 PM
V4L wrote:

I like the kid.. Keep your head on straight and you'll get another chance.. Hopefully he can make the best out of it

Would love to see him throw with Moss, Sid, Harvin and Shank

Would love to see him give it his all.. Not just try to manage a game.. Cut him loose and see what he has

First, I wanna see Brett pull this thing back for us

Lotta babbling sorry.. Go Jackson.. Proud of ya!

Yeah baby! That's the biggest question I have surrounding TJack. Were the coaches holding him back? Are they afraid he can't pull the trigger? What have they seen in practice that we have not that would cause them to limit him?

Or was he holding himself back because he is not confident to go out and make the throw? It seems like he is twice the QB when he comes in off the bench than he is when he is named starter.

Kid has a great personality and a good attitude. I too wold love to see him a successful Viking for the next 5-7 years. Obviously I'm no longer optimistic, but it would suck to see somebody put in the effort and patience he has only to walk away or get benched for Joe Webb next year.

Brick
10-13-2010, 05:02 PM
Caine wrote:

Marrdro wrote:


I know some on here don't believe it, however, I believe we have a real NFL organization that is pretty good about getting and putting quality players on the field.

Going on the premise that they are a real NFL organization and can really judge talent, they have kept TJ around for a reason.

Because he was CHEAP.

Marrdro wrote:

For me, its because he is ready.

And your proof of that would be.....

Marrdro wrote:

Did he struggle early in his career? Sure, but hell, look around the league, all of them do. Its the nature of the game.

He struggled all through his career...not just "early". And we've already discussed this ad nauseum.

What has Jackson SHOWN - other than the ability not to say stupid things to the media - that makes you believe he's ready to start? What has he DONE to refute all of the poor play of the past? Where is the PROOF?

Fact is, there isn't any. There's a lot of wishful thinking, a lot of conjecture based upon a lot of "what if" scenarios...but there is nothing tangible to refute all of the CRAP we saw in his first 3 years.

And, until there is...

Marrdro wrote:

My guess, we will see ole TJ for a rep or two (actually predicting 5) against the Cowgirls this weekend. ;)

Only if it's a blow out - either way.

Caine

Your hate for Jackson goes well beyond the football field... or else you wouldn't be defending Favre.

Take it how you may, but that much is evident.

Johnson14
10-14-2010, 04:53 AM
Not earth shattering stuff from TJack there, didn't say anything that every other player on the roster wouldnt have said "we'll turn it around" etc etc.

singersp
10-14-2010, 06:28 AM
NordicNed wrote:

I can't get the link to work, but from reading what others have written, reads to me like TJ is and has been, nothing more than a team player. Cudo's to TJ for being so.
Now for my little bomb, I just pray that Brett can follow suit and do the same. Be a team player, that meens, if your arm is hurt to the point that it is effecting your decisions mentaly, and effecting your passing physicaly, then it's time to suck it up and step aside for those who may be ready to step in and contribute. I've always believed that a player who tries to play hurt, can be more of a bad apple to the bunch, than a contributing factor. Right now, I'm questioning the fact, is Favre's physical state hurting this team? I'm very sure it's not helping right now. It may very well be, time for Brett to take a break and step aside, let the young healthy player in there, and see what we do as a team then...
Yes, I'm all for TJ starting, if Brett is not able to perform at 100%, in health and mind...


OK, which one of you logged in as Ned?

Caine
10-14-2010, 09:02 AM
Brick wrote:

Caine wrote:

Marrdro wrote:


I know some on here don't believe it, however, I believe we have a real NFL organization that is pretty good about getting and putting quality players on the field.

Going on the premise that they are a real NFL organization and can really judge talent, they have kept TJ around for a reason.

Because he was CHEAP.

Marrdro wrote:

For me, its because he is ready.

And your proof of that would be.....

Marrdro wrote:

Did he struggle early in his career? Sure, but hell, look around the league, all of them do. Its the nature of the game.

He struggled all through his career...not just "early". And we've already discussed this ad nauseum.

What has Jackson SHOWN - other than the ability not to say stupid things to the media - that makes you believe he's ready to start? What has he DONE to refute all of the poor play of the past? Where is the PROOF?

Fact is, there isn't any. There's a lot of wishful thinking, a lot of conjecture based upon a lot of "what if" scenarios...but there is nothing tangible to refute all of the CRAP we saw in his first 3 years.

And, until there is...

Marrdro wrote:

My guess, we will see ole TJ for a rep or two (actually predicting 5) against the Cowgirls this weekend. ;)

Only if it's a blow out - either way.

Caine

Your hate for Jackson goes well beyond the football field... or else you wouldn't be defending Favre.

Take it how you may, but that much is evident.

It's not Jackson I hate - I'm completely ambivalent about him. He's safely riding the bench, having no effect on my team whatsoever.

So, while it is true I have no FAITH in him, I don't hate him...not by a long shot. IF he were installed as the starter right now, I would believe that our season was over, but I would be cheering for him to prove me wrong.

What I HATE is the idiocy of those who are advocating starting him. You - and a handful of others - keep s[pewing isolated stats and a never ending series of "what ifs", "could be's" and "should be's" to support your opinions...but none of it is rooted ion any kind of fact.

There is NO proof that Jackson has improved - but there is plenty to suggest that he hasn't (All of which you conveniently ignore).

There is no proof to suggest that Favre will continue to play poorly - but an entire NFL history to suggest otherwise (All of which you conveniently ignore).

There is no proof to suggest that Jackson would be more productive than Favre - and all kinds of proof to show that he NEVER HAS BEEN IN HIS ENTIRE LIFE (All of which you conveniently ignore).

THAT is what I hate.

You trying to alter that by claiming I hate Jackson is simply a transparent attempt to discredit the author because you cannot refute his comments.

Caine

jonj1
10-15-2010, 12:56 AM
STCLOUDSAYSGOVIKES wrote:

jrjohn wrote:

I think the late season fade had a lot to do with Bretts age. I don't see him getting stronger as the season go's on. I think he'll be out with an injury before long. I think he's already injured, but the problem is he won't concede to injury, and for the sake of his records he will stay in the game only to hurt the team like he did in NY.
Sad.... So unless Chilly pulls him, he's not leaving.

I don't think you could be farther off, as far as the streak goes. No professional athlete in a TEAM sport would put an individual record above the teams success.

As for his age, it's just a number. If you have the skills and the mental make up to still get the job done at a high level, keep playing as long as a team will have you.

Every player faces injury during the year, at that point it comes down to pain tolerance.

Keep this in mind, and it's by no stretch an excuse. Former QB Matt Hasselbeck contacted several QB's regarding the cancer awareness footballs currently being used. The biggest complaint was they were too slick, and hard to handle. That may have contributed to favres' handling problems monday night, along with the rain and his tender elbow.[/quote]

I don't know if the pink cancer ribbon sticker cause the fumbles??

What I do know is Favre has had somewhere in the range of 14-16 straight out Misses in 4 games (8-9 in the jets game alone). These "Misses" were obtained from the number of incompletions minus the passes defended. Passes Defended are usually considered good defense play the other incompletions are either Misses or Drops.

Favres numbers.(Attemp-completions/INT/PD)
week1 NO 15-27/1-INT/6-PD=5 Misses
week2 Mia 22-36/3-INT/8-PD=1 Miss
week3 DET 22-34/2-INT/6-PD=3 Misses
week4 NYJ 14-34/1-INT/9-PD=10 Misses

Given that I saw at least 3 drops by the receivers, That's about 14-16 Misses. The numbers last week are the one's that are the most worrysome. Quartbacks in the NFL shouldn't Completely Miss the target 8-9 times a game and throw 2 INTs a game.

Alot of posts say that TJ in 2008 faced easier defenses than Favre has this year. I looked at this statistically.It simply isn't true. Keep in mind the Saints defense made Alex Smith (275yds+82rating against NO) and Jimmy Claussen (175yds+90rating against NO)look like Brady this year. Miami, a team that held Favre to a 44 passer rating, allowed Trent Edwards a passer rating of 73. Trent Edwards was abruptly place on wavers the following week and is now the 3rd string on Jacksonville. Even the Bills can spot a crappy QB...the bills don't have nearly the O-line or the WRs that we do.

Anyway here are the passer ratings and defensive passer ratings of the defenses they've faced for Favre this year and TJackson in 2008.

Favre 2010
PasserRating // DefensePassRating // Difference
week1-- NO // 70// 84// -12
week2-- Mia // 44// 82// -38
week3-- DET // 68// 84// -16
week4-- NYJ // 85// 79// +6
Average // 67 //83 // -15


T. Jackson 2008
PasserRating // DefensePassRating // Difference
week1-- GB // 59 // 72 // -13
week2-- IND // 73 // 78 // -5
week14-- DET // 144 // 110 // +34
week15-- ARI // 135 // 97 // +37
week16-- ATL // 99 // 84 // +13
week17-- NYG // 84 // 77 // +7
Wildcard- PHI // 45 // 73 // -29
Average----- 92 // 85 // +7


Yes, TJ could have handled the Philly blitz better...but statistically TJ did better in 2008 than Favres done in 2010. Hell, even Alex Smith,J. Claussen, and waived T. Edwards did better against the SAME Defenses than Favre.

C'Mon Guys????!!!!

kyleburkle
10-15-2010, 03:55 AM
Caine is the racist Tarvaris hater, clearly

Formo
10-15-2010, 04:31 AM
I remember a T-Jack that hit a certain speedy WR in stride multiple times that very well would have won us games but said speedy WR had stone hands, alligator arms and was 87% blind in all three eyes. If I'm not mistaken, that WR was part of our transaction of Moss (pre-Patriots). Now that we have a WR that can catch (Moss), I wouldn't be surprised to see T-Jack be at least a bit more efficient (read: All the stat-lovers here that use them to formulate arguments against T-Jack's play time would have a chance to either be A) proven wrong, or B) vindicated.)

I'd love to see ol' Favrey-boy give his elbow a 2-3 week blow for the sake of the long run and give T-Jack his chance to show the organization, the fans, and the rest of the NFL that he's ready to take the reigns of the Viking ship post-4.

Will this happen? No clue.

singersp
10-15-2010, 05:01 AM
Formo wrote:

I remember a T-Jack that hit a certain speedy WR in stride multiple times that very well would have won us games but said speedy WR had stone hands, alligator arms and was 87% blind in all three eyes. If I'm not mistaken, that WR was part of our transaction of Moss (pre-Patriots). Now that we have a WR that can catch (Moss), I wouldn't be surprised to see T-Jack be at least a bit more efficient (read: All the stat-lovers here that use them to formulate arguments against T-Jack's play time would have a chance to either be A) proven wrong, or B) vindicated.)

I'd love to see ol' Favrey-boy give his elbow a 2-3 week blow for the sake of the long run and give T-Jack his chance to show the organization, the fans, and the rest of the NFL that he's ready to take the reigns of the Viking ship post-4.

Will this happen? No clue.

I used to get lots of chuckles reading posts by posters who, in one read would talk about how T-Will dropped so many perfectly thrown passes that hit in the helmet or hands, then turn right around in another thread and say how TJ couldn't hit the broadside of a barn.

singersp
10-15-2010, 05:43 AM
Caine wrote:


There is no proof to suggest that Favre will continue to play poorly - but an entire NFL history to suggest otherwise (All of which you [Brick]conveniently ignore).
Caine

Favre was playing with tendonitis & a bum ankle his entire career? WOW! I did not know that.

No proof to suggest Favre will continue to play poorly?
Really?

You might want to check the last half of the 2008 Jets season, because after all that is what we are talking about. A QB who is playing injured.

Until the tendonitis is gone, I don't see a lot of room for a lot of improvement. It will not only affect his throwing, but his grip as well which was evident in the Jets game.

Couple that with his somehow inability to see the field as of late & miss seeing wide open receivers.


Caine wrote:


There is no proof to suggest that Jackson would be more productive than Favre - and all kinds of proof to show that he NEVER HAS BEEN IN HIS ENTIRE LIFE (All of which you [Brick] conveniently ignore).

THAT is what I hate..


Just as there is little proof to me that over the course of the next 4 game stretch, Jackson would;

1. Lose all 4 of the 4 games he was in, (Favre's only win came against a 0-2 Lions who were 2-14 last year)

2. Throw 8 or more INT's

3. Fumble the ball 5 or more times.

4. Complete less than 41% of his passes.

That in essence is what it would take for Jackson to play worse than Favre is right now. You got proof?

Look, I'd like Favre to do great & have another miracle year like last year, but the reality of it is, it looks like it's not going to happen as long as Favre continues to play with tendonitis.

I can't explain Favre's inability to miss seeing open receivers downfield other than failing eyesite, but if the tendonitis goes away, that may fix the fumbles and the inconsistant passes that, makes him miss wide open receivers on dump passes, make him hit Moss beautifully on 1 pass, but turn right around & overthrow him on the next to the point were Moss has to commit a 15 yard foul to prevent an interception.

Lets hope they can keep the swelling down with injections, because that's Favre's only hope right now & he can beat the Cowboys.

If his play is craptacular, how long are you willing to ride the rickety bandwagon?

Caine
10-15-2010, 07:47 AM
kyleburkle wrote:

Caine is the racist Tarvaris hater, clearly

Careful. Comments like that one don't get taken very lightly around here. I sincerely hope that you were being sarcastic or attempting to be funny, because if not....

Caine
10-15-2010, 07:55 AM
singersp wrote:

Caine wrote:


There is no proof to suggest that Favre will continue to play poorly - but an entire NFL history to suggest otherwise (All of which you [Brick]conveniently ignore).
Caine

Favre was playing with tendonitis & a bum ankle his entire career? WOW! I did not know that.

No proof to suggest Favre will continue to play poorly?
Really?

You might want to check the last half of the 2008 Jets season, because after all that is what we are talking about. A QB who is playing injured.

Until the tendonitis is gone, I don't see a lot of room for a lot of improvement. It will not only affect his throwing, but his grip as well which was evident in the Jets game.

Couple that with his somehow inability to see the field as of late & miss seeing wide open receivers.

And you ignore all the other times Favre has played through injury...how convenient.

singersp wrote:

Caine wrote:


There is no proof to suggest that Jackson would be more productive than Favre - and all kinds of proof to show that he NEVER HAS BEEN IN HIS ENTIRE LIFE (All of which you [Brick] conveniently ignore).

THAT is what I hate..


Just as there is little proof to me that over the course of the next 4 game stretch, Jackson would;

1. Lose all 4 of the 4 games he was in, (Favre's only win came against a 0-2 Lions who were 2-14 last year)

2. Throw 8 or more INT's

3. Fumble the ball 5 or more times.

4. Complete less than 41% of his passes.

That in essence is what it would take for Jackson to play worse than Favre is right now. You got proof?

Really? You get to define the parameters under which Jackson gets to be better/worse than Favre? Again, how convenient.

As I said elsewhere, Jackson could do a lot of things and be worse than Favre...and never throw a single pick. Jackson could continue to collapse under pressure. Continue to simply hand-off to Peterson and throw dump offs and come backs. Fail to LEAD - like usual. And throw over/under/behind receivers - like he usually does.

So, while Favre has been doing a bit of the latter lately, he doesn't have a history of it. Fact is, you have nothing to support the idea that Jackson is any better now than he was when he was benched for Favre in '09...just a lot of wishful thinking.

singersp wrote:

Look, I'd like Favre to do great & have another miracle year like last year, but the reality of it is, it looks like it's not going to happen as long as Favre continues to play with tendonitis.

I can't explain Favre's inability to miss seeing open receivers downfield other than failing eyesite, but if the tendonitis goes away, that may fix the fumbles and the inconsistant passes that, makes him miss wide open receivers on dump passes, make him hit Moss beautifully on 1 pass, but turn right around & overthrow him on the next to the point were Moss has to commit a 15 yard foul to prevent an interception.

Lets hope they can keep the swelling down with injections, because that's Favre's only hope right now & he can beat the Cowboys.

If his play is craptacular, how long are you willing to ride the rickety bandwagon?

I'll ride the Favre bandwagon until we are mathematically eliminated from Play-off contention, or until Favre cannot possibly play any more for physical reasons.

IF his elbow declines, sit him. IF his ankle declines, sit him. IF we're eliminated, sit him.

But before that? Nope. 80% of Favre is better than 100% of Jackson - based upon the history of both players.

Caine

Marrdro
10-15-2010, 10:31 AM
Caine wrote:

Marrdro wrote:


I know some on here don't believe it, however, I believe we have a real NFL organization that is pretty good about getting and putting quality players on the field.

Going on the premise that they are a real NFL organization and can really judge talent, they have kept TJ around for a reason.

Because he was CHEAP.

Marrdro wrote:

For me, its because he is ready.

And your proof of that would be.....

Marrdro wrote:

Did he struggle early in his career? Sure, but hell, look around the league, all of them do. Its the nature of the game.

He struggled all through his career...not just "early". And we've already discussed this ad nauseum.

What has Jackson SHOWN - other than the ability not to say stupid things to the media - that makes you believe he's ready to start? What has he DONE to refute all of the poor play of the past? Where is the PROOF?

Fact is, there isn't any. There's a lot of wishful thinking, a lot of conjecture based upon a lot of "what if" scenarios...but there is nothing tangible to refute all of the CRAP we saw in his first 3 years.

And, until there is...

Marrdro wrote:

My guess, we will see ole TJ for a rep or two (actually predicting 5) against the Cowgirls this weekend. ;)

Only if it's a blow out - either way.

Caine
Do we really have to go over the same things each and every time?

a. Its my opinion based on what I've seen last year and this year.

b. Yes, that is very limited.

c. No, I don't hold what we saw the first couple of years against him, mostly because the team wasn't that good either.

d. Yes, I know you don't agree with me about the team. You believed it was a SB team since the Chiller took over.

Wishfull thinking.....Conjecture......If thats what you want to call something I call an opinion based on what I've see, then I'm good with that.

Not my fault you still believe that there is no way on the good lords green earth that he hasn't overcame some of the things you continue to hold against him from his early attempts or that you don't think this team is better and can help him instead of hurting him.

I mean seriously, young QBs never have problems and come right out of the gate as HOF'rs according to what you want them to look like when they get thier shot. ;)

Marrdro
10-15-2010, 10:39 AM
Caine wrote:
It's not Jackson I hate - I'm completely ambivalent about him. He's safely riding the bench, having no effect on my team whatsoever.

So, while it is true I have no FAITH in him, I don't hate him...not by a long shot. IF he were installed as the starter right now, I would believe that our season was over, but I would be cheering for him to prove me wrong.

What I HATE is the idiocy of those who are advocating starting him. You - and a handful of others - keep s[pewing isolated stats and a never ending series of "what ifs", "could be's" and "should be's" to support your opinions...but none of it is rooted ion any kind of fact.

There is NO proof that Jackson has improved - but there is plenty to suggest that he hasn't (All of which you conveniently ignore).

There is no proof to suggest that Favre will continue to play poorly - but an entire NFL history to suggest otherwise (All of which you conveniently ignore).

There is no proof to suggest that Jackson would be more productive than Favre - and all kinds of proof to show that he NEVER HAS BEEN IN HIS ENTIRE LIFE (All of which you conveniently ignore).

THAT is what I hate.

You trying to alter that by claiming I hate Jackson is simply a transparent attempt to discredit the author because you cannot refute his comments.

Caine

Just like there is no proof that the Noodle won't keep on his turnover pace that his is currently on.

Just like there is no proof that TJ won't play better with this team around him after watching from the bench.

Comeon Caine, is it that hard to comprehend that a few of us can't put two and two together and come up with something other than 4?

Fact. He played his best when he came off the bench. Kindof like all other young QB's do.

Fact. The Noodle has a problem with his arm that is hindering what he can do and the only way to fix it is to rest it.

You say you don't hate, so I don't say that anymore, but it is really hard for me to comprehend how someone who knows the game as well as you do, find it so hard to understand why a few of us have seen improvement in the kid each and every year.

It isn't like I am saying he is gonna come out and be a HOF signal caller without making mistakes, because I'm not.

All I'm saying is that this team is markedly better than the last time he had a shot. He has had one of the best to watch and learn from.

Why not give the kid another shot?

Unless of course you really believe this staff would put a SB caliber team on the field and elect to keep a "Cheap" option at the backup QB position.

vike_mike
10-15-2010, 12:16 PM
[b]We have no choice but to back him if Favre can't play. He is capable of having a good game. The evidence you are looking for to why he hasn't proved it to us is by looking at what Childress and Bevell said about him. They both said that they don't give TJack the full playbook as opposed to Favre having the entire playbook at his disposal. When Favre is the QB, there are times where you just want to pull your hair out, because of the unimaginative play calling that we have. We are predictable at times. You have to trust that if TJack is in there, he will produce with what he's given, half of the playbook. I am not trying to argue with you at all. I am just saying that Brett is injured more than we know. He's not going to be accurate on some of his throws. It would be best for the team to have a 100% healthy QB for the next couple of games while he heals up. Can't wait until Sydney gets back too. [ /b]

Caine
10-15-2010, 12:18 PM
Marrdro wrote:

Caine wrote:

It's not Jackson I hate - I'm completely ambivalent about him. He's safely riding the bench, having no effect on my team whatsoever.

So, while it is true I have no FAITH in him, I don't hate him...not by a long shot. IF he were installed as the starter right now, I would believe that our season was over, but I would be cheering for him to prove me wrong.

What I HATE is the idiocy of those who are advocating starting him. You - and a handful of others - keep s[pewing isolated stats and a never ending series of "what ifs", "could be's" and "should be's" to support your opinions...but none of it is rooted ion any kind of fact.

There is NO proof that Jackson has improved - but there is plenty to suggest that he hasn't (All of which you conveniently ignore).

There is no proof to suggest that Favre will continue to play poorly - but an entire NFL history to suggest otherwise (All of which you conveniently ignore).

There is no proof to suggest that Jackson would be more productive than Favre - and all kinds of proof to show that he NEVER HAS BEEN IN HIS ENTIRE LIFE (All of which you conveniently ignore).

THAT is what I hate.

You trying to alter that by claiming I hate Jackson is simply a transparent attempt to discredit the author because you cannot refute his comments.

Caine

Just like there is no proof that the Noodle won't keep on his turnover pace that his is currently on.

Just like there is no proof that TJ won't play better with this team around him after watching from the bench.

But isn't that the point? Jackson's supporters are claiming that the end is nigh because Favre had a few bad games. But his HISTORY shows us that he has a great possibility to elevate himself.

What does Jackson's history show us? Anything close to the same thing? Nope.

You're right, there's no proof that Jackson won't play better, but there's also no proof that he will. All we can go on in what we have seen in the past, and project from there...and MY projection does not elevate him very much based upon what I have seen.

Marrdro wrote:

Comeon Caine, is it that hard to comprehend that a few of us can't put two and two together and come up with something other than 4?

Yes, because 2+2 is 4...it's just that simple. If you're coming up with another number then you're either doing it wrong, or you're injecting an element into the equation that you haven't disclosed.

Marrdro wrote:

Fact. He played his best when he came off the bench. Kind of like all other young QB's do.

Yup...except the ones that fail... And how many chances has he had to "come off the bench" and play? How many times has he picked up the reigns? Depending upon how you count them, anywhere from 5 to seven times.

And how many times has he maintained a satisfactory level of play? One that would elevate the confidence of the fan base and the coaching staff? Never.

Marrdro wrote:

Fact. The Noodle has a problem with his arm that is hindering what he can do and the only way to fix it is to rest it.

Yup, and they'll rest it during the week, and he'll only throw on Sunday.

Marrdro wrote:

You say you don't hate, so I don't say that anymore, but it is really hard for me to comprehend how someone who knows the game as well as you do, find it so hard to understand why a few of us have seen improvement in the kid each and every year.

Because the improvement you "see" isn't manifesting itself ON THE FIELD. It's all conjecture. It's all HOPE. Jackson MUST be better by now because:

A: They kept him.
B: He's been behind Favre for a season.
C: He's been ion the league for 5 years.
D: He had that game versus Arizona.

None of those are proofs. In fact, they are all - except the Arizona game - conjecture, based upon nothing. The Arizona game is appearing, more and more, like an anomaly, as he's never reproduced it, nor even come close to doing so.

Had he torn it up in preseason, I would be a LOT closer to agreeing, as I DO think Favre could do with a couple weeks off...but Jackson sucked ass in preseason, so we don't even have meaningless, pressure free time to gauge him on.

In short - as I've said all along - there is NOTHING to support your opinion other than (TA DAAAA!!!) ....your opinion.

Marrdro wrote:

It isn't like I am saying he is gonna come out and be a HOF signal caller without making mistakes, because I'm not.

That's good, because he won't....more than likely...

Marrdro wrote:

All I'm saying is that this team is markedly better than the last time he had a shot. He has had one of the best to watch and learn from.

Really? Now Favre is "one of the best"? A year and a half of bashing him, and suddenly he's back to "one of the best"?

Then why don't you have a little more faith in "one of the best" and allow him to work with the improved receiver corps we just got?

Marrdro wrote:

Why not give the kid another shot?

He's had 7 of them....

Marrdro wrote:

Unless of course you really believe this staff would put a SB caliber team on the field and elect to keep a "Cheap" option at the backup QB position.

I absolutely DO believe that. I have stated for YEARS that Chiller is retarded when it comes to the QB position. How many times have I said it? How many years have I said it?

CHILLER SUCKS BALLS AT PICKING AND DEVELOPING QB's...which is why he begged Favre to unretire. Which is why he'll suck McNabb's sack to get him to sign here next season.

I can't believe you even threw that soft shit over the plate....

OF COURSE I think Chiller would field a Superbowl caliber team and screw us at the QB position. I would have been FAR more comfortable with Sage starting - based ONLY upon this preseason - than Jackson...because Jackson looked like Suck-A-Saurus Rex!!!! But Chiller, in his INFINITE wisdom, traded away Sage, and kept Jackson...the guy whose contract is UP after this season.

Caine

Marrdro
10-15-2010, 12:50 PM
Caine wrote:


But isn't that the point? Jackson's supporters are claiming that the end is nigh because Favre had a few bad games. But his HISTORY shows us that he has a great possibility to elevate himself.

What does Jackson's history show us? Anything close to the same thing? Nope.

History also shows us that he might not elevate himself, especially with a bumb wing. Heck, he has a history of not elevating himself even when he was healthy.

But thats not my point. My point is based on logic. Logic dictates that a guy with a bad arm is less effective than a guy with a good arm.



You're right, there's no proof that Jackson won't play better, but there's also no proof that he will. All we can go on in what we have seen in the past, and project from there...and MY projection does not elevate him very much based upon what I have seen.
Why are we limted to just his past and even if we were just limited to his past, I don't think you are taking into account his whole past.

Last year he was very effective with the 2's and 3's against other teams ones.


Yes, because 2+2 is 4...it's just that simple. If you're coming up with another number then you're either doing it wrong, or you're injecting an element into the equation that you haven't disclosed.
...snicker.....you like how I tried to slip that past you don't you. :P


Yup...except the ones that fail... And how many chances has he had to "come off the bench" and play? How many times has he picked up the reigns? Depending upon how you count them, anywhere from 5 to seven times.
For this discussion, just last years are the ones I am talking about.

Again, I felt that he did pretty good last year when he was given a chance.


And how many times has he maintained a satisfactory level of play? One that would elevate the confidence of the fan base and the coaching staff? Never.
You act as if it was he and he alone that cause us to loose at times.

And I think he does have the confidence of the staff or he wouldn't be the number 2 for goodness sakes.

If this staff is "All In" and thinking they have a SB chance this year, why wouldn't they also change the number 2 for someone better. Truth of the matter is, they have tried and he still winds up as the number 2 and possible starter next year.

I think that scares you the most doesn't it. :laugh:


Yup, and they'll rest it during the week, and he'll only throw on Sunday.
Yea, like thats really helping. Team gets used to TJ all week and then the Noodle steps in.

And people hack on the Sauce for having a few penalties.


Because the improvement you "see" isn't manifesting itself ON THE FIELD. It's all conjecture. It's all HOPE. Jackson MUST be better by now because:

A: They kept him.
B: He's been behind Favre for a season.
C: He's been ion the league for 5 years.
D: He had that game versus Arizona.

None of those are proofs. In fact, they are all - except the Arizona game - conjecture, based upon nothing. The Arizona game is appearing, more and more, like an anomaly, as he's never reproduced it, nor even come close to doing so.
You are the one who keeps bringing up AZ not me.

I'm the one who says that the staff used him to implement the new stuff, not Rosencopter. I'm the one who says the staff show cased Rosencopter by letting him run the stuff the team was used to and they new would work.

I'm the one who says that when he was given a chance LAST year the team scored points.

Your the one who says that stuff doesn't count cause it was "Mop" up duties as if the other teams 1's just gave up at the end of the game when they were out there.



Had he torn it up in preseason, I would be a LOT closer to agreeing, as I DO think Favre could do with a couple weeks off...but Jackson sucked ass in preseason, so we don't even have meaningless, pressure free time to gauge him on.

In short - as I've said all along - there is NOTHING to support your opinion other than (TA DAAAA!!!) ....your opinion.

But that is a difference of opinion. See my Rosencopter post above.

It mystifies me why anyone of your football knowledge doesn't comprehend that pre-season is a time to work on things and that when you do that, things don't always work out.

Go back, watch what they did with him in there. Repeatedly worked on a set package each and every time and when they did it, it got better and better even though the defense knew what they were doing.



Really? Now Favre is "one of the best"? A year and a half of bashing him, and suddenly he's back to "one of the best"?
Comeon Caine, now I know you are getting desperate. I have never once tried to take away what the Noodle has accomplished on the field. In fact, you know its what he did on the field as a PUKER that I hold against him.

What I am on him now for is that he is trying to play digned. If you remember, last year when he got here, that was what I thought he was trying to do as well.

Don't try to turn this into something it isn't.


Then why don't you have a little more faith in "one of the best" and allow him to work with the improved receiver corps we just got?
He's digned and making bad decisions because of it. Those bad decisions have contributed to each of our losses this year.

For me, that means he isn't the best option anymore, unless of course I am gonna change my mind like you and believe that his past deeds are gonna save the day.



He's had 7 of them....
Wow, 7 whole chances. Thats it, shitcan the kid. Nobody, I mean nobody should have THAT many chances....

LOL.......


I absolutely DO believe that. I have stated for YEARS that Chiller is retarded when it comes to the QB position. How many times have I said it? How many years have I said it?

CHILLER SUCKS BALLS AT PICKING AND DEVELOPING QB's...which is why he begged Favre to unretire. Which is why he'll suck McNabb's sack to get him to sign here next season.

I can't believe you even threw that soft shit over the plate....
I did it so that I could pull up the thread that absolutely blows your opinion on this out the water...........

I can't believe you keep letting me hit it out of the fence on this....... ;)
Vikings QB Options Since Childress Arrived (http://www.purplepride.org/community/discussion/2-vikings-fan-forum/1047151-vikings-qb-options-since-childress-arrived#1047151)

Truth of the matter is, there hasn't been one to develop or one to go out and get that was actually available other than maybe Carr that you would have been happy with.


OF COURSE I think Chiller would field a Superbowl caliber team and screw us at the QB position. I would have been FAR more comfortable with Sage starting - based ONLY upon this preseason - than Jackson...because Jackson looked like Suck-A-Saurus Rex!!!! But Chiller, in his INFINITE wisdom, traded away Sage, and kept Jackson...the guy whose contract is UP after this season.

Caine :P
And I still can't believe you think Sage look great because they gave him "Gimmy" plays to run against crappy teams in pre-season.

The irony of it all.

On a side note, I can't wait for my beers..... :laugh:

Caine
10-15-2010, 01:38 PM
Marrdro wrote:

Caine wrote:


But isn't that the point? Jackson's supporters are claiming that the end is nigh because Favre had a few bad games. But his HISTORY shows us that he has a great possibility to elevate himself.

What does Jackson's history show us? Anything close to the same thing? Nope.

History also shows us that he might not elevate himself, especially with a bumb wing. Heck, he has a history of not elevating himself even when he was healthy.

But thats not my point. My point is based on logic. Logic dictates that a guy with a bad arm is less effective than a guy with a good arm.

Depends upon who those two guys are, doesn't it?

Joe Montana gimped versus Trent Dilfer healthy I take Montana.

Aaron Rodgers gimped versus Matt Flynn? I'm going with Rodgers.

Brett Favre gimped versus Tarvaris Jackson healthy? Depending upon HOW BAD, I go with Favre.


Marrdro wrote:

Caine wrote:
You're right, there's no proof that Jackson won't play better, but there's also no proof that he will. All we can go on in what we have seen in the past, and project from there...and MY projection does not elevate him very much based upon what I have seen.

Why are we limted to just his past and even if we were just limited to his past, I don't think you are taking into account his whole past.

Last year he was very effective with the 2's and 3's against other teams ones.

Oh bullshit. He was playing mop up. YOU could have been "effective" at that point.

Marrdro wrote:

Caine wrote:
Yes, because 2+2 is 4...it's just that simple. If you're coming up with another number then you're either doing it wrong, or you're injecting an element into the equation that you haven't disclosed.
...snicker.....you like how I tried to slip that past you don't you. :P

I just figured that anyone supporting Jackson at this stage must be really bad at math...

Marrdro wrote:

Caine wrote:
Yup...except the ones that fail... And how many chances has he had to "come off the bench" and play? How many times has he picked up the reigns? Depending upon how you count them, anywhere from 5 to seven times.
For this discussion, just last years are the ones I am talking about.

Again, I felt that he did pretty good last year when he was given a chance.

Again, I don't count those because they were GARBAGE TIME. He was playing against beaten teams. Teams who had no heart left, and no hope of winning. Unless you can promise me that our next 12 games are versus beaten teams with no hope and no heart, I hardly see how garbage time qualifies.

Marrdro wrote:

Caine wrote:
And how many times has he maintained a satisfactory level of play? One that would elevate the confidence of the fan base and the coaching staff? Never.

You act as if it was he and he alone that cause us to loose at times.

And I think he does have the confidence of the staff or he wouldn't be the number 2 for goodness sakes.

If this staff is "All In" and thinking they have a SB chance this year, why wouldn't they also change the number 2 for someone better. Truth of the matter is, they have tried and he still winds up as the number 2 and possible starter next year.

I think that scares you the most doesn't it. :laugh:

1: I have never said that Jackson was the SOLE reason for our loses...but neither has he really been much of a contributing factor for our wins.

2: I think the staff is short sighted at the QB positon and never dreamed Favre's arm would flare up.

3: Again, I DO think this staff is "QB Retarded".

4: Whom did they "try" with again? Oh, right, no one good.

5: Jackson will likely be let go next season as his contract expires...we will likely go after McNabb, and Chiller will draft a LT and a DT in rounds 1 and 2.

...but we'll pick up a converted WR/QB in the 6th...just for shits and giggles...

6: Yes, the idea of Jackson starting again terrifies me...only because he has sucked so bad every time he's been "The Guy".

Marrdro wrote:

Caine wrote:
Yup, and they'll rest it during the week, and he'll only throw on Sunday.
Yea, like thats really helping. Team gets used to TJ all week and then the Noodle steps in.

And people hack on the Sauce for having a few penalties.

Favre will be on a limited pitch count all week - that will help reduce the swelling/pain.

Marrdro wrote:

Caine wrote:
Because the improvement you "see" isn't manifesting itself ON THE FIELD. It's all conjecture. It's all HOPE. Jackson MUST be better by now because:

A: They kept him.
B: He's been behind Favre for a season.
C: He's been ion the league for 5 years.
D: He had that game versus Arizona.

None of those are proofs. In fact, they are all - except the Arizona game - conjecture, based upon nothing. The Arizona game is appearing, more and more, like an anomaly, as he's never reproduced it, nor even come close to doing so.
You are the one who keeps bringing up AZ not me.

I'm the one who says that the staff used him to implement the new stuff, not Rosencopter. I'm the one who says the staff show cased Rosencopter by letting him run the stuff the team was used to and they new would work.

I'm the one who says that when he was given a chance LAST year the team scored points.

Your the one who says that stuff doesn't count cause it was "Mop" up duties as if the other teams 1's just gave up at the end of the game when they were out there.

And NONE of that manifested on the FIELD...he still looked like pooh.


...except when he got to face teams Favre had already destroyed...


Marr, that would be like you saying you're a better fighter than me because you finished off guys I've already beaten silly. I've done all the heavy lifting, your "accomplishment" is empty.


Marrdro wrote:

Caine wrote:
Had he torn it up in preseason, I would be a LOT closer to agreeing, as I DO think Favre could do with a couple weeks off...but Jackson sucked ass in preseason, so we don't even have meaningless, pressure free time to gauge him on.

In short - as I've said all along - there is NOTHING to support your opinion other than (TA DAAAA!!!) ....your opinion.

But that is a difference of opinion. See my Rosencopter post above.

It mystifies me why anyone of your football knowledge doesn't comprehend that pre-season is a time to work on things and that when you do that, things don't always work out.

Go back, watch what they did with him in there. Repeatedly worked on a set package each and every time and when they did it, it got better and better even though the defense knew what they were doing.

I know what preseason is for...vanilla versus vanilla. And Jackson looked like vanilla baffled him. Trying to somehow make it about him implementing new schemes and new plays is such a work of fiction, I half expected Darth Vader to appear and tell me he was my father....

Marrdro wrote:

Caine wrote:
Really? Now Favre is "one of the best"? A year and a half of bashing him, and suddenly he's back to "one of the best"?
Comeon Caine, now I know you are getting desperate. I have never once tried to take away what the Noodle has accomplished on the field. In fact, you know its what he did on the field as a PUKER that I hold against him.

What I am on him now for is that he is trying to play digned. If you remember, last year when he got here, that was what I thought he was trying to do as well.

Don't try to turn this into something it isn't.

Desperate? No...I just find it ironic that after bashing Favre for so long, you suddenly want to call him "one of the greatest" so you can use it as a plus for Jackson.

So, again, if he's "One of the greatest", why not give him the chance to prove it, once again.

Marrdro wrote:

Caine wrote:
Then why don't you have a little more faith in "one of the best" and allow him to work with the improved receiver corps we just got?
He's digned and making bad decisions because of it. Those bad decisions have contributed to each of our losses this year.

For me, that means he isn't the best option anymore, unless of course I am gonna change my mind like you and believe that his past deeds are gonna save the day.

He's dinged - yup - covered that earlier.

But, again we just added Moss. We just got the Receivers back to a point where opposing teams don't just have to shut down Shiancoe to kill our air game. So why not let Favre do what he does? He put up almost 300 yards in the second half!! He threw 3 TDs in the second half!! Jackson has never thrown for that many yards in a GAME!!

...and all on a clipped wing...Jackson's never done it healthy!!

Marrdro wrote:

Caine wrote:
He's had 7 of them....
Wow, 7 whole chances. Thats it, shitcan the kid. Nobody, I mean nobody should have THAT many chances....

LOL.......

7 different opportunities to be the starter, to take the reigns of the team, to LEAD them, to be successful...


and it was fail, fail, fail, fail, fail, fail, fail...

the 8th time must be the charm though, right?

Marrdro wrote:

Caine wrote:
I absolutely DO believe that. I have stated for YEARS that Chiller is retarded when it comes to the QB position. How many times have I said it? How many years have I said it?

CHILLER SUCKS BALLS AT PICKING AND DEVELOPING QB's...which is why he begged Favre to unretire. Which is why he'll suck McNabb's sack to get him to sign here next season.

I can't believe you even threw that soft shit over the plate....
I did it so that I could pull up the thread that absolutely blows your opinion on this out the water...........

I can't believe you keep letting me hit it out of the fence on this....... ;)
Vikings QB Options Since Childress Arrived (http://www.purplepride.org/community/discussion/2-vikings-fan-forum/1047151-vikings-qb-options-since-childress-arrived#1047151)

Truth of the matter is, there hasn't been one to develop or one to go out and get that was actually available other than maybe Carr that you would have been happy with.

Yup, that long post of your I refuted by naming 3 players? Schaub, Carr, Cassell.

We could have signed/traded for any of those 3 at any point and been further ahead than where we are. All 3 are better than Jackson...hands down.

Marrdro wrote:

Caine wrote:
OF COURSE I think Chiller would field a Superbowl caliber team and screw us at the QB position. I would have been FAR more comfortable with Sage starting - based ONLY upon this preseason - than Jackson...because Jackson looked like Suck-A-Saurus Rex!!!! But Chiller, in his INFINITE wisdom, traded away Sage, and kept Jackson...the guy whose contract is UP after this season.

Caine :P
And I still can't believe you think Sage look great because they gave him "Gimmy" plays to run against crappy teams in pre-season.

The irony of it all.

On a side note, I can't wait for my beers..... :laugh:

What do you think Jackson's stats in '08 were? Trick plays and individual effort? ROFLMFAO!!! Jackson's stats were padded by come backs and short dump offs. It's about all he throws consistently. And while I have seen him throw some beautiful long balls, his accuracy is a WELL DOCUMENTED issue.

So, yeah, Sage looked better. I would have felt more comfortable with Sage.

Caine

Brick
10-15-2010, 02:03 PM
Favre supporters are so funny... "He was good in the past!!!"

Question... how'd he finish in the 2005 season? 2006 season? Saying he can bounce back because he's done it in the past is partly true... but the majority of the past 5 years hasn't been pretty. His QB rating over the past 5 seasons is 83.9... pretty much Jake Delhomme's level.

Yes, last year was fun. I won't deny that. I also won't let that cloud my judgement of what's happening on the field, like some of you are doing.

lol... keep rooting for the name.

BloodyHorns82
10-15-2010, 02:24 PM
Brick wrote:

Favre supporters are so funny... "He was good in the past!!!"

Question... how'd he finish in the 2005 season? 2006 season? Saying he can bounce back because he's done it in the past is partly true... but the majority of the past 5 years hasn't been pretty. His QB rating over the past 5 seasons is 83.9... pretty much Jake Delhomme's level.

Yes, last year was fun. I won't deny that. I also won't let that cloud my judgement of what's happening on the field, like some of you are doing.

lol... keep rooting for the name.

I think you are a little confused on the rooting for the name bit. Many of the current Favre supporters were not very excited at him coming here.

I see a QB who played his ass off for us last year, carried the team on his aging back, felt the wind blow through his graying hairs as his rocket arm launched another ball to Rice for a TD. I see a QB who sparked the entire team last year. I saw a group of players having fun and enjoying playing with a legend. I saw things from a QB that I've never seen before as a Vikings fan.

Is he playing good right now? Nope, he's not. He showed some huge signs of improvement in the last game though.

I don't give a rats ass what name is on the jersey. I just see a QB who has been better for this team than any other in decades and am willing to give him more than 4 games into the season before pulling the plug. Without the benefit of hindsight I believe it is the best move.

If Favre decides to sit out or the coaches decide to bench him for a couple games than Jackson will get a clean slate in my book and I'll be ready to cheer him on (or tear him a new asshole like the Favre haters are now...whichever is more fitting). It is my opinion that we should not bench Favre at this time.

Brick
10-15-2010, 02:34 PM
BloodyHorns82 wrote:

Brick wrote:

Favre supporters are so funny... "He was good in the past!!!"

Question... how'd he finish in the 2005 season? 2006 season? Saying he can bounce back because he's done it in the past is partly true... but the majority of the past 5 years hasn't been pretty. His QB rating over the past 5 seasons is 83.9... pretty much Jake Delhomme's level.

Yes, last year was fun. I won't deny that. I also won't let that cloud my judgement of what's happening on the field, like some of you are doing.

lol... keep rooting for the name.

I think you are a little confused on the rooting for the name bit. Many of the current Favre supporters were not very excited at him coming here.

I see a QB who played his ass off for us last year, carried the team on his aging back, felt the wind blow through his graying hairs as his rocket arm launched another ball to Rice for a TD. I see a QB who sparked the entire team last year. I saw a group of players having fun and enjoying playing with a legend. I saw things from a QB that I've never seen before as a Vikings fan.

Is he playing good right now? Nope, he's not. He showed some huge signs of improvement in the last game though.

I don't give a rats ass what name is on the jersey. I just see a QB who has been better for this team than any other in decades and am willing to give him more than 4 games into the season before pulling the plug. Without the benefit of hindsight I believe it is the best move.

If Favre decides to sit out or the coaches decide to bench him for a couple games than Jackson will get a clean slate in my book and I'll be ready to cheer him on (or tear him a new asshole like the Favre haters are now...whichever is more fitting). It is my opinion that we should not bench Favre at this time.

Whether or not you realize it, it's rooting for the name "Favre".

The same people saying Favre should stay in are the ones saying Jackson should have been benched after two games... despite actually playing better than Favre through two games.

I actually agree that Favre should stay in one more week, no arguments here. Just another week to prove me more right. I just don't believe he'll improve much. The man wanted to retire, he's 41 and playing like it. So far, he's on pace for his worse season ever.

BloodyHorns82
10-15-2010, 02:57 PM
Brick wrote:

BloodyHorns82 wrote:

Brick wrote:

Favre supporters are so funny... "He was good in the past!!!"

Question... how'd he finish in the 2005 season? 2006 season? Saying he can bounce back because he's done it in the past is partly true... but the majority of the past 5 years hasn't been pretty. His QB rating over the past 5 seasons is 83.9... pretty much Jake Delhomme's level.

Yes, last year was fun. I won't deny that. I also won't let that cloud my judgement of what's happening on the field, like some of you are doing.

lol... keep rooting for the name.

I think you are a little confused on the rooting for the name bit. Many of the current Favre supporters were not very excited at him coming here.

I see a QB who played his ass off for us last year, carried the team on his aging back, felt the wind blow through his graying hairs as his rocket arm launched another ball to Rice for a TD. I see a QB who sparked the entire team last year. I saw a group of players having fun and enjoying playing with a legend. I saw things from a QB that I've never seen before as a Vikings fan.

Is he playing good right now? Nope, he's not. He showed some huge signs of improvement in the last game though.

I don't give a rats ass what name is on the jersey. I just see a QB who has been better for this team than any other in decades and am willing to give him more than 4 games into the season before pulling the plug. Without the benefit of hindsight I believe it is the best move.

If Favre decides to sit out or the coaches decide to bench him for a couple games than Jackson will get a clean slate in my book and I'll be ready to cheer him on (or tear him a new asshole like the Favre haters are now...whichever is more fitting). It is my opinion that we should not bench Favre at this time.

Whether or not you realize it, it's rooting for the name "Favre".

The same people saying Favre should stay in are the ones saying Jackson should have been benched after two games... despite actually playing better than Favre through two games.

I actually agree that Favre should stay in one more week, no arguments here. Just another week to prove me more right. I just don't believe he'll improve much. The man wanted to retire, he's 41 and playing like it. So far, he's on pace for his worse season ever.

See that is where you are wrong...I was not happy at all when they pulled Jackson after two starts for Gus. 2 starts is not enough time to gauge the performance of a QB especially against two solid teams, one of which was played on the road. I spent 10 hours in a car, $100's on a ticket, ect. to watch Jackson suck tit in Lamblow and I still was upset that they benched him after two lousy games.

Obviously I don't speak for everybody, and perhaps there were some calling for Jackson after two games...that said I don't recall anybody calling for his head. IN fact I remember the move really surprising most of the fanbase.

But it's not fair or accurate to make a blanket statement like
The same people saying Favre should stay in are the ones saying Jackson should have been benched after two games...

Caine
10-21-2010, 01:09 PM
Brick wrote:

BloodyHorns82 wrote:

Brick wrote:

Favre supporters are so funny... "He was good in the past!!!"

Question... how'd he finish in the 2005 season? 2006 season? Saying he can bounce back because he's done it in the past is partly true... but the majority of the past 5 years hasn't been pretty. His QB rating over the past 5 seasons is 83.9... pretty much Jake Delhomme's level.

Yes, last year was fun. I won't deny that. I also won't let that cloud my judgement of what's happening on the field, like some of you are doing.

lol... keep rooting for the name.

I think you are a little confused on the rooting for the name bit. Many of the current Favre supporters were not very excited at him coming here.

I see a QB who played his ass off for us last year, carried the team on his aging back, felt the wind blow through his graying hairs as his rocket arm launched another ball to Rice for a TD. I see a QB who sparked the entire team last year. I saw a group of players having fun and enjoying playing with a legend. I saw things from a QB that I've never seen before as a Vikings fan.

Is he playing good right now? Nope, he's not. He showed some huge signs of improvement in the last game though.

I don't give a rats ass what name is on the jersey. I just see a QB who has been better for this team than any other in decades and am willing to give him more than 4 games into the season before pulling the plug. Without the benefit of hindsight I believe it is the best move.

If Favre decides to sit out or the coaches decide to bench him for a couple games than Jackson will get a clean slate in my book and I'll be ready to cheer him on (or tear him a new asshole like the Favre haters are now...whichever is more fitting). It is my opinion that we should not bench Favre at this time.

Whether or not you realize it, it's rooting for the name "Favre".

The same people saying Favre should stay in are the ones saying Jackson should have been benched after two games... despite actually playing better than Favre through two games.

I actually agree that Favre should stay in one more week, no arguments here. Just another week to prove me more right. I just don't believe he'll improve much. The man wanted to retire, he's 41 and playing like it. So far, he's on pace for his worse season ever.

How did that prediction of yours work out?

Caine

Brick
10-21-2010, 01:18 PM
Caine wrote:

Brick wrote:

BloodyHorns82 wrote:

Brick wrote:

Favre supporters are so funny... "He was good in the past!!!"

Question... how'd he finish in the 2005 season? 2006 season? Saying he can bounce back because he's done it in the past is partly true... but the majority of the past 5 years hasn't been pretty. His QB rating over the past 5 seasons is 83.9... pretty much Jake Delhomme's level.

Yes, last year was fun. I won't deny that. I also won't let that cloud my judgement of what's happening on the field, like some of you are doing.

lol... keep rooting for the name.

I think you are a little confused on the rooting for the name bit. Many of the current Favre supporters were not very excited at him coming here.

I see a QB who played his ass off for us last year, carried the team on his aging back, felt the wind blow through his graying hairs as his rocket arm launched another ball to Rice for a TD. I see a QB who sparked the entire team last year. I saw a group of players having fun and enjoying playing with a legend. I saw things from a QB that I've never seen before as a Vikings fan.

Is he playing good right now? Nope, he's not. He showed some huge signs of improvement in the last game though.

I don't give a rats ass what name is on the jersey. I just see a QB who has been better for this team than any other in decades and am willing to give him more than 4 games into the season before pulling the plug. Without the benefit of hindsight I believe it is the best move.

If Favre decides to sit out or the coaches decide to bench him for a couple games than Jackson will get a clean slate in my book and I'll be ready to cheer him on (or tear him a new asshole like the Favre haters are now...whichever is more fitting). It is my opinion that we should not bench Favre at this time.

Whether or not you realize it, it's rooting for the name "Favre".

The same people saying Favre should stay in are the ones saying Jackson should have been benched after two games... despite actually playing better than Favre through two games.

I actually agree that Favre should stay in one more week, no arguments here. Just another week to prove me more right. I just don't believe he'll improve much. The man wanted to retire, he's 41 and playing like it. So far, he's on pace for his worse season ever.

How did that prediction of yours work out?

Caine

If you think Favre's performance on Sunday was good, you're never allowed to ever say anything bad about Jackson's performances again. 118 yards? 1 TD? He certainly didn't prove me wrong.

Guessing you didn't even watch the game.

VikingMike
12-16-2010, 04:21 PM
Guess it's time for TJack to panic. Looks like his stay in MN is over.


Adam Schefter Twitter: "Vikings QB Tarvaris Jackson goes on IR, not Brett Favre. Season over. Joe Webb looking like Monday night starter for Vikings."

jargomcfargo
12-16-2010, 04:39 PM
Guess it's time for TJack to panic. Looks like his stay in MN is over.


Adam Schefter Twitter: "Vikings QB Tarvaris Jackson goes on IR, not Brett Favre. Season over. Joe Webb looking like Monday night starter for Vikings."

Well, potential ironman threat, Tarvaris Jackson, goes down fighting once again.
His routine of getting injured shortly after getting some playing time, has kept him in the NFL for a full 5 years and has made him a millionare.

Since he has never played long enough to realize his full potential, he's hoping to catch on with another team and parlay this back up gig into another 5 years before his scam is discovered.

Since his likely return to te Vikings is in doubt, PP.O posters will be launching themselves out of skyscraper windows, mourning the loss of the endless debate; TJ is better than _______. You fill in the blank.

gregair13
12-16-2010, 05:12 PM
Its past the point of panic now. Its just hopeless.

Purple Mk1
12-16-2010, 05:20 PM
Guess it's time for TJack to panic. Looks like his stay in MN is over.


Adam Schefter Twitter: "Vikings QB Tarvaris Jackson goes on IR, not Brett Favre. Season over. Joe Webb looking like Monday night starter for Vikings."

Well, potential ironman threat, Tarvaris Jackson, goes down fighting once again.
His routine of getting injured shortly after getting some playing time, has kept him in the NFL for a full 5 years and has made him a millionare.

Since he has never played long enough to realize his full potential, he's hoping to catch on with another team and parlay this back up gig into another 5 years before his scam is discovered.

Since his likely return to te Vikings is in doubt, PP.O posters will be launching themselves out of skyscraper windows, mourning the loss of the endless debate; TJ is better than _______. You fill in the blank.


That's hilarious! :laugh: I'll play - Joe Montana.

Here's why: he's younger (Joe is 54 - TWICE TJack's age), he's more mobile (Joe doesn't get around as well as he used to), has a stronger arm, shows complete focus on only 1 receiver in passing situations, and has that awesome jump pass. Of course he can't read an NFL defense and makes terrible choices with the ball, and sure, Montana won the Superbowl in his 1st full season as a starter, but TJack just needs a little more time. I'm sure we'd all agree that he just hasn't been given enough opportunities in his 5 years in the NFL to show how much better than Montana he really is. :laugh:

I know this sounds ridiculous - its about as ridiculous as saying he is a better QB than Favre, but there are a lot of people here that have been saying that for some time. :whistle:

On second thought, if they are just going to sign guys off the street to start versus the Bears at their 50th anniversary celebration game, I wonder if Montana is available.

marstc09
12-16-2010, 05:23 PM
Mr Anderson wrote:

NodakPaul wrote:

idahovikefan7 wrote:

Awesome! just hope he's not referring to himself as one of the proven "leader/winners".....

It is a fairly mature blog. If TJack shows this kind of confidence in the locker room and huddle, then he could very well be evolving into a leader.
For sure.

I'm impressed by him, I always have been impressed by his behavior and composure off the field. The way he's handled the whole Favre situation, the way he handled being benched in 07/08. Hopefully his football mind has caught up with his personality.

He has the physical tools, the attitude, now all he needs is the complete mental grasp and composure and we're looking at a hell of a player.

Like I said, I hope those things have caught up, cause Favre is looking pretty beat up.


And to be on topic: He's right. We shouldn't panic. The team shouldn't panic. It's not unrealistic to win 2 of our next 4, 3 of our next 5. That makes us 5-5 at week 10.

Going on the premise that they are a real NFL organization and can really judge talent, they have kept TJ around for a reason.

For me, its because he is ready.


I guess he just needs more time. LOL

El Vikingo
12-16-2010, 05:28 PM
I been a TJ hater since day one but somehow I feel bad for the kid nowadays,it must the X-Mas spiriti or something I dont know

#4kicksA$$
12-16-2010, 05:44 PM
Kinda curious where all the Favre hating Tjoke strokers are now?

slavinator
12-16-2010, 06:15 PM
Kinda curious where all the Favre hating Tjoke strokers are now?

They went on the IR too.

12purplepride28
12-16-2010, 06:58 PM
I been a TJ hater since day one but somehow I feel bad for the kid nowadays,it must the X-Mas spiriti or something I dont know

Me too. I've never hated the guy but I hate his play and the fact that he's on our team. He's done everything right from an attitude perspective, but he just sucks.

i_bleed_purple
12-16-2010, 07:42 PM
Guess it's time for TJack to panic. Looks like his stay in MN is over.


Adam Schefter Twitter: "Vikings QB Tarvaris Jackson goes on IR, not Brett Favre. Season over. Joe Webb looking like Monday night starter for Vikings."

Well, potential ironman threat, Tarvaris Jackson, goes down fighting once again.
His routine of getting injured shortly after getting some playing time, has kept him in the NFL for a full 5 years and has made him a millionare.

Since he has never played long enough to realize his full potential, he's hoping to catch on with another team and parlay this back up gig into another 5 years before his scam is discovered.

Since his likely return to te Vikings is in doubt, PP.O posters will be launching themselves out of skyscraper windows, mourning the loss of the endless debate; TJ is better than _______. You fill in the blank.


That's hilarious! :laugh: I'll play - Joe Montana.

Here's why: he's younger (Joe is 54 - TWICE TJack's age), he's more mobile (Joe doesn't get around as well as he used to), has a stronger arm, shows complete focus on only 1 receiver in passing situations, and has that awesome jump pass. Of course he can't read an NFL defense and makes terrible choices with the ball, and sure, Montana won the Superbowl in his 1st full season as a starter, but TJack just needs a little more time. I'm sure we'd all agree that he just hasn't been given enough opportunities in his 5 years in the NFL to show how much better than Montana he really is. :laugh:

I know this sounds ridiculous - its about as ridiculous as saying he is a better QB than Favre, but there are a lot of people here that have been saying that for some time. :whistle:

On second thought, if they are just going to sign guys off the street to start versus the Bears at their 50th anniversary celebration game, I wonder if Montana is available.

well he has been working out with those Sketchers shoe commercials! He can throw a bomb!

Purple Floyd
12-17-2010, 04:20 AM
Mr Anderson wrote:

NodakPaul wrote:

idahovikefan7 wrote:

Awesome! just hope he's not referring to himself as one of the proven "leader/winners".....

It is a fairly mature blog. If TJack shows this kind of confidence in the locker room and huddle, then he could very well be evolving into a leader.
For sure.

I'm impressed by him, I always have been impressed by his behavior and composure off the field. The way he's handled the whole Favre situation, the way he handled being benched in 07/08. Hopefully his football mind has caught up with his personality.

He has the physical tools, the attitude, now all he needs is the complete mental grasp and composure and we're looking at a hell of a player.

Like I said, I hope those things have caught up, cause Favre is looking pretty beat up.


And to be on topic: He's right. We shouldn't panic. The team shouldn't panic. It's not unrealistic to win 2 of our next 4, 3 of our next 5. That makes us 5-5 at week 10.
I know some on here don't believe it, however, I believe we have a real NFL organization that is pretty good about getting and putting quality players on the field.

Going on the premise that they are a real NFL organization and can really judge talent, they have kept TJ around for a reason.

For me, its because he is ready.

Did he struggle early in his career? Sure, but hell, look around the league, all of them do. Its the nature of the game.

My guess, we will see ole TJ for a rep or two (actually predicting 5) against the Cowgirls this weekend. ;)


LMAO.

You really were really hitting on all cylinders with those astute observations. It really sucks when your words come back and bite you in the arse lol